DH wants to move abroad and I really, really don't want to.

[BayLeaves]

I don't know what to do.

DH wants to move abroad, ideally to his home country in Europe.

I don't want to move. We live in the town I grew up in, I lived elsewhere for 12 years and we moved back here 4 years ago. I don't find it that easy to make new friendships but recently I've finally made some good mum friends and I'm also near my parents, I have two separate grandparents living nearby from different sides, as well as various aunts, uncles, etc. I feel so happy and settled here, I love our house and I love all the things to do locally with our 2 kids, I just really enjoy it. We have a 3 year old and a 2 month old and I feel like I really really need that social/support network.

We've got a new baby and even a week or so after he was born DH kept talking about wanting to move away. It made me feel so sad because I feel like even the birth of a new baby was not special enough to keep him away from this obsession with moving away.

DH has a long commute and until recently I did the same commmute. Now I've been made redundant and so I'm on indefinite "maternity leave". He's fed up with the commute and wants to advance his career elsewhere, he's even been headhunted by other companies in various locations. There aren't any other good jobs in our field locally. I think moving far away is DH's solution to that problem.

As I'm not actually working or contributing income, am entitled to less of a say? Do I need to just move wherever DH goes now that he's the only breadwinner? I sometimes wonder if I'd rather be a single mum living in a council flat but still live here with my friends and family, rather than have a big house with DH somewhere else so that he can advance his career.

I don't know what to do but DH seems miserable about being here. I just wish I'd know his intentions before we settled down in my home town, bought a house and had two kids here

Of course your view is important but it's not more important surely than that of your husband. He seems to have got the thin end of the wedge there.... commuting to a job he's not really going anywhere and a long way from his family ( who presumably would like to be involved in their Grandchildrens lives ? ) Can you remember what it's like to commute? It's really really boring. I'm not saying you should up sticks and head off to Switzerland now but I think you should seriously consider it at some point when the children are quite portable. If not there then at least consider another compromise which may offer him some career progression. Otherwise perhaps you need to return to work part-time and allow him an opportunity to also work part-time and build up his own network of friends in your current area.... but it seems like you
Can't have it all ways.

I really hope you read this......I'm a mum of a young daughter -she is 18 months now and for the past 6 months we have been living in Europe as it was a joint wish of mine and my husbands ( neither of us are from this country but have always loved it) since moving out, I have been completely isolated - my husband works long hours and although my daughter is soon to start nursery - allowing me to go to work - the lack of a support network has been the most challenging time of my life. I don't speak the language and although I am learning - something I didn't consider before moving away is how dependent other families are on each other in this country - that even going to the park you don't tend to meet other mums as such as they are all out at work and it's the grannies that have the little ones...so it's even harder even when you do make the effort to try and form friendships with other mums. 2 months is too soon - he should have been having conversations about this with you before your second child. You need your support network - I wish I had mine. You most certainly do have an equal say - and make sure you gout about it - as if you don't, and make the move - the only people that will listen to you will be 100's of miles away. Please also take the advice of others regarding children being taken to another country and mums unable to get them back - it's an ugly truth and I know people in my short time here in that situation. My last word is - due to lack of support and isolation I am seriously considering ending my marriage and returning to the uk - you need that support network so much - tell your husband you will consider it and if you want make s move before the kids get to school age.

Hi BayLeaves,

No matter how good an experience you may think it is, I would stick with your gut feeling. I wish I had. Do not underestimate how important having friends and family close by is.
11 years living in my husband's country, 3 children I have practically raised myself because my husband usually returns from work at 9pm and there is no other support, the end of my career, the resentment that incurs...all the sunshine and outdoor lifestyle tripe is no recompense for that. I don't want to sound bitter and negative, just believe me when I say the grass isn't always greener.

Moving here has broken me

I think you should find a compromise. Why not agree to you living where you are with your DC for the next two years and give him the opportunity to find a job and forge a career in Switzerland?

Switzerland will offer fantastic opportunities. Healthcare and education are excellent. However, it is very expensive. I've known breadwinners who work in Switzerland whose families have decided to remain in the UK as it is cheaper to commute than move the family there.

