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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Parental alienation by ex - is my boyfriend supposed to stay single forever?

62 replies

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 20:10

Hi everyone, first time poster, and this gets a bit confusing so please bear with me!

I've been loitering for a while on the divorce discussions and it's been but really helpful.

I'm in the process of getting divorced from a complete EA Narc after a long marriage, I already have had Decree Nisi for over a year now and now having to go through protracted court case before absolute, as I said its all been fun... but that's a whole other story, there's something else I'm now a bit stumped with...

Anyway... we at least got as far as separating and I moved out into my own house after having to live under the same roof separated for 8 months. Egged on by the girls I worked with I was encouraged to go online and start dating which I wasn't sure I was entirely ready for but lo and behold... a month after I moved out I met someone and started dating with no expectations, a bit of getting it out of my system type of thing, problem is he turned out to be really lovely.

We find ourselves still together after over a year now, and have had a fun year getting to know each other and remembering what life's supposed to be about, its been great.

Before he met me He'd been married and divorced for 6 years with two kids aged 12 and 15, his ex wife also appears to be a complete Narc, leaving him for someone that they employed at the company they had together, getting pregnant by him and then, running what had been their joint company to bankruptcy...he lost everything.

He then started a relationship with someone else who had two kids of their own of a similar age to his, and they lived together him having joint custody of his kids. As the kids started getting closer to his then partner, his ex wife (who's partner had now turned physically abusive with her and my boyfriend's kids) and by whom she now had two other kids by, created a pack of lies and went back to court for a revision of custody, leaving him with just alternate weekend contact with to his kids, but leaving them living with her and her abusive new partner!

She then proceeded to alienate both kids, so they both stopped seeing my boyfriend altogether, the younger of the two eventually decided he wanted to see his Dad again and does although she does everything in her power to stop it and mess up contact time. The older of the two hasn't properly seen his Dad for nearly three years (she says its his choice, but there has been no reason why he shouldn't see his Dad and he appears to be being coerced) apart from at sport sessions that his Dad makes sure he goes to to support BOTH his sons and show he's still there.

Anyway the other relationship he had broke up after 5 years last year, around 8 months before he met me (they never married, just lived together, I suspect the ex's behaviour had a lot to do with it)

Anyway the crux of it is... The boyfriends ex wife has now split with the abusive partner she left my boyfriend for, leaving her with four kids on her own, whom she's very possessive of, my boyfriend's two older kids and two younger ones 6&5 from the abusive ex partner.

She has now started my boyfriend by getting his kids to text him asking for more money (she gets child maintenance from him already) and getting them to say things like if he doesn't pay it he's not a real Dad. He's noticed the younger kid that he does see, has been quiet and more off-hand with him as she is clearly also now trying to alienate him from his Dad too. He's trying his hardest to keep contact at all costs this last few weeks, often to the detriment of our time together which I completely understand, although its been tough.

I haven't met his kids at all yet, he's been terrified that if I do (and chances are he thinks they'd like me - I'm not intending being a replacement mother or rocking her boat by any means) she'll increase the pressure and break the remaining contact he has with his kids.

Obviously he doesn't want to risk that, but he's now massively torn and contemplating breaking up with me as he feels guilty and says he can't keep me in limbo not meeting his kids for the next few years until they are old enough to make their own decisions re: seeing him, which without her influence I think they would. But obviously we can't risk him losing contact either. He says he can't imagine me not being in his life but is just paralysed not knowing what to do.

I'm prepared to bide my time for a while at least, and haven't pressured him other than saying I'd love one day to meet his kids and be part of their and his lives one day rather than being having to be kept separate, which is true.

He's gone off into his 'Man cave' for a bit of headspace and I'm left wondering what the hell to do and how the hell to deal with this, it just feels like we're stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Has anyone been in a similar situation? how do you deal with a relationship with someone who's ex is hell bent on alienating her kids from him with no justification. Do we just go for it an hope to be able to deal with the fall out? or do I have to forever stay the 'secret' girlfriend?

OP posts:
IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 20:18

Ooh he’s spun you a right jack-a-nory!

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 20:25

What makes you think that Posie?

OP posts:
Lookatyourwatchnow · 21/10/2018 20:29

Yeah I would tread with caution. Yes, there are some ex wives who behave like this. But there are also some knobhead men who spin yarns about their 'psycho' ex wives because it suits their needs. I reckon my XH probably tells his partners that I'm a psycho because it justifies him not bothering with his DC.

IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 20:37

He’s followed the script perfectly; she cheated on him, she ran his company into the ground and bankrupt him, she took everything he had, despite his kids being abused by their mothers boyfriend he did NOTHING and yet, when it went to court (at the mother’s instigation) he went from having 50/50 care to having alternate weekends. And he did nothing, again. As you do Hmm and of course it’s her alienating the kids from him, it couldn’t be that teenage kids who see their dad every other weekend just aren’t that bothered about seeing him and would rather see their mates at weekends? No?

But the clincher, the absolute dead give away, he makes this YOUR problem. He tells you he wants to break up with you over it despite you never having even met the kids and having nothing to do with them. He’s hoping you will dobteh dirty work for him, swallow his bullshit and break up with him for the sake of his kids. I guarantee you he will be with someone else within a month of breaking up with you.

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 20:41

I've met her... accidentally and very briefly when I walked in on her in the loos at a rugby function, she was off her head drunk and had her dress over her head cackling with her equally loud friend, not great for the first introduction (after a few months of us dating) It could only happen to me...but that night gave me a fair idea of her personality...

So she knows I exist, and believe me with having had my own cheating narc ex I have more than done my share of googling etc the boyfriend to check out what he says and everything so far has turned out to be true...

