Ending it after 30 years - he says he's done nothing wrong so he wants house

[ManyElephants]

Named changed. I hope. H and have been married 30 years in October our DCs are 15 and 17. Their lives have been blighted by his selfishness and aggression. He thinks he's a great dad. Both have ended up with MH/anxiety issues; (he dislikes youngest child who looks like me). I have no doubt at all that this is my fault for staying with him, I had an abusive childhood as a result I find it hard to make decisions so stayed with him - initially I was worried he'd get access to the kids and then they'd be at risk when with him. TBH I am still worried but at least they are older now.

So my problem is when I tell him, he will go apeshit. He is very devious and so if angry I suspect he will do something to himself, me or the dog if I go out (I think the kids would be last on his hitlist but I am not sure). He has no job, retired on a small pension so is reliant on my income. We have a fairly large mortgage bearing in mind our ages, on interest only - runs out in 8 years so the house will have to be sold then anyway. Ideally I'd like him to leave us in the house till DCs are older then sell up close to the end of the 8 years.

He constantly tells me I have nothing to complain about, that I am cruel to him (usually for not doing his washing, cooking etc) and that he has no idea what he has ever done wrong. If I give him an example, he'll say, well that was your fault ... or .... "you do worse than that all the time". Or the best one, "prove it - c'mon, where's your proof? What was the time and date I did that? Where are the witnesses?" If I said I wanted to split up he'd say no one is stopping you leaving. Its all about his rights and entitlements.

My younger DC has had to have counselling and the counsellor has told me in no uncertain terms that we need to split up because his behaviour is causing DC's issues, but if I told my husband that, he'd say the counsellor is lying, "because you have lied to her about me".

He is 60+ I am mid 50s, we have made a terrible mess of our lives - I reckon its going to be a nightmare getting out. I am worried that if we split up now what happens will be far worse than anything the kids have witnessed so far. Oh and so as not to drip feed, he's the sort of bloke everyone loves, he's such a nice man - he's also physically very small compared to me so that add to the idea he likes to perpetuate that I am a bully. Neither of us have any family so he has no where to go and he only has his small pension so cannot afford a private rental. He is making a half hearted attempt to get a job - if he did he could afford a 1 bed flat but we have a big house, he's not going to suddenly have an epiphany and do the decent thing.

I know similar things have been discussed on here before but I just cannot imagine how to manage the situation once I tell him I want out.

Don't cling on for the sake of the house, leave and rent, honestly the house is not worth it.

If you are scared of his actions, prepare for that, drop the dog off to a friend on the pretence of taking it for a walk, make sure kids are elsewhere, grandparents etc, and do you have a male friend/relative or 2 who could wait by the back/front door when you tell him, in case things get out of hand?

Your husband only has power because you give it to him, you are more powerful than you know, OP. I agree with the others, get some legal advice and definitely stop responding to the things he says to you. I cant begin to tell you how liberating it is to no longer respond when you're threatened and belittled.

Get legal advice. Get the house valued. Then go from there. You don’t have to provide him with proof or evidence of anything to want out. You can just want out because you are a grown up and you don’t want to be with him anymore. You don’t need reasons and you don’t have to give him reasons. Just say “I don’t love you anymore and I want this marriage to be over”

Contact Women's Aid. An abusive partner is most dangerous when you leave him. You need to make a safety plan. And Women's Aid will help you with that.
Whoever is the resident parent will get the house to live in. As long as the kids want to live with you, he will be made to leave the house.
But please contact Women's Aid. You need practical advice and support from someone who understands your situation.

No that’s outdated advice there about being allowed to stay in the house. Everyone’s situation is different so op needs legal advice.

Please do not let your teens bribe you emotionally into staying. Oh diddumd if they don’t want to live in a flat, sometimes one of life’s curve balls may help them realise it’s not all about them, however o think if you get thee to a lawyer it may well not be necessary.

It is usual that if you have the kids, you can stay in the house. Unless there is enough equity to sell up and buy another house and split equity. The point is that no one is going to leave OP in a position of being in a 1 bed flat with 2 teenagers.
But ring Women's Aid. That is the key thing. You are afraid he will hurt you, the dog and maybe the kids. You all need advice about protection.

You sound tremendously brave, OP. And I'm not just saying that. To have reached this resolution, after having had the life you've had, is a huge deal that takes emotional courage. Many women would have made excuses for not leaving, or minimised the impact on the DC because it's inconvenient to look those things in the face. Your honesty and strength do you credit. Rely on those qualities.

