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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Ending engagement

93 replies

SoonTwoBeOne · 05/01/2019 22:01

I’m due to be married in 3 weeks. We are in the midst of a huge row (we never normally row) and I’m questioning whether to end it. I’m a bit terrified of asking on here as the normal response is LTB and that is easier said than done.
Long but don’t want to drip feed.

He has been moody for a few weeks; nothing major but just not his normal kind, thoughtful self. I think we’ve both felt stressed. Over Christmas I found myself irritated with him but we are talking petty stuff.

He angrily told my 16 yr old to Fuck off last night, without warning and after a silly sulky teen comment. We do not swear in front of her, I don’t think flying off the handle is an appropriate adult response. So I said there’s no need for that. She held back tears. I took dogs out and she came with me. Normally I’d go with him and she’d stay home so I imagine he felt slighted. My view on that is that she needed me to talk to her as she was upset ...more than he did. I have to choose one and it was the child. He then ignored us all evening.

I was in an abusive marriage and my ex used to have a quick temper and I was usually trying to prevent him going for my DC by constantly appeasing. Eldest DC (now an adult) is quite anxious as a consequence and I blame myself for not leaving sooner. This is obviously influencing my reaction to last night. He knows this.

I went to bed early and didn’t say goodnight. Again not normal behaviour and he’s taken a real insult from this and apparently is the cause of his behaviour today. So he gets up and leaves quietly at 8ish and goes to work. He has a casual part-time job, chooses his own hours and never works on a Saturday. I was dozing as I’d been awake in the night (a lot). During the day I texted him to ask if he would be coming to a planned evening with friends tonight. He said no...accompanied by several childish petty comments. I said I’d cancel (can hardly go on my own without explaining his absence or lying) we need to talk, when are you free. Ignores me. He stays out until 5ish and as soon as he comes in collects the dog, ignores me and goes out to walk him. I intercept at front door and say the adult way to deal is to talk. He says he’s been at work! I say don’t play games as we both know he doesn’t normally work or come in and go straight out. When he comes back much later I suggest we go out to talk (for privacy from DD) and said we need to behave like adults. He says he will but only if I’m ready to talk sensibly. I said I was ready to talk sensibly earlier and he said it was better if he didn’t because he wasn’t ready. All of this is said angrily. He then makes no move to go and talk. I’ve asked him to three or four times at this point and am not going to ask again. He goes to bed at 8:30.

Eventually I go in as light is on and ask him how long this will continue for. He is so so angry and said it’s up to me. He says he reserves the right to tell DD to fuck off as she is only 16 and is a liar. She’s not. It was a silly teenage exaggeration of what he said. I.e he said you’ll get fat if you eat that and she said he implied I was fat Being fat is a big issue and worry for her.

The prelude to the argument is petty. It’s the result and reaction that is frightening me. I’m determined to not be appeasing apologetic abused wife again so I’m standing my ground about him shouting at DD with no justifiable reason. I am however trying to instigate conversation. He’s not budging. Impasse.

It’s left with him telling me if I want to press the nuclear button (no wedding) I’d better think carefully as there will be no coming back. Tbh that’s fine by me because if I say that... I agree there is no coming back.

The background picture here is money. I work full time in a very good job and own the house we live in. He pays half of the bills but it took several months for him to start doing that. He does pay for other stuff and isn’t a penny pincher but nonetheless he’s getting £1200 rent from his place of which I see nothing. However I don’t want to share the mortgage or ownership of this property as it is my security. So I don’t really want contributions to the mortgage. If we split he has nowhere to go until tenants are moved on. He will also lose that money which he relies on.

The wedding has been paid for on credit card in my name purely because only one person could be on the application. The idea that I carry all the debt sits uncomfortably with me. I’m very good with money. He is less so but is also very comfortable with a good pension £1200 a month, rent income and also part-time earnings. I suspect he earns as much as me but doesn’t have a mortgage of £1000 a month to pay. He has a mortgage on his house but is only paying interest. In 6-7 yrs he has to rely on selling to pay it off or inheritance (it’s very likely he’ll do both easily but again this bothers me as I forward plan really carefully). He does voluntarily pay for a lot of things like social tickets, treats, meals etc.

We have been really happy, we like the same hobbies however he hasn’t engaged as much lately seeming to be tired. I really don’t know whether I should go through with the wedding. Pre-wedding jitters or red flags?

OP posts:
MaeveDidIt · 06/01/2019 10:52

"He says he reserves the right to tell DD to fuck-off as she is only 16 and is a liar."

There you have it - he should have apologised and been very ashamed, Not said he has the RIGHT to tell her to fuck-off.

This will get worse - he is a bad one, plus he will take you for half your house if you divorce.

Do not get married he honestly sounds like a prick.

He's obviously not very financially savvy either! Why when the interest rate has been so low for over 10 years has he got an interest free mortgage?!!

