Can a relationship survive alcoholism

[MiniTheMinx]

I have been with DP for two years. Living together for one. He drinks, a lot, I think. 2lr of cider normally, at weekends it can be much more.

He's a good man, kind, funny and sensitive. He treats me well and is very affectionate. However the physical side of the relationship has always been a problem.

When he drinks he loses all of inhibitions and can be very sexual, but he can't always maintain an erection and rarely orgasms. When he is sober he is tired, more withdrawn and rarely interested.

He has admitted that before he met me he drank more. He was also no angel. He is very extroverted and attractive. But he's also sensitive and when not drinking seems to suffer quite low self esteem.

My problem is this, is he an alcoholic? I am signed up for years of feeling insecure because I think he is impulsive when drinking and his insecurity seems to have led him to risky sexual behaviour? Plus, it's only now he is reducing the amount he drinks that I realise his funny social side that I fell in love with is largely dependent on being drunk.

Can a relationship survive one partner trying to go sober? I have been tearful for weeks because he seems so tired, withdrawn and intimacy is dwindling. Is this normal?

If you have children, you have to walk away. Living with a man who is drunk every day/ evening is unacceptable. If he is drinking more than a 2 litre bottle of cider on weekend days, he is not fit to be parenting.

I know I've already been harsh and blunt but your last post is worrying.

Codependent doesn't just mean full on physically caring, buying alcohol for etc it means emotionally enmeshed in an unhealthy relationship with an addict or abuser such that your presence becomes an integral part of the cycle of abuse/addiction.

You are very firmly in that position now. Failing to recognise then acknowledge his problem, talking to your kids about how his drinking makes them feel (but not leaving), talking to him about how his drinking is bad, accepting his plans to carry on drinking but a bit less, allowing him to avoid calling himself an alcoholic, thinking you love him when he has never been sober so what you actually love is drunk him...

I think your normal is being around addicts so you don't respond in a normal way.

Also; What I won't tolerate ever is chaos around my children. I have told him that if ever he loses control of life, mind, or finances that I'm out.

He already has lost control, read back your posts about his behaviour and how chaotic he behaves when drunk around the children. You have an alcoholic drinking in front of the children AND behaving chaotically already.

He knows how much I love him and he understands that I want more from life than just looking after others. Should he deal with it for me? No not to please me. But I made it very clear that if he loved me like he says he does he wouldn't continue to drink.

But you don't know him because you have never seen him as a sober man. What is under that drinking is a load of mess and a manchild who has chosen to drink rather than become an adult.

He is trying and has been cutting back but he still won't acknowledge he is alcoholic.

No, becaus the 'cutting down' is about still drinking. He is trying to keep alcohol in his life and get you off his back.

He is an addict, it is nothing to do with love for other people and everything to do with his lack of coping skills with life without addiction.

Mini

Can I say this from the other side. I AM an alcoholic - and I highly admit it. Years have cost me my health (stopped virtually eating and god knows how I am still alive) - alcoholism is a disease and if affects no class, gender or religion - it is also a killer. My issues stemmed from an incredibly bad marriage to which I loved him unconditionally however, mentally, he broke me down. I spiralled and have never come out of it and fear I never will.

I am so pleased that your family are pragmatic, grounded and understand the situation - and that of course, will support you immensely.

I wish you all the very best with your decision(s).

Also from the other side. I absolutely had a serious alcohol problem which cost me more than money. Four years ago I realised I had to stop or my DC would hate me more than they already did and dh would have no choice but to leave. I will have been completely sober for four years this coming month. I completely feel for you having realised what I did for so many years to so many people but he absolutely has to accept that abstinence is the only way, and until he does you are just fire fighting. He won't be able to do just to please you as you mentioned but because he wants to. I do hope he can.

mini - you don't have to do anything you do want to do.

It might help [even though its painful] to find out more.

There is plenty of time for you to consider what you want to do but it really helps to connect with more support.

I remember being so so scared when I first phoned Al-anon but my life had become so chaotic that for me there was no other choice.

I was becoming more and more crazy yet I was the one who didn't drink. I went to my first meeting in desperation and cried the whole all way through. I didn't have to say or do anything. I was a total mess but no one judged me. No one told me what to do or how to feel. No one said I had to leave him. It was the first time in my life that I felt safe.

OP - I'm another one with an alcoholic husband. For me most of the time life is good. He doesn't in any way drink the amount your DP does or as regularly but he has an issue that to deal with any stress or anxiety in his life he will turn to the bottle. And hide it. When it blows up, it blows up badly.

The alcohol isn't actually the main problem in our relationship. The problem is the lies and alcoholics do lie. It's a common trait and not just my DH. They lie about how much they're drinking, they lie about whether they've done things, they lie about small things that then turn into bigger things and they lie about how they're not lying. It is hard to have a relationship where both you and your DP know he won't always be truthful.

