Will a narcissistic man ever change for a female he truly desires?

[Loka123]

I'm sure this question has been done to death on here and all over the internet tbh but just wanted to ask those who have been married or in relationships with a narc male in the past... did you find out he changed at some point once you had broken up and eventually found someone who he, for once, loved more than he loved himself?

I'm referring to textbooks narcs - those who lie, have been unfaithful before, controlling, hypocritical, very very charming to begin with, can become very moody very quickly, devalue and are only happen with the chase, not the catch, not committing to any place, job or person for any longer than a year, getting easily excited by newness (whether it be a job, person or place) but getting as bored and irritated by it just as quickly, blocking all his exes yet reappearing in their lives repeatedly even after insanely long periods of no contact have passed, etc.

Thanks

So do you think narcissists are basically profoundly jealous?

No narcissist are profoundly and deeply insecure, unfulfilled and lost
They just don’t have the emotional insight to put the dots together.

There are all kinds of personality disorders. And it’s very complex. And I think a lot of people are not narcissistic when others label them as so.
They have such a deep sense of shame and lack of self worth they have to get it from others. Which is very sad really.

do you think narcissists are basically profoundly jealous?

Narcissistic personality disorder is complex, and unfortunately can't be summed up so easily. Jealousy can certainly be very present but it isn't the defining characteristic, much less the sole cause.

It's important to distinguish between having Narcissistic personality disorder and "having some narcissistic traits". Almost everyone has what is usually termed a "healthy" level of narcissism - in fact, if you had no narcissistic traits AT ALL you would probably seem quite odd.

As somebody who has been around a lot of cocaine users in her younger days: you’re confusing cause and effect. Coke makes you more self-obsessed and domineering (“coke bores” are a cliche for a reason). If you aren’t like that usually, you sober up and think “God, I was a twat last night. I don’t like the person I turn into on coke”, and stop taking it. Like people who know they are bad drunks usually cut back on drinking, unless they are alcoholics.

Narcs love coke because it makes them more like themselves/gives them the confidence to let their true selves shine out. It may amplify the behaviour, but I don’t think it’s the root cause.

@Sashkin I wasn't "confusing cause and effect" as to me, it's perfectly clear what cause and effect mean. I was just opening the discussion on that the interplay between cocaine use and narcissism can be either i.e. merely speculating as in my experience, I know one narc and he used to have a cocaine habit so from a sample size of 1, I can't tell which came first. You'd need a proper experiment with a much larger sample size to answer it.. it's like the which came first - chicken or egg debate, without proper research. However, from your post and another person's earlier, it does seem to lean strongly to cocaine use appearing after narcissism and so, not likely to be a root cause at all but who really knows for sure is anatomical structural changes in the brain from cocaine use can predispose certain people to elevated narc traits (not in the case of our examples perhaps but doesn't rule it out for every human on earth).

I haven't RTFT but... No no no

A narc will change temporarily until he has snared his victim then he will revert to his true self. A true narcissist is very rare but lots of men have narc tendencies because they are so incredibly selfish and haven’t got the ability to put others before themselves. They are self important with huge egos.

I too have been through the mill with my ex husband who, once he'd left and put the children and I through hell, revealed himself truly to be a narcissist. I was too foolish (or he was too clever) to see what he really was capable of whilst we were married.

I see many of you are wondering, like myself, how their exes are faring with their new partners. I'm 99% certain mine was with his current woman before leaving me but he covered his tracks beautifully. According to my DC she seems like a good sort which I'm glad about. I do wonder if she'll do a better job of holding on to him than I did. I have NO regrets about not being with him any longer but I'm sad our family life was shaken up so much.

One thing I've noticed about my ex is that he's doing the same thing with this woman as he did with me. He soaks up every thing she has to offer as if he he needs to fill a void inside him. If she likes ski-ing he'll take our DC on a ski-ing holiday with her (he never wanted to before as he has knee problems), she likes alternative medicine, he'll make appointments for our children with homeopathists. Similarly the music I loved, he loved, the people I liked, he liked...until he hated everything. In the end he despised and rejected everything I liked. I was to blame for absolutely everything.

I'm slightly fascinated how he's taken on unconditionally his new partner in the sense that he's contradicting his previous convictions.