The second thing I wanted to say was this: you need a game plan. You need to manage this situation very, very carefully to ensure your safety and that of your children. This may mean not having a conversation with your OH about the split until you are very, very far down the road of having it all organised, including alternative accommodation. So you need to start planning your exit with military precision. See a lawyer. Get advice from Womens' Aid about your living situation. Be pragmatic about solutions, but don't take any shit and definitely don't accept a bad deal just to get out. Tell a minimal number of people, and only those you trust 100%, what you are doing.

Good luck. We are all rooting for you.

This sounds eerily familiar. My ExH also said - why should I leave - i've done nothing wrong (obviously had no awareness of his emotional abuse etc)

For a week I kept calmly asking him to leave. He finally upped and went back to his mothers after 2 weeks of asking. HOWEVER. This is where the similarities end. I wasn't afraid that he would hurt me, children or the dog physically.

You need to go to the police now and speak to them about your concerns and ask their advice. You can get support arranging an order to have him removed from the house and you can also get help with the dog. I understand there are specialised charities who offer foster homes for dogs in domestic situations (temporary or permanent) Please do google for these.

Please, please do your homework before you ask him to move out. Realistically I think your best option if the house is in joint names would be to sell and move on. I had to do this in a previous relationship and it was the best option all round.

pig - I don't know what to say.

I have a wise friend who often says to me (about him) "don't poke a snake" - she means that as I have no where to go and no real plan, just telling him its all over and watching him combust is like poking a poisonous snake and then hoping it won't bite.

You have lots of research you can do. Lawyer, accountant, women’s aid. Each bit of information you learn will lead to 5 other bits. The trick is to get out of your own head (you sound to be a bit of an overthinker like me) and start. Start saying things out aloud, to knowledgeable kind people. Options will open up in front of you. Each baby step gives you confidence, even posting on here, and confidence will give you strength for the next baby step. You’ll stop thinking (or really caring much) about him and his actions and choices. You’ll reserve your energy for your next step...away.

Don’t involve your kids too much in your decision making, or in double-guessing your actions. You are the mum, and you have their best interests at heart. They’ll have to trust you, follow you, and get on with their new life with you. Prepare yourself that they may not thank you for quite some time. That’s ok, they are just kids.

You sound like a terrific strong intelligent woman. You probably remember that you were one once, even if you feel a bit wobbly now. Main thing is, you’ve got it in you. And now you’ve got all of us too!

Yes OP, I think I know how you feel - I'm scared of my ex and it made me delay separating for a long time, I was just so anxious and scared. And like yours he is Mr Lovely, everyone thinks he's the nicest bloke ever, including him. I see huge amounts of suppressed anger, negativity and nastiness, I've suffered gaslighting, endless passive aggressive undermining, laziness and selfishness from him, and in my mind he could be capable of anything - but most people think he's god's gift. My DC however see through him (without prompting by me) as they experience his "domestic" self rather than the outward persona. They have also had anxiety problems.

What you say about him denying everything, asking for the "proof", or the time and date he did/said something, is very familiar.

As your DC are teens I don't think they will have to spend time with him if they don't want to. Agree with everyone else, contact women's aid and a solicitor. You are working and you have a house that can be sold – you can do this. And you are the adult and if you and the DC have to move, you do that - yes it may be tough and not what they want but there is also a huge benefit to them to see you, at whatever stage, putting your foot down and saying no to this. That's a lesson they need to learn about relationships - that being like your H is not an acceptable option.

He is very devious and so if angry I suspect he will do something to himself, me or the dog if I go out (

Fingers crossed it’s himself.

prove it - c'mon, where's your proof? What was the time and date I did that? Where are the witnesses?

Lord, he is pathetic, isn’t he?

pig - I meant I did't know what to say as what you wrote was so kind sniffs

After the counselling session yesterday with youngest DC, I was looking at some old photos, we have 1000s stored on line, I found one from when that DC was a few weeks old. H is sat on a bench holding the baby, and my other little DC is by his side aged 2 years and 1 month. When I saw that photo I immediately remembered he'd gone apeshit at me about something that wasn't right - I was "blaming him" for things that weren't his fault - well, nothing ever can be. I felt so sad looking at my children then and knowing what they were about to face.

I did that to them, I left them in that relationship because I was scared.