ISdads · 06/01/2019 10:57

Prenups are considered valid these days

We are focussing.on.finances as it is blindingly obvious you are walking into potential financial disaster by getting married - all your assets become joint assets the minute you sign. Unless you rewrite your will after marriage, it all goes to him not your kids as well. Why marry if financial independence is important to you? Why marry a man who leaches financially off you if financial independence is important to you?

There is no need to tell anyone why you changed your mind - just chill on the marriage, delay, see how you feel, if you prefer. Your daughter need never know/feel tesponsible

Luckingfovely · 06/01/2019 11:01

Another thought... in your op, he said that it was up to you to press the nuclear button if you wanted to.

That suggests to me that he has got cold feet and doesn't want to go through with the wedding... and is playing up to put you in a position where you have to end it.

Sorry.

explodingkitten · 06/01/2019 11:16

I could get over the fuck off comment if he then behaved as an adult that evening, told her that he lost his temper, apologised and promissed to work on himself so it wouldn't happen again. I would have a major issue with the fact that he won't even discuss what happened in a normal and adult way. I don't think that you should be in a relationship with someone you can't have a discussion with.

Regarding the wedding, it's way easier to cancel it than divorce after six months. You don't look daft cancelling a wedding.

Bufferingkisses · 06/01/2019 11:41

You've been together 7 years and this is the first time he's been anything less than loving and supportive of both you and your dd? Through all those teen years, early days, getting to know each other etc?

Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. It sounds like this is totally out of character, not just the comment but also the reaction afterwards. MN is a big believer in ltb at the first sign of anything less than perfect behaviour from any man. If a woman had posted saying they did this it would have been "you're clearly stressed, you need support not blame, why would you be with someone prepared to leave you after one single transgression" yadda yadda.

Take a bit of time and talk when everyone is calmer.

JohnMcCainsDeathStare · 06/01/2019 12:57

I wonder if the mask is slipping if so 7 years is a long time but the financial lack of transparency would be a BIG red flag. I think he has cold feet but being with you makes his life easier so he'd marry you even if he doesn't love you.

Those are my thoughts on this - I think he is subconsiously trying to get dumped.

HollowTalk · 06/01/2019 13:48

MN is a big believer in ltb at the first sign of anything less than perfect behaviour from any man.

This is absolutely not true. Please can you give some examples? The only time I've seen LTB is when there is sexual, physical, emotional or financial abuse.

Graphista · 06/01/2019 14:26

You seem to be under the impression that his not paying anything towards your house means he'd have no claim on it, but if you marry he well could have a claim. Have you not sought advice on this? - that alone is worth postponing for because it sounds like you're ill informed.

It sounds like pre-wedding jitters to me as if all the rest on the money side bothered you properly it would have bothered you before now.

Personally I think you're naive to think swearing in front of/at a 16 year old is a big deal. They get far worse at school and they're nearly adults, I'd be concerned that a 16 year old who couldn't cope with swearing wasn't resilient enough at life generally. Ditto the weight comment unless there's an actual ED at play an apology would be fine. But yes I do think he should apologise to her and it should happen without prompting.

I think you are possibly over observant of possible red flags having been in an abusive relationship before. That's not his fault.

I'm not even sure it's anger he's feeling I suspect he's feeling hurt and rejected.

I think you need to talk - very honestly.

Bufferingkisses · 06/01/2019 14:42

Hollowtalk, it is absolutely true. Examples a plenty on almost every thread in relationships plus plenty across the other boards. I'm not messing about posting links, it would take me all day.

I think MN is fantastic but ltb is a go to position here, no need to get defensive.

willyloman · 06/01/2019 14:45

He's trying to get you to cancel wedding so he doesn't have to be the bad guy.Do you really want to spend your life pandering to emotional blackmail and putting up with rude behaviour? Keep your finances separate and tell him to move out. Don't you want to live with someone who likes and respects you?

HollowTalk · 06/01/2019 14:45

I'm not being defensive. I've just seen so many depressing threads on here where the OP is being treated so badly and posters tell her to get out. There is often a lone voice (maybe yours?) telling her to give her abusive partner another chance.

willyloman · 06/01/2019 14:47

I don't normally suggest ltb. It's not the initial swearing/fight that bothers me. It's the dragging it out and being unable to apologise/resolve/talk it through. And yes. A spouse is entitled to 50% of assets.

deadliftgirl · 06/01/2019 15:01

Hi @SoonTwoBeOne

Hello, I am a newly married women and I can give some advice on this issue as I had semi-similar problems with my husband on the run up to our wedding.

First of all, as much as the first few responses (all I read) mean well, please ignore the leave him, run for the hills comments! The problem with this website is that you ask for help on a very personal problem and you get flooded with replies from people that you do not know from Adam. You do not know if they are married and have experienced the challenges of planning a wedding and how this impacts you as a couple right before the big day.

As far as your fiancee attitude towards you and your daughter is, well its wrong! However, right before a wedding is about to take place is the most stressful and trying time for anyone getting married. When I got married last summer, my husband was always moaning and being really hard to life with at a time. However, he was only being human as he was stressed with everything about the wedding, all the things we had to deal with and pay for it. It really was a lot!!