The situation your family is in at the moment does not sound good. You are out of a job, your DH faces a long commute and poor career opportunities. I think it is understandable that your DH is looking at opportunities elsewhere.

After two years, you can then decide what you want to do.

Google The Hague convention before you make any decisions. You will not be allowed to relocate the children back to the U.K. Without your husbands permission and even the most predictable person can surprise you in certain circumstances. I would not go in your circumstances but then I'm out the other side. A watertight contract when I was pregnant meant I got my kids home but still cost me £40k in legal fees defending myself in the high court.

Don't forget to think of your career future too. Will you be able to find satisfying work there when you finish maternity leave? What compromises are you going to have? I live in Italy and found it very tough when the kids were small (as far as activities are concerned the UK is much better for kids). The compromise was that we spend August in the UK.

I think that now would be a good time to give Switzerland a go. I think it's much better when children are little rather than when they are in school (language, curriculum etc).

How do you get on with DH's family? I'm the foreigner in the UK and have found DH's family fantastic and supportive so it's all positive even though my family are abroad. It's also very easy for me and my family to fly over so I see them every few weeks anyway.

On the friend making front - I would think it wouldn't be that bad. There are many international people in Switzerland and if London is anything to go by, expats tend to be quite open and keen to make friends.

Good luck working something out- it'd be a real shame for your relationship to suffer over this if you're otherwise happy together.

If you feel you ought to say yes to a trial say you want to return in time for eldest to start school in UK. I'd be exactly like you (and have a similarly keen to move DH) I'm not keen to go anywhere while kids are happy and settled in school and I'm happy with where we are. But sometimes I wish I'd been braver, you might love It!

Has your DH explained to you what he aims to achieve from working overseas? Is he hoping to go to Switzerland for a promotion that would help the family in the long run? Is he hoping that it would be forever, or just a couple of years?

Relatively unusual but before DD went to school I worked all over the world with her - Italy, Germany, Thailand, Australia. We had so many experiences, she heard so many languages and tried so many foods. It was truly a fantastic time and something I don't regret. My mantra was always that I could go home, working overseas is not a one-way ticket.

As previous posters have said however, be careful about parental rights when you get to another country. My DP is from the UK so not an issue, but for you it might be.

I'm in Australia now, so it's not easy to nip back to the UK. From Switzerland however, you don't need to be isolated. When I worked in Amsterdam and Milan I used to fly back regularly [I'm working here on the assumption that an international relocation would pay well enough for you to do this].

The thing with Switzerland is that it has such a high number of expats, meaning a lot of families who do not have their childhood friends and families around and who have to buid this up. So it's really, really easy to make friends, find playdates and exclange babysitting. Each bigger city has several expat Facebook groups, not to mention organised baby and toddler classes etc.

Where would you be moving?

OP is not 'out of work', she is on maternity leave with a two month old baby. So that doesn't make a 'bad situation' in my book.

Plus, lots of posters have said 'her poor DH, he wants to be near his family too'. Not one word in the OP's posts has said this from her husband. It's all about moving for career reasons, and she's also said they probably wouldn't see any more of him than they do now.

Fed up of hearing that the UK is not a nice place to live, with tolerant people. There are plenty of worse places to live and some of those are 8n the EU! I don't think Switzerland has a reputation for being particularly welcoming or easy to settle in. I read on a thread here that foreigners have no right to access the nuclear shelters in Switzerland - I hope that's not true, but I don't think that would happen in the UK.

Personally I wouldn't move. I think you will end up isolated at home with 2 small children, unable to work amd with no support system. Your dh otoh, will still be out at work for most of the time.
I'm not seeing what you gain from this. You are already making a sacrifice for your family (in career terms) by sah.
I have lived in Germany for dh's job - it's hard when you have small dc, no support network and cannot work. Your options to build your own life are limited.
As much as you married a foreigner, so did your dh. He chose to start a family here and that is when you most need your own network around you.
Not saying don't ever move out of your home town - making his work life easier is important too, but I wouldn't move abroad.

OP is not 'out of work', she is on maternity leave with a two month old baby. So that doesn't make a 'bad situation' in my book.

The OP has been made redundant. She described it as being on indefinite "maternity leave".

OP is not 'out of work', she is on maternity leave with a two month old baby. So that doesn't make a 'bad situation' in my book.

