He says he will never forgive me

[Pickapart]

This is probably going to be quite long. I'm asking for advice as I don't have any close friends I can talk to and I don't have a great relationship with my mum.

DH and I met 13 years ago, we have been married 12 years and have a 4 year old DS. During the first year of our relationship (before marriage) I didn't treat DH well very well. I remained friends with my ex partner of 9 years (the relationship ended 4 years before I met my DH) and I would still speak with him or have a drink with him from time to time, there was absolutely nothing romantic in it and neither of us had those feelings for each other any more. I used to talk (a lot) about what a cool/ great guy he was to my now DH, he was in truth a selfish dick but I really didn't want my lovely and very confident DH to think I was a weak, low esteem doormat who had spent 9 years of her life with a person who in all honesty wasn't good enough even on his best day. Obviously this hurt and upset DH and DH obviously couldn't stand him even though they hadn't met. One day we in a were in a pub together and ex walked in with his friends - I panicked and instead of ignoring him I walked over to say hello and left DH standing alone at the bar. It was a shitty thing for me to do and I did it because I was afraid of a confrontation - I was weak and selfish and I did it to save my feelings rather than think about DH's. To put everything in context XP's sister was also my best friend (since years before XP and I got together) and I was very close to the family. Obviously we had a huge row about what happened, I never really apologised.

DH and I were emigrating overseas and having a leaving party - he expressly asked me not to invite my best friend or her mum (of course XP wasn't invited) as it was about us and not the past. Both of them turned up at the party and it was awful. Another huge row and I didn't really apologise.

We emigrated, married and settled overseas. I cut off all of XP's family. Many huge rows over the years during which I apologised, but the apologies weren't great, I'm not a good communicator really and find feelings really hard to express. (Previous abusive relationship before XP and abandonment issues from parents marriage breakup when little). DH struggled for years with feeling I betrayed him at the beginning when he was giving everything and I was holding back, I wouldn't let go of the past and my friends because I was scared and didn't fully trust him yet. He went onto antidepressants for 6 years and has told me that this was a major contributing factor to his anxiety. He was vengeful for a couple of years post marriage and treated me poorly at times. There was never any infidelity on either side.
I finally gave him a full and frank apology with the true reasons for my behaviour (selfishness, fear, weakness) 10 years later during another Massive fight about it. He said he could forgive now he had a real apology
We had a row a couple of nights ago about sex of all things, he feels he initiates most of the time which he does. I blew it out of proportion and said he was saying I was crap and boring in bed etc, we went to bed on the row and next morning he text to say let's move on and not fight and I sent him a scathing text back saying he couldn't take back what he'd said and I'd never feel the same, we should never have married etc - I know, I'm a dick :( . We had another huge row when he got in and it transpires that he can never forgive that first year and I'll just have to live with it, he says no man could forgive that. He says he has resigned himself to the fact that we are human and not perfect and we have to live with each other's failings ( mine are many I know) and we both have the marriage we deserve. I asked him why he doesn't leave - he's still young enough to meet another and have a great marriage and more kids ( which we wanted but I'm to old now). He said he loves me and he doesn't want a blended family, he's 38 and this is his lot in life, we have to suck it up.

95% of the time we have a great time! I love him, he loves me and we have a nice life together. I don't want to leave him. But this has permeated or marriage from the start. I should have apologised sooner I know, he was hurting and I did nothing to stop that. But if he won't forgive me how can we ever move on - how can I ever be anyone but that person who walked over to her ex and left him standing. I hate the thought he has 'settled' for a marriage instead of being happy. I don't know what to do.

You need marriage counselling.

Are you in Oz land where it's hard to come back with your DC if DH says no?

Your DH sounds like a controlling dickhead TBH. And you sound beaten down by it.

I am still friends with my ex, if I saw him in a bar of course I’d go up to him and say hi. My OH wouldn’t give a moment’s thought to being “left at the bar” because he’s a grown adult, not a toddler. And never would my OH tell me who I could or couldn’t invite to a party.