You really need to calmly sit down and ask your partner what is troubling him. Ask him what you can do to make him feel better? Tell him that you love him and would never want to see him in pain but that you are also upset by the way he is speaking to your daughter and yourself. Assure him that you can see he obviously is very frustrated and angry but you cannot fix anything or resolve anything if you both do not calm down and talk like adults.

If these fights has only occurred recently then I would definitely put it down to wedding stress but if they have been going on beyond when you got engaged or planned your wedding then you may have deeper issues to deal with.

One thing that really concerned me from what you said in your original post is that you do not want to jointly own the house you all life in because thats your security. I understand because of your previous relationship why you say that but this man is about to become your husband. You should not start a marriage thinking you need security incase something goes wrong? You both are about to become one (much like your username) and you should share all of these things. It also does not sound like is contributing much financially at home but it also may be because his name is not on the property. I would not want to pay towards a house I did not own but lived in.

If you haven't already, just get a time when everyone is out of the house apart from you both and sit down and be as none-emotional as possible. You really need to be calm, listen to him, let him speak and try to address his concerns. Most times men like to cut women off and do not let them talk so make sure he understands that he also needs to discuss your needs.

Hun, even when your married, couples fight, have problems and you need to work through that. When he is falling and seems down you should pick him up and vice versa. Be there for him but also make sure he knows that he has to be nicer and more respectable to your daughter.

I wish you the best of luck and a happy wedding day when it comes.

HouseworkIsASin10 · 06/01/2019 15:33

deadliftgirl what a load of bollocks 'hun'

HouseworkIsASin10 · 06/01/2019 15:37

OP it is not up to you to pussyfoot around him and 'help him feel better'.

If this is so out of character he would have apologised by now.

As he hasn't then this is actually what he really feels about your DD.

Do not marry him.

tubspreciousthings · 06/01/2019 15:38

I second @HouseworkIsASin10

HouseworkIsASin10 · 06/01/2019 15:41

Regarding pre-nups, you can actually take a will out with a clause regarding your impending marriage.

You just document that your will and wishes remain the same even once you are married to 'husband name'.

safetyfreak · 06/01/2019 16:01

Ehh I see lots of red flags here, especially finicially.

The way he talked to and about your daughter is unforgivable. You have tried to talk to him and have got nothing back but the silent treatment and justification for his comment.

I wonder if he is getting cold feet and trying to self sabotage the wedding? Strange how this is only coming up now. Something to think about.

Carouselfish · 06/01/2019 16:07

One seemingly minor comment you made stood out to me - that you took your daughter on the dog walk and not him and thought that equated to a 'slight' to him. Sounds like you're walking on eggshells of not offending this manchild and it's so ingrained you don't even notice that's an odd thing to say. An adult shouldn't get huffy or feel hurt that you walked the dog with your daughter when she was upset FFS.

Lamenameagain · 06/01/2019 16:10

I presume from what you've written that your daughter is close to your partner and possibly see's him as a father figure to her so it's going to be very hard for her if you decide to end your relationship based on him telling her to fuck off.

I don't think one incident of anger means that someone is a bad person and I think he is behaving the way he is now because he feels ashamed and unable to make things better.

I think you should give him the benefit of the doubt about this as it's uncharacteristic.

LaughingCow99 · 06/01/2019 16:31

I'm sorry, but leaving him for one fuck off in 7 years! That's ridiculous to me. We can all lose our temper and swear. I'd say once in 7 years is not bad. Shouldn't have happened but we all make mistakes.

It seems as if this is more than just the swearing. Something is happening with him.

He sounds a little stingy if he is just paying towards some bills. That would bother me. I know you don't want him to contribute to your mortgage, but he should be paying more towards the wedding.

I'd postpone bthe wedding. Maybe consider couple counselling

Bufferingkisses · 06/01/2019 18:11

Hollowtalk, is there a particular reason you are being shitty with me?

HollowTalk · 06/01/2019 18:17

Of course not. I don't know who you are and haven't noticed your username before, but you said the go to position on here was LTB and I said I'd only noticed it when there was abuse.

NotANotMan · 06/01/2019 18:32

I don't see the financials as such an issue if you both have assets and decent income. But the fact that a) he said that to your DD and b) he said he has the right to say it (so he will do it again) is unforgivable.

AgentJohnson · 06/01/2019 18:57

He’s enacting a power struggle and although he isn’t talking, he has been crystal clear. He feels he has a right to talk to your DD the way he did, feels you shouldn’t question his behaviour and he’s prepared to wait it out to you back down/ apologise.

Somethings going on and he appears to lack the maturity to deal with it like an adult, instead he’s choosing to be a dick. I don’t know what his end game is but you can’t wait around for him to let you know.

Tell him his options are to talk or leave, sulking he can do in his own time and in his own property.

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