Thread for my DP: why I'm vulnerable unmarried

[Ebonyscrooge]

Can you please comment saying precisely why I am vulberable as an unmarried mother of 2 who works part-time?

-House is jointly owned
-Joint Life insurance
-Pensions to be left to each other

My partner does not see how/why this leaves me still vulnerable.

Thankyou.

Why are you working part time and suffering a drop in assets. Tell him if he doesn’t want to pool assets, fine, but he can work part time and pick up kids duties.

You chose to have two children out of wedlock.

You've only got yourself to blame if you feel 'vulnerable'.

Sensible middle class women do not have children without a marriage certificate.

Having children outside wedlock is a slippery slope to a life of poverty for most women.

^^ what she said.

He doesn't want to marry you because he cares about money more than he cares about you. He's showing you his true colours, he doesn't value you enough to marry you. So the question is, what are you going to do about it?

Cut your loses & find a partner who does love you enough to get married.

You’re fine until you split and then you’ll get to experience just how vulnerable you’ve made yourself. Anything he’s agreed to now (accept your legally documented rights to the house) he can change later,

Having children disadvantages women far more than it does men and they know this.

@Ebonyscrooge so no men work full time with kids in your profession then?

He knows exactly how and why you are vulnerable and he's fine with that. He's also happy for you to degrade yourself starting a thread like this when it's a no-brainer. You can do better!

Well if he is earning a high wage, you will not get any spousal payments which be quite significant considering your career has taken a backseat.

From what you written, he definitely have the better end of the deal.

Did you show him the thread?
What's he say?

No marriage certificate absolutely no career compromise for the sake of the family. None. That's what I'm teaching my girls.

Every middle class professional woman I know with children is married.

I had a boss family law solicitor total cock. He had 3 kids with his partner, refused to marry her then dumped her for someone else.

Oh dear, some very antiquated views on what makes a sensible middle class woman. What about women who aren’t middle class and does this just apply to lower middle class women ? I assume so, because by definition upper middle class people are wealthy in their own right. They won’t need the financial security of marriage. In fact their advisors would be more interested in protecting their assets in case she has fallen for somebody without the right income or dare I say it background😱) I take it working class women have nothing to aspire to and no hope of assets so should accept their lot?

As to the comment, leave him and find another man who will marry you! WTAF. I just think that is degrading to women and to men. If her DP reads that he will be confirmed in his views that women are just looking for a meal ticket. Which we are not btw.

The OP is vulnerable because she doesn’t maximise her earning potential and is completely intransigent in her decision not to work FT or increase her hours. Given most divorce settlements will now place an expectation that she should maximise her income and that his inheritance will probably be outside marital asset share she needs to get her head around some realities of life, not him.

I really despair some outdated attitudes which hold women back and leave them vulnerable either in marriage or out of it, middle class or not. For what it is worth in my peer group of women in their 40s and 50s it those women who maintained careers, married or not, who are the most financially secure. They all have their own capital and their own pension.They all have the capability to add to it. It is the women who career sacrificed who are now realising that their husbands pension is going to have to cover both of them. That their compromised joint income means that they don’t quite have the same the level of capital as their friends and that they may have to downsize in retirement. They are vulnerable to divorce because they don’t have enough to retire on separately and they don’t have time to plan for it.

Whilst he’s happy for you to make sacrifices with your career, pension, financial independence etc, he’s not will to make the possible sacrifice of having to share his assets with the mother of his children who has enabled his career, looked after his children, and kept the house going.
This.
Why are you working part time and suffering a drop in assets. Tell him if he doesn’t want to pool assets, fine, but he can work part time and pick up kids duties.
This. And I bet he'll have a reason why he couldn't possibly do that because his job is so much more important.
Having children disadvantages women far more than it does men and they know this
This.

If you were working full time, had your own decent pension and other legal protection and were happy you could manage in the event of a split without CMS (because some men seem very quick to try and minimise their financial responsibility), i'd feel differently (still more vulnerable than him but not too much)

But you're in the textbook position of unmarried mum making all the financial sacrifices to facilitate a man who could leave you high and dry.

Some of these responses are so antiquated. I am a middle class professional female and dared to have a child out of wedlock. I am however financially independent. I don't think it's the non marriage which makes one vulnerable, it is giving up a career to be a better parent apparently. Even if you are married I believe this puts you in a vulnerable position as post divorce an ex husband is not and should not be expected to support you forever. It is fine to choose to be a pt or sahm but I don't think it makes a better parent, just different but whatever your other circumstances of course it makes you weaker financially.

It's not exactly romantic to say to someone I want to get married so if we spilt up I get a fair share of your pension.

What's romantic is delighting in standing up before the people who are important to you both and saying that you are now a permanent unit, that you will share everything and care for each other no matter what life throws at you. You know: wedding vows.

