DH rough with baby DS

[leopardisaneutral]

DS is a twin. He’s 17 weeks old, but was born at 34 weeks. He still weighs less than 10lb. He cries a lot as has bad reflux, but is the sweetest baby. Both babies are good sleepers. DH is still getting his eight hours a night and if they wake it’s my deal anyway as I’m breastfeeding them both. Just mentioning this for context before anyone mentions sleep deprevation!

DH was on night shift last night and came back at 9am and went to bed. Fair enough. I was supposed to be meeting a friend in the afternoon and had asked if he could care for DS as he hates going out in the cold for any length of time. I was taking DT2with me as he’s a bottle refuser so superglued to me.

Babies kept crying every time I tried to get ready, so DH got up about 12.30 so I could get dressed. I gave him DS to hold as he was crying and popped into kitchen. I came back to see DH handling DS in a really inappropriate fashion. He wasn’t quite shaking him but was bouncing him up and down far harder and faster than is safe! I screamed at him to stop and grabbed DS out of his arms. His first reaction was that I was making it up and he’d done nothing wrong. This soon switched to utter hysterics and promised he’ll never do it again. He’s still apologising now.

I just feel numb. I was supposed to be going out with DM tomorrow and leaving DS with him. I’ve told him there’s no way I can do that now. He says he can be trusted, but he’s clearly shown me today that isn’t the case. I don’t know what to do

@timeisnotaline I am really worried about his mental health. He just isn’t coping. I’m going to go back with him to the GPs and sit in the appointment. It’s a bit like being his mum, but I’m concerned he won’t be honest with them otherwise.

Obviously we weren't there and didn't see what happened, but from what you've said, your dh had three hours sleep after a night shift and has recently started taking antidepressants, and was trying to manage a crying baby. He made a serious error of judgement. However, those are pretty challenging conditions and if anyone is going to make an error of judgement, those are the kind of circumstances where it could happen so easily.

That's worth re-reading; OP.

What to do now is a tough call. I think I'd be tempted to call my mum (if I had one, and she was supportive, which it sounds like yours is) and tell her that DH is really, really struggling and doesn't feel safe around the children. I'd ask if she would help.

I'd then make sure that DH had no unsupervised contact with the babies. Not no contact at all; I don't think, because that will affect bonds, but I'd make sure I was properly concentrating on him and the babies when they are together. Like you would with a small child; I guess.

And I would take DH to his GP. Take a baby or both; if you need to, but you need to be there if he'll let you to make sure he's being honest. If it's impossible for you to be there; I'd ask him to give the doctor permission to talk to you, so you can let them know how bad things are - but again; it would be more effective to be there together. It's easy for things to be forgotten otherwise.

Can you afford for DH to be off sick for a while and try and recover? It sounds like his health is deteriorating quickly and night shifts aren't likely to be helping with that. If you can; I'd be looking at potentially getting him signed off and involved in some more intensive treatment. Does he get an medical cover through work? Could you afford a private appointment?

You have to protect your babies first and foremost; absolutely, and you need to be certain they are safe with whoever you leave them with. Unfortunately, he can't be trusted to keep them safe right now, he's not quite capable. But that means that he's likely to be very poorly himself; so I'd try and get him help quickly too. He sounds like he's balancing on a knife edge. Depression can be an awful thing.

I'm sorry that this has happened. Could friend come round to you later? Different type of evening to what you'd planned; but it might be the best you can do right now.

@AnchorDownDeepBreath

He won’t want me to tell my mum, but I’m going to have to. I’m also considering speaking to his dad and his wife. They are lovely people and I really think we need their support. Unfortunately they live in a different part of country to us.

The friend I was supposed to be meeting is a mutual friend. I told him why I had to cancel. He was very shocked but is going to try and arrange to see DH this week,

Unfortunately time off is not an option. He’s just started the job. We can’t afford private care. Ironically because all our savings went on ivf to have these babies in the first place!

I’m swinging between sympathy and anger right now. I’m on ADs as well and my life isn’t exactly a cake walk. I don’t take it out on my precious babies though!

What kind of antidepressant is he taking OP? Sorry if you’ve already mentioned and I missed it. I only ask because when I had PND with my second, I was given something that affected me very badly indeed. I couldn’t believe how much worse I felt, almost immediately - I’m such a patient person normally but felt so, so angry and all my patience vanished. It was absolutely terrifying and I had to stop them after a week! There was one evening when DD had cried for almost an hour (very colicky baby) and I just felt rage rising. I’ve never felt like that before or since. I had to put her in her cot and leave her - I was so frightened of how I felt in that moment. I stopped taking the tablets and the calm descended. The anger just evaporated.

Anyway I suppose what I’m trying to say is that perhaps he needs to change medication - they affect us all in different ways, what didn’t work for me may work for someone else - and needs to pay a lot more attention to his mental health.