I think you should run with the notion that you’ll never get past it and move on. Your DH has been holding this shit over your head for a decade. Once you’re out from under his control and manipulation, you’ll see that he has been bringing you down for years.

You love your ex (maybe not deeply, but it's there), not your husband

For goodness sake, why did your DH marry you if he found this so unforgivable? What does it matter if you were friendly with your ex at that time? The fact remains that he was your ex and it was your DH you were choosing to commit to. I remember when I was going out with DH before we were married he was on friendly terms with an ex and helped her with moving house: I wasn't best pleased with it at the time, but the fact remained that he was with me and not her and it's never bothered me subsequently.

And why on earth could you not have your best friend to your leaving do? No normal man demands that his wife give up all her friends, it's absolutely weird to expect it.

The fact that he is still holding this ridiculous grievance over you after 13 years simply shows that he's a controlling arsehole, and it's dreadful that he's beaten you down so much that you actually believe you were at fault. You really need to tell him that if he can't grow up and stop being such a dickhead then he really does need to get out. Start making plans for an independent life when you don't have to apologise for having normal friendships.

To each their own, but this sounds like a horrible abusive relationship to me. Why would you have a going-away party and not invite your best friend or anyone you wanted? And why on earth would that be a problem so many years later?

Honestly if this is the worst you have done in all these years, he's got himself a saint for a wife.

Your ex sounds like a dick I'm afraid. It's really not such a big thing that you went to speak to your ex and left your boyfriend where he was. It's hard to believe that he's held on to that for ten long years!
There does seem to be a lot of arguments and bad feeling though, so maybe marriage counselling may be a good thing.
Alternatively, your dh may benefit from counselling on his own to look at why he holds a grudge over a relatively small thing for ten years...

It all sounds so petty and so so dysfunctional. He is a victim and you are a doormat. Get some self esteem and ditch the twat.

I think you’ve gone from one type of abusive relationship to another. Can you just hear yourself? Your husband cannot forgive you for saying your ex was a lovely man (even though he wasn’t), you kept in contact with your ex, went up to say hello in a bar and his sister and his mother came to your leaving do.

The upshot is, because of this, he went on antidepressants, treated you like shit for a couple of years and has told you he can never forgive you for the first year of your relationship.

I think the most reproachable thing from you here is that you didn’t introduce your dh to your ex. If your dh didn’t like your behaviour, he could have chosen to end the relationship or given you and ultimatum and he didn’t. All of this is not a massive crime, once explained and certainly doesn’t warrant the treatment you are receiving.

You gave a heartfelt apology, which he either should have accepted and moved on from or rejected and split up with you - ideally before you married. So now, there really is nothing to forgive. Each to their own, my love, but I wouldn’t be wanting a life sentence for telling a few white lies and having some self esteem issues.

Thanks for the replies everyone. I really appreciate the time you have taken.
To answer a few questions; yes I'm in Oz and no I don't want to leave, my little boy adores his dad and his dad adores him. I couldn't do that to either of them. I do love DH very much and see myself getting old with him, for all of his flaws he's generally a good bloke - it's just this one bloody thing that's souring things. Gnu I have asked him the same question too - why did u marry me. He says because he loves me more than anything...... But then he'd forgive wouldn't he?
Godowneasy I think u are right - counselling May help him. Mistressdeecee I appreciate where u are coming from but no, definitely no love for my XP our relationship ended 16 years ago for exactly that reason. I could have gone back but didn't want him.
But yes he is being a twat and I am beaten down by it now. I'm just tired.........

Your H sounds very controlling. The incident was years ago and it wasn’t that bad. You were being polite. But all these years later it’s still brought up. I think you are in an abusive relationship with your H. He has isolated you in Australia too.

The worst thing you did was be a little tactless at the start of your relationship and say to your current boyfriend that your ex was a great guy. That’s it. That’s your great crime. That’s what your ‘D’H has spent 13 years beating you over the head with. He’s a controlling prick and the sooner you see that, the better. You would be far better off without him.