My DH was so thrilled I was his. Wild horses wouldn't have stopped him marrying me. The OP has every right to expect the same.

Doesn't sound as if you're going to get it, OP. He's a rich man who's looking after number one. Very mean and unattractive to not want to protect and support the mother of his children who is taking a career and financial hit by caring for them.

I agree with other posters that you should look at charging him half the cost of a childminder. That would clarify the lack of equity in your relationship and make him register that you're aware of how unfairly he is treating you. Because if he protests when confronted with the figures, you need to point out that, as your assets and income aren't joint it's only fair that he compensate you for hours worked unpaid in his interests.

You are financially independent that's entirely different.

The partner is benefiting from the womans labour in the home without giving her any protection for her efforts. That's wrong and unfair. Marriage is the simplest way to get some protection under law if you step back from earning to raise kids not perfect but damn sight better than being unmarried in these circumstances.

Ebony

I also wonder whether you have now shown him this thread and what his responses are to this. Unfortunately and for your own reasons you have handed over all of your power and control in this relationship to him. He certainly does have the better end of this deal here and is looking after number 1 - him.

kerala I think my point is the same as yours, only phrased differently. To give up a career and be dependent on someone is not something I would advise to my dd. This leaves you vulnerable if married and even more vulnerable if unmarried.

There are some pretty harsh comments here which make showing him the thread very difficult as I asked purely for the facts.

I will show him however when I have the opportunity to.

I feel like a stuck record BUT I can not work full time in my profession with young children without falling mentally ill. I tried it on increased hours. And this is what happened. Many other women in my profession vouch for this. Please accept what I am saying. It is NOT an option. Also DP has many extra responsibilities in his own very stressful job so one of us needs to be at home more than the other. Fine if you don't get it, but that is how our situation is and you can not understand fully unless you know us.

The facts ARE pretty harsh. An awful lot of people on this thread absolutely get it. You are yes butting when you say you are doing the only thing you can do. It's your choice to allow yourself to be in such a vulnerable position. And his, obviously.

I commented on your other thread. It's fine how you want to work. You asked for the facts:
Without marriage in the event of a split you are not entitled to any of your partners assets, savings, pensions, property etc. Nothing. He does not pay you any maintenance, only a per day amount for any children up to 18. If you jointly own the house you are entitled to an amount of the profits of sale...
So a split leaves you with your own salary, your half of the house sale, a monthly amount for share of feeding/clothing the children. So you need to work out how to house and survive and look after the kids with that.

Working fulltime in my field whilst having young children is not sustainable. 90% of the women I know in my field with children work part-time...

What do the men in your field do? I assume a lot of them have children.

I would say to your "D"P that if he won't marry you, you are going back to work full-time, the children will need full-time childcare and he will need to pull his weight and do half of everything you're currently doing for free at home.

I feel like a stuck record BUT I can not work full time in my profession with young children without falling mentally ill. I tried it on increased hours. And this is what happened. Many other women in my profession vouch for this. Please accept what I am saying. It is NOT an option. Also DP has many extra responsibilities in his own very stressful job so one of us needs to be at home more than the other. Fine if you don't get it, but that is how our situation is and you can not understand fully unless you know us.
Isn't the point here that many women in your career can't be full time and have children because it's a full on career and the men in your lives aren't willing to make any sacrifices of their own to enable you to have your career?
You say your DP has a stressful job with lots of responsibility, but it sounds like your full time role would also have had those qualities. Why is his career so much more important?
You say someone has to stay at home. I get that. But why does it have to be you?

I think is what posters are trying to say. The reason your DP can have his career and his higher pay etc is because you have sacrificed your career and financial security to enable him. He wouldn't be able to do everything he is doing if you weren't picking up the slack and making sacrifices.

He knows this. That's why he is happy with this arrangement. He gets his career, high pay, decent pension, good earning potential and in the event of a split he takes half the house, can change his will etc so you get none of his pension, you get nothing in terms of support other than some child support until the children are 18. Financially this set up makes him better off. Marriage would make him worse off.

If that's tough reading then it's because the reality is tough. If he's wary of marriage it's because he doesn't want to marry. And is bet he doesn't want to marry because he stands to lose in the event of a split.

Guess you would need a nanny and housekeeper for you to work full time and all the "wifework" that goes with it to be shared 50:50 or you could be £ compensated for all that you do.

I would read "wifework" then you may grasp why you can't work full time without getting ill

OP this forum has had probably tens of thousands of threads over the years from women in desperate straits realising that years of love and financial contributions mean very little when it comes to entitlement outside marriage.

They all thought it wouldn’t happen to them, thought joint ownership etc was enough and were convinced their partner would be fair if they split.

Don’t be passive. It’s in your hands. If he really won’t marry you to give his family the security you deserve then you might as well go it alone