I wouldn’t want to leave him alone with the babies for the time being, until he gets himself back on track and feeling a bit better. They’re the most important people in this situation after all. My husband had every sympathy for what I was feeling, but had to make sure the baby was safe with me. He was always around, not always obviously, just pottering in the background, but I agreed wholeheartedly with him doing so, because we were working towards the same goal, making sure the baby was safe until I felt better.

Congratulations btw!

I think from the threads on here about mothers losing it for a split second and throwing their baby down on the bed etc, not one of them was told not to have unsupervised contact with their child... You said yourself, he was hysterically apologetic.

If you tell your HV, she will refer to SS and potentially the baby could get taken in to care whilst this is being investigated (happen to someone I know)

You've said the babies love him and feel settled with him so its unlikely this is an ongoing thing. If you don't trust him to be around his children after this one incident, then I think there is a back story.

Well it is helpful. If SS are involved then your children could be put on a child protection plan, your husband forced to move out and if you consider getting back with him you could lose your children.

OP, can I ask why you’re telling people who wont be able to offer any practical support? I would have felt even worse if my DH had told everyone how badly I was coping. It wouldn’t have helped, I would have felt useless and humiliated, as though everyone felt I was a untrustworthy monster. And I wasn’t! I just needed some time to sort myself out

@NotScrewingUpNow that’s fine if the HV does that, it’s her job to do that. But that means that the OP will get a review and they will have seen she has kept her babies safe by telling her HV first thing and that is all they will be worried out. They would be more concerned and involved if she hid it. The only outcome would be possibly her DH getting some help. So it’s a good thing.

OP, well done on contacting your health visitor this morning and letting them know

That’s helpful @NotScrewingUpNow**

No, it's not particularly, especially as just a statement and nothing more.

It is possible they will contact SS, however, they will all do everything that is best for the safety of your DS. Covering this up is not in anyone's interests, least of all the baby, he has to come first in all of this.

OP, I'm glad to hear you have your mother's support. You can't shoulder everything alone, especially with two babies and now you feel worried about relying on your DH. You'll need back up and support and as many hands on deck as possible. Hiding away will only make it that much worse, and add more tension for you both.

Is DS OK today? How are you feeling too? This is all a lot for you to have to cope with.

Please don’t back away from telling your HV. I know it is a huge and frightening big decision, and my guess is that SS will be involved. But remember, SS are there to protect vulnerable people AND support families. Any family intervention will probably involve ensuring DH gets the mental health support he clearly needs.
I have personal experience of this. My colleague’s niece was a perfectly healthy baby girl, her dad shook her when she wouldn’t stop crying and caused life changing injuries. She was cared for as a baby by the family, dad was jailed, but her needs were too great as she grew. She is blind and very severely disabled. She is now a young woman and remains and will remain in 24 hour specialist care. It takes a minute.
Dad was not estranged and had no previous record of violent behaviour. He was released a few years ago.
It’s the most horrific thing I know. 💐

Notscrewingupnow?

So what do you suggest? The OP cover this up and bear this all alone, and potentially run herself ragged until she collapses with exhaustion by looking after twins all alone?
Then the OH snaps and does the baby damage?

Honestly, it's imperative the OP gets the proper support she needs ASAP. This isn't something that can be brushed away.

TBH I believe the baby should be looked at, he may seem fine but there could be some damage that may not be noticeable right now.

Sorry, I meant it might not be noticeable to an untrained eye.

Op I have had this on my mind since first reading and I have Re read your first post. Was he bouncing the baby on his knee? If you say you are confident the baby wasn't hurt or potentially hurt, then how can you say he's done anything wrong? Could you possibly, in your sleep deprived state and panic of rushing around to get ready, have overreacted? I have been a new mum several times and the hormones flying about did make me crazy over protective mum every time. I am not in any way minimising this situation, only you know what you saw, I am just saying, think about it all once you've calmed down, replay the situation in your head and decide what you think was going on before you tell your mum, and the hv, as this could be life changing for you all. If you still decide he has done something dreadful then I'd possibly ask him to leave temporarily rather than involving hv etc. I really don't know, but I just think if you've over reacted (not saying you have!) then you might regret blowing the whole thing out of proportion.

If you decide its serious enough to involve your hv then you definitely need to take baby to a&e to be checked. Asap.

I really don't know, but I just think if you've over reacted

Someone who wasn't there minimising it and trying to convince OP to cover it all up. How helpful is this? Really?

Today, she has distance from it and is still angry. He even broke down and apologised for it, so he felt he had done wrong too.

Please, children's lives depend on the correct course of action now, to try to minimise it does a disservice to all involved.

Hold your horses Beth, she's said the baby is definitely OK, her dh was bouncing the baby not shaking him, has he done anything wrong? Only she knows! I have not minimised anything.