Don't get involved in policing alcohol. If he wants to drink, he'll manage to drink, you policing it won't change anything. However, don't assume that calm and collected will make a difference either. I've tried that as well. It doesn't help! He still lies because (a) he just does lie and always has and (b) he knows he's let me down - alcoholics tend to be people pleasers who don't like confrontation.

I should add that whilst, like most people, DH is less inhibited and more outgoing when he's had a few drinks he's not a fundamentally different person. He stopped drinking for over a year at one point and he was still the same person. Of course he didn't particularly enjoy going on big nights out where everyone but him was getting completely plastered but then who would. He was otherwise his normal self though. The difference in your DP drinking/not drinking that you mention would concern me.

For me, at the moment anyway, the good outweighs the bad. We formally split up once and got back together and I've never regretted that. I'm 10+ years down the line and have three kids with DH though. You're right at the beginning of this. Looking back, two years in and with no joint children I'd say you really should leave.

For what it's worth, I have had 'you are co-dependent' thrown at me several times (and usually on here!) and it annoys me. I'm not, I'm really not. Yes I would find the idea of walking away from my relationship terrible but not because I feel the need to support him or because I feel he needs me. I do think if I left (and took the children) he's collapse into an alcoholic heap most likely and so that has been a factor in me staying in the past (for the children's relationship with their dad, not for my guilt). However, he doesn't need my support on a day to day basis, over and above any normal relationship where people support each other.

I suspect there will be a few. But what tends to happen is the partners of addicts start buying into the addict's delusions in order to survive. I bet their children would be more likely to tell the full story, whether they speak it or act it out in their own relationships, this is what is happening with the OP. The narrative of my dad was an alcoholic but my mum stopped him drinking has shaped her whole entire life, her partners, her work, her boundaries; where ppl who haven't grown up with an addict for a parent would not get into relationships with addicts her line is she will leave only once the addict she's in a relationship with has destroyed his body and mind with drink and is needing physical care from her. There's a real problem with that in that how would anyone manage to extricate themselves at that point? How does one know it has got to that point? It often comes in increments, you've already set the precedent by staying all through them.

And yeah, underneath the addiction there is a person but you have to accept the addiction if you stay in the relationship with the person. It is not nice to think of yourself as codependent but if you stay together you are, no matter the things you tell yourself to keep you there.

Thank you everyone. Im at work today. So very slow to answer.

I agree that he is offering to cut down to get me off my back. This worries me. I want him to stop because he wants to for his health. I want him to realise that if he loved me more than drink, he would look after his health, and in years still be here, for me.

Thank you for sharing your experiences. It's good to hear the other side.

The children are pragmatic, very grounded, confident. They are both academic, bookish and very mature for their ages. They are happy and settled. Both have said they wish he wouldn't drink. I have asked them if they are happy with him living here, and they are.

He isn't drunk in charge of any children. He drinks 2ltrs on weekday evenings. On Sunday afternoon he goes to the pub with friends, and comes home drunk most weeks. Very good mood, helps me, is very lovely to everyone, tells us all how much he loves us....then falls asleep He doesn't drive.

I feel he is selfish for destroying his health. I love him and I want years to be happy. We are happy, this is the only problem. Sometimes I have wondered if I have a skewed idea of what is normal drinking because I don't drink. So this has been really helpful. I guess I knew deep down I was right. Knowing I am not being ridiculous I feel stronger to cope.

He needs to accept - in these exact words - that he's an alcoholic. Not "drinks too much" but an alcoholic. Then he needs to kick it, either rehab or going to AA meetings. Combined with therapy, you can both come through this.

I know because my brother was one. We staged an intervention 15 years ago, he got help and him and SIL are still together. It will be tough, but if there truly is love between you it can work.

Mini - two litres of cider, every weekday night is an enormous amount to drink regularly. To put it in context, even with weak cider that is 10 units a day. Recommendations are 14 units a week.

Has your DP suggested that the fact you don't drink gives you a skewed idea of how much is normal? You don't have a skewed idea of what is normal.

I grew up with parents who shared a bottle of wine every night in the week. That seems an insane amount to be drinking to me now and that would be about half (each) what your DP is drinking.

And I should add, the two litres of cider is what your DP admits to be drinking. It may well be more. Certainly by the time my DH had gotten to the stage he'd started to admit he had a problem he had started to conceal how much he was drinking.

The children are pragmatic, very grounded, confident. They are both academic, bookish and very mature for their ages.

I have a friend who fits this description well, and I met them (being deliberately gender neutral) when we weren't much older than your children. They are deeply affected by being an adult child of alcoholics. They live a nice, normal, life but have had to put huge amounts of work into dealing with growing up around alcoholism. I've seen the struggle. They also had financial security growing up that helped keep things stable, as you described earlier, that didn't change the consequences of the alcoholism.