You need marriage counseling TOGETHER.
You can bring all this up and sort it out and put it behind you.

Good luck.

I said TOGETHER in capital letters because you mentioned that counseling would help HIM, I just meant you should both go and get everything out in the open in front of a neutral party.
Then, whatever you decide to do, the air will be cleared.
Holding on to all this is eating both of you up and I’m struggling to see what you are apologising for at all.

Book the counseling and best wishes to you x

I’m a bit at all these posters saying that your current DH is abusive.
I think you both love each other very much but the issues you face are too much to resolve on your own. You should definitely look into marriage counselling. Kudos to you for being so brave as to admit your previous bad behaviour and the root cause of it.

he expressly asked me not to invite my best friend or her mum (of course XP wasn't invited) as it was about us and not the past

Anyone who does this is abusive, IMHO. I don't claim to be an expert on abuse, but separating the OP from her best friend is totally weird.

OP is not complaining about other things, fortunately enough, but I don't think couples therapy is the way to go here.

GnotherGnu has expressed it better than I can, but just to say I agree with every word of Gnu's post and I'll go one further by saying your DH sounds controlling and abusive.

He is right. You should never have got married.

But he is a dick for never letting go of things from the past, keeping on bringing them up. He has not fully committed if this is his approach, and he has the gall to accuse you of not giving it your all..

I think a lawyer is the way to go here, not couples therapy.

And he needs a psychologist to sort out his anxiety and explain to him where it comes from.
Hint: it wasn't your fault.
Beating you over the head with this is unreasonable, petulant, and controlling.

You are not going to win here. He is going to make sure of that. You are always going to feel you owe him something.

Obviously this and obviously that.

It's not obvious that he should be upset that you were still on good terms with an ex partner. It's not obvious why he'd be upset that you didn't snub the guy or cut out your friends. All of that was completely over the top by him that first year and he's used it as a stick to beat you with ever since.

Have you ever challenged him and told him he should be over this by now and that what you did wasn’t that big a deal, or have you always responded with groveling and scraping and abasing yourself in the quest for forgiveness? Because if it’s the latter it seems he has a convenient stick to beat you with whenever he feels like you need to be put in your place.

I think you are in an abusive relationship with your H. He has isolated you in Australia too.
I don't think so. Emigrating is a v stressful thing, and it looks like your long-term difficulty with communication has caused underlying bad feeling for a long time. Is there anything in particular which has caused this all to resurface again recently? It's good that you've finally cleared the air, but I think it takes a while to work through long term difficulties, so don't expect everything to be fine in a short space of time.

Worse part about that whole post is the fact that he's actually convinced you that you did something that needs to be 'forgiven'
Or maybe it's the fact that he forbade you to invite friends for whatever controlling reason and you didn't see then what a tool you were with.

If he truly cannot 'forgive' something so stupid and so long ago he needs to seek help for himself. I suspect it is more about controlling behaviour than any real hurt feelings. He's a tool, no doubt, but he's also got you believing his shit OP and that is truly damaging for you and your children

Worse part about that whole post is the fact that he's actually convinced you that you did something that needs to be 'forgiven'

That ^

It sounds like DH enjoys having something (insubstantial) to beat you with and also as an excuse for not sorting his own issues out. Counselling could help if he genuinely wants to change and see the light

Hi Frakka, yes I have challenged him many times over the years, hence the huge rows and I do still stand my ground. I've told him that I can't and won't apologise anymore for it, I accept and understand that I have hurt him but as one poster put it - a life sentence is bloody unreasonable. He needs to accept it and move on.

Just for background it isn't something that comes up daily - probably about twice a year, we don't argue very frequently and get along well for the most part. I feel that the only thing to do now is refuse to engage with him on the subject.

He would be receptive to marriage counselling though so that's a definite option. Thanks again for everyone's opinions :)