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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Adult DS1 raised his hand to me

54 replies

PatsyCatsy · 26/09/2018 16:49

Sorry this is so incredibly long. Complex situation and don't want to dripfeed.

I have two sons, 23 and 26. My DH died when they were still at primary school. DS2 reacted in a normal way to bereavement. DS1 seemed OK for 15 months but then cracked up. He became a complete recluse. The NHS was useless. I got relentless pressure about his school attendance. But he wasn't just missing school, he was locked in his dark bedroom (often sobbing) pretty much 24/7. He thought of suicide daily during this period.

This went on for two whole years. We got no help of any sort. We later got an apology from CAMHS.

DS1 only recovered enough for home tuition at 14, by which time it was too late to rescue his GCSEs. School was never likely to be easy for him as he has the most severe 10% of dyslexia and the top 1% of intelligence. His DF's death was the final straw.

Since he was 18 he has only had two real jobs . Neither lasted 6 months. He's had the odd day cash in hand but that's all.

He has no money so pays no keep. He won't sign on for benefits because he gets desperately anxious. However this is a real burden for me - and his DB I am unable to work due to ill health and living on £700 a month. Out of that I feed DS1 and his girlfriend who is here 5 nights a week. We wouldn't be able to keep the house going if it weren't for DS2, who has a good job he enjoys and gladly pays his way.

18 months ago DS1 wrecked the ground floor of our house in a state of alcoholic psychosis. He smashed lots of stuff and ripped the back door off its hinges. It was terrifying. The police were wonderful. He's very big and strong, though I have never feared he would hit me.

After that he was very remorseful for weeks. He has not got drunk since. But I have become increasingly troubled that he's going to end up at 40 still squatting in my basement.

Life Is just passing him by. I try to get him to discuss both his future and the money every few months. There are always promises but nothing actually changes.

I reached a decision over the summer that it was bad for all of us to put up with this any longer. I told him he needed to get a job and prepare to move out.

So to today:

My Sky box has been bust for weeks and the engineers arrived this morning. When I took them into the TV room my TV had gone. Turns out DS1 had taken it and had screwed it to the wall. He refused to unscrew it. Said it was too difficult.

The Sky engineers had to leave. They can't come again for over a month. I was furious.

I was remonstrating with him, with him shouting at me through his locked bedroom door. He lives in the basement and none of us are allowed in. Eventually he came to the door and held it half open.

Then, when I shouted at him again, his hand came out very quickly and he slapped my arm. It didn't hurt or make a mark. I'm not frightened. What I am is totally shocked.

I feel this is a massive step in the wrong direction. I can't overlook this.

He hotly denies that he has any MH issues. However I have been operating his whole adult life on the basis that his MH is very poor, with severe depression and anxiety. If I am wrong and he's fine, his treatment of me would be appalling.

I feel he is immensely vulnerable. It worries me sick, plus the situation is so unfair on his DB.

DS2 plans to move out in the next 9 months. He would rather stay at home and save money towards a deposit for a place (he pays less here than rent would be) but he just can't tolerate DS1's behaviour.

I'm going to have to kick DS1 out, aren't I?

OP posts:
TheBeatGoesOnandOn · 26/09/2018 16:57

I think ultimately you will have to, yes.

You've done everything you can to support and nurture him. He's not even taking responsibility that he may have additional issues.

You have another son to think of and your own health is not good. If he wants to stay he will have to access adult mental health services and engage with them as this is not normal behaviour.

Of course losing his Dad was terrible and you couldn't expect schooling to go smoothly, but you can't have the trauma affect everything he ever does the rest of his life.

Can he live with his girlfriend?

thereareflowersinmygarden · 26/09/2018 17:04

At the very least, the girlfriend needs to leave. You can't afford to feed her too.

Adora10 · 26/09/2018 17:19

Yeah stop feeding g/f, I'd kick him out he may the be able to present to council as homeless and they may find him a place; he's nearly mid twenties, he's gonna have to stand on his own two feet some time and the sooner the better as currently he's stuck in limbo as a small child in a bubble.