I have another friend whose family still won't admit the father is an alcoholic and this person has also been deeply affected by it.

These are both people who are "successful" in life, but they have huge pain and deep confusion from the unacknowledged alcoholism of their parents, and it definitely affects their romantic relationships and sense of self worth.

You both need support. Can you start going to Al-Anon? He should find a support system (eg AA) but will not do so unless/until he is ready to stop.

I have two friends with lovely parents who literally drank themselves to death. It creates a lot of emotional conflict: you love your parent, worry about them, feel sad for them and know that you're not their top priority.

From an outsider's perspective...we have friends where the DH is an alcoholic. It is the elephant in the room. Never directly mentioned. We've known them 20 years and his drinking got steadily worse. He is now sick with a health problem that is most likely caused by his drinking. They are still married, he is still drinking. They continue on as they are but it's taken it's toll on her. She drives everywhere because he would offer to drive but then drink 3 pints and she knew he wasn't safe to drive. They will stay together but it will get harder and harder for her as he deteriorates

No-one here is going convince you to walk away. I do think that counselling would be good for you, explore the relationship you have with your father and why you've chosen a relationship with an alcoholic. Bear in mind an awful lot of people find themselves in a relationship with an alcoholic, someone who was always a 'big drinker' and the dependency sneaks up on them (like my friends), whereas you knew your DH was a drinker when you got together....it will have an effect on your children. It can't be avoided. The question is how much and for how long?

1066 thank you for sharing your experience.
Does your DH binge drink? I'm worried DP will just binge if he manages to cut it down in the week. He hasn't brought any alcohol home today. But when he came in he didn't miss me and I swear I could smell alcohol if I ask I think he will feel compelled to lie. What does your DH lie about, is it just the drinking? I don't think I'd cope well with being lied to. So I can't bare pushing him too hard. Been there done that with my ex. He eventually sorted himself out but 10 years on I still couldn't get over the fact he'd lied.

How do your children feel? Are they aware?

That was meant to say kiss me.

Lostball you are being very brave. You absolutely must do the right thing for yourself and your son. You shouldn't ever feel guilty because if staying makes no difference to his addiction, then leaving can't either. (Hugs) I hope somehow against all rational reason I never have to make the choice you're making. But one day I might have to, because whether you believe addiction is a disease or a social and psychological issue, it's not up to us whether they choose life and choose us. In fact I'm more convinced today than yesterday that every time DP chooses to drink he chooses that above me.

I actually don't think 2L is an enourmous amount. 10'units in Strongbow 2L which is the equivalent of a bottle of wine. It's high but not getting pissed territory. Most blokes can sup 4 pints of cider without much effect (or they can where I live) The weekend drinking would be the real problem. What do you get out of a relationship where your fella is out getting pissed at weekends? He sounds alcohol dependant but I've come across people who have 2/3 times that much every day so he is not off the scale during the week, unless it is strong cider or you are downplaying it.

According to him it used to be more than 2l in an evening when he lived in his own. He doesn't drink all weekend. He might have cider indoors but it's only Sundays that he goes to the pub and comes home drunk. Not falling over drunk, but drunk.

When we go out I've seen him drink 8 to 10 pints of bitter and he isn't falling over drunk. But when he's managed to cut back and we go out 5 pints and he's pissed.

But I really don't have a clue exactly what is normal. I drink so rarely. When I do it's spirits of red wine and I drink very little. Two glasses of red wine and I'm definitely tipsy.

If it's not normal for you and you don't like it then you have decisions to make. That is fairly normal where I live although most of the blokes don't drink every night but when they do they have a fair few and it's min 4/5 pints and at weekend perhaps 8/9 on one of the days and all are married. It is a very working class area where I live though and most blokes were brought up around pubs and booze so it ls inbuilt to a degree.

Op, that sounds like a very stressful life at times.
I havent namechanged so can't post too much about my DC . But something that greystarling said resonated with me in a very powerful way.
It's not possible for anything you do to make any difference and before you know it you will be the wrong side of 40. Skint, having to bring up children alone traumatised and starting your life all over again.
I am the wrong side of 40. I am all of those things.
Add in trauma from seeing (me) and experiencing the aftermath (DC and me) of my DP jumping off a balcony. He had been self medicating with various substances and the mix was toxic
You would have thought that I would have learnt after leaving my alcoholic DH and father of my oldest DC. He hanged himself when DC was 13. They had been estranged, (at my instigation) and they had not lived with him for the previous 9 years (i managed to get him temporary housing after he was sectioned ) The impact has nonetheless been devastating. Sorry if confusing , I am trying to keep my DCs gender neutral .
Please go to Al Anon on your own one day. Just to get some ruddy support ,that would help a bit.
There have been some excellent posts on here also, posters who know what they are talking about.
I lie awake at night cold with horror over what i put my children through.