Also agree with PP that you are brave, and that this takes bravery.

After my separation one of my dearest friends who is very perceptive told me how brave I was in a card she sent me. I cried with gratitude that she understood.

Get legal advice. He's not entitled to the house. Divorce starts at 50%.
Oh, and mine hadn't done anything wrong either, although the police disagreed with him...

Hi Op, just reiterating some of the good advice you have received on this thread really, yy definitely a priority to get legal advice then you can weigh up the options, would it be possible to sell the house split the proceeds, & then add your pension to your proceeds to buy maybe a smaller place, that way having the security of your own roof without the spectre of an interest only mortgage & thereby giving you & your dcs a greater feeling of security, I have no idea if this could be doable, but once again urge you to get proper legal advice, good luck💐

Even more people have come on and said kind things more sniffs

Many - that's because you have become so used to unkindness that it is your 'normal'. The world doesn't have to be like that. Once you get away, I honestly think you will feel relief and joy that this whole nightmare is over.

You are not a failure as a mother because you stayed with this bloke. Like many of us who have been in dysfunctional relationships, you've taken some time to realise what was really going on. And, in a typical way, you've only seen it when it's another victim - your DD - not you, who is suffering. Don't focus on the past. It's done. Look to the future. You can give your kids an amazing role model now, by walking away and refusing to take any more crap. But you need to do it in a way that keeps both you and them safe, which is why planning this meticulously is going to be important.

You deserve kindness. Don't ever, ever forget that.

You totally need legal advice before you do anything else.

You are in a strong position. YOU have the income here so are not reliant on him.

Until the kids grow up? They are. That sort of order is rarely made now and tthe sale is usually triggered when the child reaches 18

And you can change it... at whatever stage you take control, make a change for the better and remove yourself and your children from this situation you will have broken the cycle of abuse and your children and their children will benefit from it. You have the power to change their future. Hold their souls in the palm of your hand and make the leap.

oh, @ManyElephants, this sounds so frightening. I must echo what other posters have said - you are being phenomenally brave, and I totally understand your fear that he might be a danger to you or other members of the family. Please do take the advice to go to Women's Aid or another charity who will be able to help you proceed safely. Also, if you have trusted friends, I would make them aware of your situation if not now then after you ask him to leave, so that you have somebody looking out for you and backing up your version of events if he starts gaslighting. Don't jump to assume you will not be believed; I'm not saying it definitely won't happen, but don't let that fear hold you back from doing what's right for you.

I don't think keeping the kids in their home, with their new bedrooms, is a negligible thing. Why should he screw up their lives? Just because you and he are breaking up, the kids don't deserve to have all that is stable and familiar taken away from them; I don't have children myself yet but my own parents divorced very unpleasantly when my sibling and I were about the same age as your kids, and having to move house/area on top of everything else would have been awful. They need as much consistency as you can salvage for them.

Your DC might feel it's too late now (and at 17 they feel on the cusp of adulthood, with childhood finished and behind them), but I assure it isn't - it never is. Your kids still need you and you are still a unit; there is so much future for the three of you. You can make it right. I wish you so much strength, love and luck.

Manyelephants So sad - but you can't change the past but you can make a better future for you all. Get advice - it is worth the money and will help you feel empowered. Get copies and the originals if possible of passports, house documents, assets etc and keep them somewhere (or with someone) safe.

I think you will have to sell the house - it looks like he would put up a fight and won't want you getting "his" house. It's only a house - I know people who have fought tooth and nail in divorces to keep the house and then sell six months later - it's only bricks and mortar and you want to move on, not be stuck with constant reminders of your husband. The DC will adapt - they will be freer and happier they just can't imagine it atm.

You have options - you don't necessarily have to use up your equity renting. I found out last week that despite having been a joint tenant with my H in the past (so not a first time buyer) that I would be eligible for local shared/affordable housing as" I would struggle to but otherwise". There are also new products to help older (us over 50's) people get a mortgage (Post office for new buyers and one for remortgages on interest only homes)
www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/mortgageshome/article-5717755/Aldermore-offers-lifeline-mortgage-pensioners-debt.html
You could rent until your youngest finishes his schooling and then buy a place in a cheaper area.

You did your best in the past under difficult circumstances - don't beat yourself up but make the effort to move on to a brighter future now.

Teens can be quite ruthless and selfish. They can adapt to a flat.