Feel sorry for you having to deal with all that but there will be things he can access to help him and if you kick him out you may be surprised at how he starts to actually do things for himself.

Dairymilkmuncher · 26/09/2018 17:24

You should chuck him out and not feel bad about it you've been so accommodating so far. Where does his gf stay?

Maybe pick up all the applications for him for whatever housing associations and job centre etc and then say he needs to go but you would have done the running around for him.

You'll be surprised how well he'll manage when he doesn't have the basement to fall back on

CreativeMumma · 26/09/2018 17:46

Hi op,

I grew up in a very similar situation (my ddad didn't pass away but was abusive) I'm the ds2 in your situation.

My dB is also serverly dsylexic, couldn't cope with a 'normal' job, still lives with my dm, has mental health issues, is an ex heroin user and still uses lots of other drugs, definitely has drinking issues and is abusive. He is now in his late 30's, with no prospects, says when my dm dies he will commit suicide because he can't see a way to live - I'm not sure he will, but it will depend on his mh.

My DM basically lives in a abusive relationship with him, constantly on eggshells, always hopefully he will improve, escaping when she feels in danger. I haven't been to her house in over 4 years because I won't tolerate his behaviour.

I understand you are in a very difficult situation, but I truly believe if you feel strong enough you need to set the rules down, and if (when) he over steps them he needs to leave.

Please DM me if you would like to talk more.

overnightangel · 26/09/2018 18:09

I feel sorry for your other son more than anyone else, he works hard and has his own life to lead and enjoy

Haffiana · 26/09/2018 18:09

Time for real love. Kick him out. You are not helping him by allowing him to drift like this. He cannot confront or get help for his MH issues because you are shielding him from his own problems.

You are acting to ease your own anxieties. You are not however helping your son.

Fiffyshadesofgreymatter · 26/09/2018 18:14

Why did you even let his gf move in? Why feed and support her?

Put a stop to that today. And you should tell him "you've stolen the tv. You hit me. You no longer get to have people stay here."
Then give him 3 months to get a job or get out. You might have to start a formal eviction process so look into that.

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 26/09/2018 19:10

Thank you for all your responses. They're all helpful in different ways.

I totally agree that DS2 is the one being most unfairly treated. He's a star. He's had his own struggles, with both his physical and mental health, but he's dealt with all his difficulties admirably. He's a lovely responsible lad who is doing very well at work, despite not having any A levels. His brother can be lovely too. I love them both, but they couldn't be more different.

The girlfriend is a drain financially but I have got fond of her and she definitely loves my son. I've heard her encouraging h to go out for walks, to have friends round. OK they have no money, she'll say, but we could do X. Very positive.

gendercritter · 26/09/2018 19:21

I think you've had a namechange fail, lovely

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 26/09/2018 19:22

Sorry, his girlfriend doesn't live here. She sleeps here 5 nights a week. It's a ridiculous situation, but it started with fewer nights several years ago and it's just become entrenched. She's not as expensive to feed as my DC because she likes a lot of stuff I don't buy, and brings it with her.

I wouldn't want to turf her out before I get DS1 to leave anyway. She and I get on well but she has very low self esteem (which may be why she's wasting so much of her young life in my basement). She also admires me. If I asked just her to get out she would read it as a direct personal rejection. It would be like kicking a puppy. She will go when DS1 goes. That's clear in my head.

safetyfreak · 26/09/2018 19:24

Oops name change

PatsyCatsy · 26/09/2018 19:25

Thanks for that, gendercritter.

OP posts:
safetyfreak · 26/09/2018 19:26

Why have you ignored the advice that your son should move out asap?

Joboy · 26/09/2018 19:28

What my mum had to do was sell house. Move into old people flat( you can. Do so at 55) so he could live with you .
My sibling still has bad MH and has been getting help on and off for years .
There are people that will help .
Get out live you life . You have done your job.

HollowTalk · 26/09/2018 19:41

Do you have much equity in the house, OP? Could you afford to move and give your younger son something towards a deposit?