The OP has been made redundant. She described it as being on indefinite "maternity leave".

The OP has also stated that there aren't any other good jobs in their field locally. Her DH currently has a long commute.

I'll go against the grain here and say as you aren't working then I think that it makes sense to use this time to help support your husband's career. This was almost an identical case to mine. I wanted time at home with the kids and so I thought I had less of a say not being the bread winner.

Many years later, DH's career has progressed much more than it would have done in the UK, and we all benefit from that. I work now and it's an opportunity I would not have had should we have stayed in the UK.
We have bilingual children and I would say that we have a pretty good life style - skiing, holidays, large house, culturally rich, lovely weather, walking, great friends, savings etc. . It was really hard for the first year (I moved with a week old baby), I still miss home, struggle with the language, don't feel really integrated but the benefits outweigh the pluses. I was a city gal and now I love the mountains and outdoors (though not quite as much as my DH). Where's perfect though?

I massively disagree with the notion that as a sahp she should have less of a say. This is her life too.
And as is often pointed out on mn, marriages don't always last and being a sahp in a foreign country, where she may not he able to find work or leave with her dc, puts her at a huge disadvantage.

Nowhere is perfect but I think you need to go into this with your eyes open. Even if you go for a 'trial' there is every chance that you may not be able to relocate the children if you want to move back. I would only go if you a) were happy with the fact that it may be forever or b) had a contract drawn up beforehand by a lawyer specializing in child abduction law and had funds to defend it if it came to it.

Sorry to resurrect this thread after a week has passed but I didn't want to make a new thread. I'm just feeling really down this evening. I keep having ups and downs about the idea of moving. DH has now sent off two job applications. Initially I said I would not proof read his cover letter as I don't support the idea of moving. We then had a big long chat which was perfectly civilised both of us ended quite emotional and upset. The next day I felt bad and agreed to help with the job application. But I still don't want to move.

My son starts pre-school for the first time this week and I should be all excited about it, and I kind of am, but I keep suppressing feelings of excitement and joy about things that are coming up here because I am worrying about leaving everything behind when we move I know I'm sounding really melodramatic here.

I have had a couple of really stressful days with the two kids and I'm worried about how I'd cope in a new place. At the moment I'm having mood swings, tiredness mainly I think, but I don't want to get full-on PND. Meh I don't know what to do.

I even read out the responses on this thread to DH so now he knows the full range of wise MN advice, from the positive to the negative!

For me, it was really simple. I knew that I wouldn't be able to cope with the lack of a support network and being the 'foreigner' in my dual culture relationship when the children were tiny. I felt very vulnerable, and knew I'd feel isolated and awful in his home country at that time point. So, we didn't go. He was happy to stay in the UK and had friends and a life here, so the cost to me would have been high, and the opportunity for him (to move there, to move elsewhere in Europe) was tempting, but not for me. Others may love starting again elsewhere not knowing the language and making all new friends, I knew I wouldn't and I also wanted to continue my career which would have been hard.

Many years later, I have a much stronger sense of self, children who aren't so dependent, far stronger mental health and don't need the support system in quite the same way to live my everyday life. I could be the 'foreigner' now as I am much more self-sufficient now I'm out of the baby and toddler fog of those first few years.

I don't really like that he is sending off job applications when you are clearly so unhappy.
If it turns out that you are married to a man who will ultimately push for what he wants even if it makes you vulnerable legally and financially and is causing you to be genuinely unhappy, then that is not a man you want to move abroad with.
I know it is hard for him to always be the foreigner and never live at home but you've had children here, it's where your support network is - children change everything. You can't always be strictly fair and 50/50 on choosing where you live. I think your need outweighs his wants at the moment.

He's been here since his teens and did his whole secondary education here, has British citizenship, his accent is barely noticeable, etc. so it doesn't really feel like he's a foreigner here in the UK, he's been well and truly settled here until now.

I guess it depends what kind of person you are Bay, but I would always want to try the uknown safe in the knowledge that the known will always be there waiting for me if I change my mind. Nothing is irreversible, especially as you're so locally anchored. You'll always have those roots should you wish to go back.
Switzerland will also be a paradise for the kids.

Thats just my POV.