OP posts:
Lookatyourwatchnow · 21/10/2018 20:44

Did google tell you that she single handedly bankrupt his company? And fixed the court hearing so that his contact was reduced?

So what if she was drunk on a night out messing about with her mate in the toilet? What's that got to do with the price of milk? Stop the press, a mother got drunk on a night out...

BitOfANameChange · 21/10/2018 20:45

My ex has told people he thinks I've brainwashed the DCs against him because they don't want to see him..

I told them from the day we left ex, that if they wanted a relationship with their dad I'd facilitate it, no problem.

But I haven't badmouthed him to them, and they've come to their own decisions. They don't want to see him because he's abusive. But he's never accepted his own behaviour, always blamed it on someone or something else (usually me).

OP, tred carefully.

MulticolourMophead · 21/10/2018 20:46

...but that night gave me a fair idea of her personality...

No it doesn't

Gemini69 · 21/10/2018 20:47

I'd walk away from this one .. you certainly don't need to aggro this early in a relationship... Flowers

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 20:47

@Istandwithposie actually when he found out about the abuse he DID return to court/ CAFCASS but they wouldn't separate her boys from their younger stepbrothers.

OP posts:
IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 20:50

but that night gave me a fair idea of her personality.

Confused you met her once when she was drunk on a night out. You’ve never been drunk when out? How does that tell you her personality? Ask yourself if your boyfriend would have any reason to paint her in a poor light.

Lookatyourwatchnow · 21/10/2018 20:51

@Raindancing what would your XH say about you? Would it be true, or would he lie to look better to a new girlfriend? Can you not imagine that your boyfriend might be doing this? Protect yourself.

IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 20:51

they wouldn't separate her boys from their younger stepbrothers.

Brothers, not step brothers. They have the same mother. Did your boyfriend tell you this?

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 21:09

What I didn't say on the first time of meeting her (and yes of course I've been drunk myself! there was more went on that night - not involving me that I haven't mentioned) is that she showed me a photo of her kids, and I said they looked lovely and said she must be really proud of them, and that I'd love to meet them one day. I have no personal grudge against her at all, and have very much stayed out of it and kept my eyes and ears open. The boyfriend never ever bad mouths the kids mums to or in front of them.

Of course I take what he says about her with a huge pinch of salt, I'd love to be a fly on the wall to hear what my ex says about me and can guarantee it wouldn't be good, lets face it ex's are ex's for a reason and in most cases theres no love lost.

I'm a Mum myself...my son's 20 and when we split up he stayed with his Dad - ( even though he knew he'd been abusive to me) as an adult he could make that decision and tbh I didn't have a huge problem with my ex's parenting, however I'm sure it'll be being portrayed that I left him!

@istandwithposie ok brothers!... I guess I'm not that au fait with the current terminology, and no that's not what he told me...

OP posts:
IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 21:14

and no that's not what he told me.

Who told you?

Gemini69 · 21/10/2018 21:17

they are half brothers.. right

Holdingonbarely · 21/10/2018 21:20

Why have you come on mumsnet. For what end? Genuine question?

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 21:23

Did google tell you that she single handedly bankrupt his company?

Actually yes it did... he stepped out for her to buy him out, and his ex and new partner who also worked there bankrupted it before financial settlement was reached...

OP posts:
Eatmycheese · 21/10/2018 21:23

As I was reading your epic post I started to think you were with someone who is very adept at spinning a yarn. Now I have finished it I think he’s a master weaver.
I would leave him to it in his “man cave”. Why the fuck you want to jump out of the frying pan into the fire based on your previous life is beyond me.

IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 21:28

Ok OP, you don’t have to answer to any of us or believe what we believe is happening.

What I will advise you is to do nothing. Carry on seeing him exactly as you have been, don’t push to meet his children, don’t say you will help him out by splitting up. Just carry on as before then watch and LISTEN, very carefully, to what he does and say. Let him talk, if he talks about breaking up, let him, don’t encourage him either way, see what he does.

Raindancing · 21/10/2018 21:30

@Holdingonbarely

Why have you come on mumsnet. For what end? Genuine question?

I'm beginning to wonder...

Ok... so it looks like you all think this is very implausible

I'm genuinely in two minds myself, and as I've said I'm biding my time and will see how this pans out, however does it not also seem plausible to anyone that actually there ARE ex's who use their kids as ammunition?

Hasn't anyone else genuinely been in that situation?

OP posts:
Raindancing · 21/10/2018 21:33

*Ok OP, you don’t have to answer to any of us or believe what we believe is happening.

What I will advise you is to do nothing. Carry on seeing him exactly as you have been, don’t push to meet his children, don’t say you will help him out by splitting up. Just carry on as before then watch and LISTEN, very carefully, to what he does and say. Let him talk, if he talks about breaking up, let him, don’t encourage him either way, see what he does.*

we had the big talk yesterday... this is exactly what I am doing...

OP posts:
MrsBobDylan · 21/10/2018 21:35

Why, when she left him for another man, did your dp 'step out of the business?' and ask them to buy him out. Why leave what was presumably his job and livelihood in the hands of a woman who had just cheated on him, to run with her new man, and wait to receive a buyout payment?

Sounds like the business had no equity and was in trouble. It also sounds like your dp is a grade A bullshitter.

Raspberry66 · 21/10/2018 21:36

Not sure what you're looking for with this thread OP but if it's empathy you probably won't find much here - the default is that men whose exes are not reasonable are either lying or only have themselves to blame.

IStandWithPosie · 21/10/2018 21:37

Good OP. Keep your wits about you. He may be telling you the complete truth, he may not be. I know whichever it is will become apparent with time. You’re only a year in, you don’t need to meet his kids, move in with him etc. You’ve been married before, you know how it goes. In your shoes I would enjoy dating a nice man without the relationship ruining business of living with him Grin