I was really shocked that your DS1 had a girlfriend. Why on earth did he meet her, if he never left his room? She sounds lovely and must be very patient to stick with him. I would stop buying any food for her - it's not up to you to pay for her living costs; she should be paying you rent if anything.

Notacluewhatthisis · 26/09/2018 19:46

Why is the girlfriend not working?

Tbh, you think a lot of her, you should be encouraging her to not waste her life.

Monday55 · 26/09/2018 20:26

Sorry OP but at 26 his behaviour is unacceptable. You need to step up, show him a side of you that's fearless. You can't live like this anymore. If you can't kick him out then give him ultimatums and don't go back on them.

At this time of year there's loads of Christmas temp jobs popping up.

PatsyCatsy · 26/09/2018 20:36

Ok. I've done it. Sent a brief text saying it was the final straw and telling him to be out by the last weekend in October. He hasn't responded yet.

OP posts:
PatsyCatsy · 26/09/2018 20:42

The girlfriend works three days a week in a tanning place. I don't expect she earns much. It was stupid of me not to ask her for keep ages ago but I didn't know she had a job for ages. No one told me.

I think part of the problem is that her family and the rest of my family are all fairly affluent and I don't think either of them really grasp how skint I am.

OP posts:
SandAndSea · 26/09/2018 20:56

Patsy, I agree that he needs to leave and I'm glad you've started the ball rolling. I wonder if you could support him through that process, help him find somewhere and set up home? Maybe there are other family members and friends who could help too? Long term, this might help both of you to maintain a happier relationship.

PatsyCatsy · 26/09/2018 21:10

I was interested in Adora10's suggestion about the council. I haven't had a response to my text yet, but when we eventually do talk I will suggest he goes to the council and ask where he stands. Or the CAB.

I don't want to start doing it all for him. It just gives him more excuses for inaction. It's his lack of interest in his life that's much of the problem.

Plus I have a feeling that if I went to the council and said "I'm planning to evict my son. What does that entitle him to?" that it would probably disqualify him from any help. They'd think I was doing it to get him a flat.

OP posts:
PatsyCatsy · 26/09/2018 21:21

We don't have any family nearby. But I have spoken to my DPs about my decision and they are in wholehearted support, which means a great deal to me.

DS2 seemed relieved when I told in a subdued sort of way. It's a relief for both of us that I've made the decision but it's not a happy day. He told me my own DB2 has thought this had to happen for some months, since my DB became aware of the exact financial situation. He told DS2 how he felt but I assume he didn't speak to me because he didn't want to interfere.

OP posts:
Maelstrop · 26/09/2018 21:24

You will be making him homeless so he can apply for emergency housing. Can he and the gf set up house together? Or at her parents? I think you’ve done enough.

TheBouquets · 27/09/2018 02:08

Maelstrop OP is not making DS1 homeless. DS1 made himself homeless with his conduct over years during which OP has been very patient.

To me a DC raising a hand to me or in other way putting me in fear would be the last straw. It has to be. We cant have our DCs attacking us like this.
DS1 and the GF have been taking advantage of OP for a long time. Time they stood on their own two/four feet.
Trying to find excuses that the death of the DF caused DS1 to create all this carry on is not acceptable. OP lost her DP and OH, love and support but still had to get on with running a house and providing for 2 DCs, may also have gone back to work etc. There is never a good time for anyone's DF to die. It is a heartbreak for sure but not an excuse to indulge in violence against the nearest and dearest.
All of this is not fair on DS2.
Creativemumma you said you are in the role of DS2 and that you have not visited your DM house for years because of DB treatment of her. By not going to visit DM's house for years to assist her to stand up to your DB you could be seen as colluding with DB.
I have lived the life of these DMs. There was no death of parent. There were other factors including drink and drugs. My DC who is in the position of DS2 and Creativemumma is aware of the capabilities of the person who is in the position of DS1 and creativemumma's DB and the question is why are these people letting Mothers be abused by the siblings?