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Original poster

Deed of trust when married

125 replies

Mercier1 · 13/11/2018 23:33

Hi everyone.
Tomorrow I’ll be exchanging on a house my husband and I are buying. We currently live in his house he bought six years ago with parental help for the deposit. We moved in together when he bought it and I’ve always contributed to the mortgage and bills. We decided on a ratio in line with who earned more. We were soon engaged, got married, have a baby and another on the way.

We’ve decided to move on and the next house is in both names. I will be contributing 10k or so to the purchase but obviously my husband has a lot more equity now and more cash from his parents (he says 80K) between both lump sums they have gifted him/us.

Tonight final paperwork is coming across and lawyer drops in a letter about if we want to draw up a deed of trust to protect my husbands investment in case anything went wrong. I don’t know how I feel about this. We are a married couple and I’m about to give birth to his second child. That entails a loss of earnings/mat leave etc. In the future I imagine I will have money to put into the house, an inheritance maybe one day of my own.

I feel weird signing a deed of trust as a married woman. But then I guess it’s a huge sum on money and we have been going through a difficult time lately so I can imagine what my husbands thoughts might be tonight.

We exchange tomorrow so it’s prob too late but anyone got experience or insight for me?

OP posts:
MissBartlettsconscience · 14/11/2018 08:26

We had a similar situation op, with my husband putting in a very substantial deposit. Our first flat was in joint names, our current house is as tenants in common but equal shares.

I work and earn slightly less than DH doing the same job, as there is a career penalty to having children (unless you do wrap around nannies and boarding school - schools have holidays and don't tend to want to keep the children after 5.30 which limits commute and working hours).

DH does recognise the unpaid work I put in and has always said our contributions are not equal, because they're weighted more on my side. If despite this he'd expected a deed of trust, I'd have thought it pretty clear that he didn't value my contribution and we weren't really a team.

When it comes to gifts to my children, a deed of trust is absolutely appropriate if they buy a house with a partner (although tenants in common might be more sensible). Not when you're married with children.

Joysmum · 14/11/2018 08:42

I would be surprised if the solicitors had suggested this

I wouldn’t and please don’t hijack the thread into being yet another debate about the impacts of motherhood as this has nothing to do with this case Hmm

I’m in the UK and every time I’ve bought a house I’ve been asked how it’s being funded as part of the money laundering regs. So if this couple have declared him parents gift then the solicitor would need to be raising the concepts ownership and the morality of protection of the parents money.

I would also expect for it to be legally clarified that his parents gift is a stand alone gift and won’t allow them to a future claim of anything other more that the original gift.

Personally I think it’s morally right for this contribution to be ring-fenced, protected and returned to them in the event of issues up the road, but also at this stage that the couple are legally protected against future gains in addition amounts or a claim to more of any increase in equity.

stayathomegardener · 14/11/2018 08:45

I'm surprised you seem confused as to who imitated this.

My first response would have been who's idea was this? DH, in laws or solicitors.

Was your DH as surprised as you?

I wouldn't sign it if I felt it was premeditated it would raise too many questions about my DH's long term commitment to me.

Joysmum · 14/11/2018 08:45

Sorry about the typos. I wanted to contribute so I rushed it Blush

Hiphopopotamous · 14/11/2018 09:10

DONT SIGN IT!!!

I have the opposite situation, my parents gave me a significant deposit. I told my husband we were equals, it is ours not mine. I would never sign something like that so I didn't expect him to.

Hiphopopotamous · 14/11/2018 09:12

And I would be having second thoughts about a man that would rather make his wife and children homeless in the event of a split rather than lose some money that isn't even his.

ArnoldBee · 14/11/2018 09:21

Actually I would sign a deed of trust that you both had to agree that if you split the gift from the PILs was returned to them before consideration was given to the split of marital assets.

Notacluewhatthisis · 14/11/2018 10:24

I am actually wondering if there is anything written between the dh and the pils.

OP are you sure they haven't protected their interests?

llangennith · 14/11/2018 11:36

And I would be having second thoughts about a man that would rather make his wife and children homeless in the event of a split rather than lose some money that isn't even his.

Agree

Mitzimaybe · 14/11/2018 12:09

We did get a deed of trust when we bought our property. However, our circumstances are not yours. I don't feel it would be appropriate for you. If your husband isn't pushing it then don't worry about it. If he is, then take independent legal advice of your own before doing anything.

chocolatebox1 · 14/11/2018 12:18

@todayiwin - would you mind awfully if I PM you? I'm trying to sort out my divorce and I really wanted to ask you about what you'd put about the Deed of Trust, no one I've spoken to in RL has any experience of dealing with this situation

thinkingcapon · 14/11/2018 12:40

This is really interesting. I posted about this some months ago as I wanted to find out what the consensus was as I had had a term of agreement and pre nup drawn up to protect my money as am due to marry soon.......
I'm a woman, and am marrying a man and every single reply was to do it! X

todayiwin · 14/11/2018 13:07

Of course @chocolatebox1 Grin

todayiwin · 14/11/2018 13:08

@thinkingcapon exactly! I find it odd how ultra feminist MN can be ... then when it's down to money 😏🤔😏🤔

Joysmum · 14/11/2018 13:17

Ill be wanting to help my DD buy her first house one day.