Thank you for all your replies so far

@gettingstherehopefully Yes I know what you mean. Though what you're describing is VERY characteristic of narcissists.. I've read that they can be chameleons in that they'll mirror whichever woman is their target and so pretend to have the same interests etc. and that's how they superficially create what seems a strong deep bond with their target to fool them into getting trapped and beat the other generic guys competing for the same girl.

Thinking back even my ex narc would do this - I didn't realize it at the time but we had way too many things in common for it to be simply by chance/fate.. a lot of it must have been him studying me carefully and mirroring behaviours, tastes, opinions etc.

There was an example where they said when a narc is targetting a homely girl, he'll be all ready to put on an apron, cook, watch tv with her and then if his next target is an outdoorsy girl, he'll buy some hiking boots and claim he loves the outdoors. Then his next target is an avid book reader so he'll get a library card and read or pretend to become well-read to get here and so on, so what you've described just seems to be further proof he's a narc.

How long were you with him? How long has the new woman been with him?

This site is written by a diagnosed narc. its pretty horrifying

Here is his take on change

narcsite.com/2017/06/20/but-i-can-change/

I think it depends what kind of woman and what kind of relationship.

I was financially dependent on my narc and he was horribly abusive. I left which was a shock to him. He's the same damaged person he always was but now he's in a relationship with a woman who has her own job, transport, no kids and her own home so 1) she doesn't need him, 2) her perceived status is higher in his eyes and 3) even though he 100% hates me and blames me for leaving him, he has learnt/seen that a woman you treat badly will leave you, even a low status one as he saw me. So I wonder if he treats his new gf better. It is possible I guess.

This is a dead end. Logically, the only woman that can truly snare a narc would have little interest in them so anyone that actually wanted to is screwed from the start.

Can I ask a question on this thread?
If there was a narc in your life and you sent them articles/YouTube video links about narcissism and how damaging it is, would they recognise themvs/be motivated to change?

Water never do that. It will make them angry and likely to smear you to everyone before you expose them.
Narcs CANNOT see fault in themselves even if they feign remorse or reflection.
They do not change they just pretend to, because why would you change if youre the best thing ever and superior to others?

Good morning Loka123 Thanks for our reply. I was with my ex husband from 2003 to 2015. I think he's been with his new woman since then. Interestingly she's a child psychologist so one would expect her to be more astute but again this proves how clever he is at concealing his faults.

I've accepted completely that he's moved on (my life is so much more bearable now he's got someone else to focus on) but I will confess that it grates on my nerves how all the things I was 'prohibited' from doing when we were together (yes, really) he allows his new partner to do. I know this because my children chat about the time spent with them both and it comes out in conversation.

And, yes, I do feel sorry for her although my sympathy is lessened by the fact that she willingly went out with my husband when we were still married.

Waterbird, please don't do that! It will serve no purpose at all and you'll provoke a lot of unnecessary anger.

And he will use the knowledge to become a better narcissist. He'll have language. He'll take your words and rearrange them and present them back to you to prove you're the narc. It would be a nightmare. Don't show a narc any information about being a narc.

What you said @gettingtherehopIfully

If she likes ski-ing he'll take our DC on a ski-ing holiday with her (he never wanted to before as he has knee problems)

My ex did this, it’s called ‘mirroring’ my ex never listened to Coldplay, funnily enough their new partner loves Coldplay..now my ex can’t get enough of them.

Same with car racing, never bothered about it..now they travel the country watching it.

New partner vegetarian-my ex now vegetarian

It’s all part of their plan to be the perfect soulmate and to impress their new victims. I actually find it quite funny watching it happen from the outside.

Why do you ask OP?

Are you worried that it is all working out with his current victim and that you were not enough?

Is he back in your head - are you following and obsessing over him and his actions?

Ex is a chameleon. When we got together he liked everything I did. It raised my suspicions to an extent that I held back on topics to check his sincerity (should have dumped then!) however he seemed genuine...I now realise he had studied me. He did the same when he went to a new company, suddenly he was this different person.

I see how Ex is with the Dc, he would say he loves them and certainly tells people, (with tears in his eyes) BUT they don't feel it. He would never consider putting them first as their role is to reflect well on him.

Thanks all for answering my question. That's what I thought.

Thanks for all the insightful posts so far everyone