Anything like this triggers an automatic referral to social services. It wouldn’t even be an individual decision point, because it involves a baby under 12months old.

But that doesn’t mean it would be a bad thing. It might be a very good thing, especially if there’s any tendency of your partner to try and minimise what he’s done.

Because minimising = denial & defensiveness = if nothing bad happened then nothing needs to change, so the person is very resistant to any suggestion of change as that threatens the whole pretence that ‘nothing happened’.

It would depend how SS understand the incident and it depends how they interpret your and his response.

If they see it as a combination of mental health and other aggravating factors, which he is actively getting help for, and you are both trying to ensure those factors don’t occur again, then they will most likely be helpful.

If they see you as ready to do anything necessary to protect your babies (including having your dp leave the house and live separately away from you & the twins), then they will be supportive of you. This is super important as you need to show you are the protector of your twins against your dp if necessary, as otherwise they could see you as a risk as well (upsetting I know).

If they see your partner not bothering to sort out his mental health, or engage with health professionals (like double booking GP appointments), that won’t be great. To be honest that isn’t great from any viewpoint is it?

bethy15 god forbid someone tries to offer a different point of view.. The op has clearly not had any concerns before, and it seems very out of character for an otherwise loving father, so i think alternate points of view can be helpful.
His apologising doesn't mean that he actually did anything wrong.

her dh was bouncing the baby not shaking him

You do know that a shaken baby doesn't have to be a side to side thing, he was doing it harder and faster then is safe, that's the same as shaking him, especially given the baby is a premie.

Two more thoughts:

• how long has he been taking the anti depressants? As around 2-3weeks after starting you can get a burst of energy but the negative moods are still there (anger, despair etc), so it’s a time when people are at an increased risk from suicide etc. I wonder if this has any bearing on his emotional state and his tolerance for crying etc?

• I agree you are going to have to be very careful with him around the babies now. But I am worried that throws all the work back into you. When will you have a break or be able to sleep/ nap/ shower? Will he do most of the housework, shopping, cooking etc in order to enable you to take on the responsibility of the twins?

It would be deeply unfair if you just get to do it all, sleep deprived, exhausted and without breaks because he can’t be trusted not to hurt his own baby in far less difficult circumstances.

Not only unfair but I think this would put pressure on your relationship as well, making you the work horse of the whole family, and infantilism him / enabling him to do far less than you.

Long term, why should you be forced to carry everybody including an adult male, because he cannot he trusted not to get violent with the most vulnerable and precious beings in your whole universe... it’s not exactly a sustainable situation! That’s going to breed resentment and drive a wedge between you, with him feeling guilty and ashamed all the time, or you feeling like a slave who has to tiptoe around the real reason this dynamic has happened.

Basically, whatever has happened here, it needs sorting out as quickly as possibly, and not allowing it to fester. And I mean sorting it out properly, so quick may not mean over night as it might require work from you both.

Good luck OP, I really feel for you, you poor thing

He was moving him up and down, but far more forcefully than a bounce. You’d probably call it a shake if you were being technical.

Bobstersmum, this is from the OP.

I asked the op was the baby ok she said yes absolutely fine, if I had seen my baby being technically shaken, I would not have hesitated to get them checked out ASAP. This is the only reason I am questioning, the op isn't concerned about the baby.

I don't think we need to discuss shaking vs bouncing - if op was alarmed & worried at what she saw then it was enough to react accordingly whatever you want to call it!
I think you're being incredibly brave op and absolutely doing the right thing in protecting your babies.

OP. I am a social worker & have had many, many cases of non-accidental injury (NAI) to babies & children.

Please get your baby checked; I know you think he is fine, but you don't know how hard, or how he was shaken/bounced prior to you coming back into the room.
You don't know if, whilst shaking/bouncing him, he also squeezed him. Fractured ribs are common in NAI because in frustration, the squeezing of a perm baby can cause rib fractures.

If you allow this incident to pass, & you don't seek medical advice, & you don't address your DH's behaviour, you ARE failing to protect your son

In my view, you should take baby to GP to be checked. DH needs to leave until you can properly risk assess DH's state of mind & behaviour.

If you do nothing, and this happens again (& there are often more than one incident or injury in cases of NAI), how will you justify yourself to your son and/or other professionals about why you didn't act the first time. Babies under 1 are at the highest risk (of all children) of dying or being injured by their parents. It's not as rare as you'd think.

This is serious OP; ignore those saying he did no harm. He has shown the propensity to bounce roughly/shake a tiny, vulnerable baby because that baby cried.
This is not OK.

Thank you Tinysleep.

I suggested a check up earlier on in the thread as there can be damage you don't know about just to see the baby in front of you, a professional needs to make sure.

Clearly, with your experience the statement means a lot more and I hope the advice is listened to.