I think it’s very reasonable to do so with the legal protection in place to protect my money, and to protect my daughter and any future partner from me laying a claim to their home. It’d be foolish not to.

Pebblesandfriends · 14/11/2018 13:31

I had this the opposite way around. When my husband and I bought our first place together, (after we were married) I was selling my flat and using the equity as a deposit. He hadn't a property in his name. Our solicitor discussed this with us ( it was part of the mortgage discussion, not sprung on us) and I was happy not to sign it. The way I see it it probably wasn't worth the paper it was written on, we are a team and although I earned more and therefore got on the housing ladder first my DH has now caught me up and as I have chosen to go part time, will more than likely put more I to this one. I would have felt unhappy if he had asked me to sign something similar. If the lawyer is pressuring you, and your DH wants you to sign, delay the mortgage and get independent legal advice.

Original poster
Mercier1 · 14/11/2018 13:43

No one is pressuring me and I think my husband wanted to broach it but we were having an argument so we didn’t go there. When we moved in together it was discussed but as my name wasn’t on anything I felt I had no legal entitlement of anysort anyways so I just paid my quota into our joint account. As I said we were engaged to be married pretty soon after so I think we both felt that marriage would superceed all of this. I certainly wouldn’t have had kids with him without being married.

His percents have done a letter for the mortgage stating this sum of cash is a gift to us both.

I don’t feel entitled to his parents money but I certainly want to feel like an equal partner in my marriage and my family. Which I generally do. As I said he’s not pressuring and his parents haven’t said anything that I am aware of. I don’t give this has come at a sensitive time as we are going through a really difficult time and there’s definitely been some big arguments recently.

OP posts:
kikashi · 14/11/2018 13:43

Leave it be (and get some advice in the mean time) If your Husband brings it up and wants you to sign then listen to his ariguments and say you'll think about it. The 80k he has now is presumably partly there because he was able to have the flat as you helped with the mortgage forgoing getting your own place.

Perhaps it is fair to ring fence his original deposit of the flat and inheritences but to share the growth in equity on the flat for the time you were contributing, monetarily or through childcare. Also, the children grow up and if you decide to split then and the courts don't need to consider their wefare at that point will you be disadvantaged. If you do do a deed of trust now make sure you also do one or ring fence your inheritance when the tie comes.

Original poster
Mercier1 · 14/11/2018 13:43

Parents not percents

OP posts:
speakingtruthfully · 14/11/2018 13:53

Seems fair to me that the money his parents put into the original house is protected

chocolatebox1 · 14/11/2018 13:57

@todayiwin thank you very much, I really appreciate it, I've sent you a message

Joysmum · 14/11/2018 14:12

His percents have done a letter for the mortgage stating this sum of cash is a gift to us both

In that case as it was a gift to you both and you’ve got that in writing I wouldn’t sign anything. If this was at his parents insistence (which would be reasonable) then I would.

Notacluewhatthisis · 14/11/2018 14:14

His percents have done a letter for the mortgage stating this sum of cash is a gift to us both

This doesn't make sense. If his parents don't kind why is it an issue?

I understand him being worried about nowhere to live (which means nowhere he can have his kids stay with him) in event of divorce.

But given you work and only earn 10% less than him, a divorce wouldn't be a straight forward as you get to keep the house until the kids are 18. There a chance that the house could be sold so he could buy somewhere, you may have to buy him out etc.

There's not a huge amount of disparity between your earnings. If you earn 10% less when doing 3 days, you could out earn him in the event of a divorce if you went back full time (when the kids are older).

Notacluewhatthisis · 14/11/2018 14:15

thinkingcapon it is interesting but not surprising.

Original poster
Mercier1 · 14/11/2018 14:17

He said the lawyer just called him to say they can’t exchange until he gives them an answer and called me to discuss it. I said if he wants to look into I’m ok with that and would seek my own legal advise. He was laughing and saying he would proceed without it but he also said he feels quite vulnerable. This is symptomatic of where marriage is though right now. I think if we were in a better place he would just crack on without hesitation. I really don’t know what I would do if we did split up. Neither of us could maintain the mortgage alone in our current jobs and he feels like I’ll get his kids and a house his parents paid for. It’s quite depressing to imagine.

OP posts: