Can anyone help me to help my sister? domestic/mental abuse

[concernedaboutmysister]

Hi everyone.

I hope you can bear with me whilst I ramble a little here. I need to help my sister.

She has been married for 13years to a bully.
On the day she got married she shook her head at the church door, but our father told her to settle the head & the wedding went ahead.

First of all can I say, our father abused us all. [have posted threads under another name on this subject] This has some baring on the rest of this story which is why I am saying this here.

I text my sister today as I was in the city she lives in, she works nights & I knew she wouls be asleep so I tect her in the PM & said we would call & see her on the way home. I got a text message back saying:

"you know I'd love to see you. Atmosphere in this house isn't good, whats new. I took the car yesterday & got pulled over by the police for speeding, they saw my tears & the scared kids in the back & let me go, I had our bags packed, I went to XX house. X & me not getting on. I need another job & I need to get out of here, I can't live like this any more. Don't say anything I trust you. He punched me on the arms & legs. The boys say. XX told XX mum was sad cos dad punches her"

[obviously all the above was in text speak, but it took up 3 text messages]

I replied saying she needed to get away now, I would help her, I would lend her monsy to get sorted out, I loved her & I was taking charge now, she wasn't to worry anymore.

She replied:

He said I have no self respect, no breeding. I was low & dirty & no-one cares for me. Said I was dirty & not worth anything. When I got to XX house it turned out that her h hits her so she was no good to help me. I thought you would be at XX so I didn't ring you. I don't want mum to find out & worry. I hate telling you this. Thanks for the offer but I have to sort this myself. I have the boys to think of"

I again told her that I would help her, to get the boys from school & I'd meet her, take her to mine, or somewhere where she could get more help. She said it happens a lot but it usually blows over & he says she's making a mountain from a molehill.

Again I replied, "Im coming for you now!" Got a reply "NO! He's here. Leave it I'll get it sorted"

I am really worried about her. She has no self esteem & no confidence. She tried leaving him before & he told her he would take the boys. He comes from a very well to do background, and as I have said above, our childhood was far from normal. He holds this against her. He said he will take her to court & tell the world what our father did [I have no problems with this, I want this to happen but am too big a coward to be the one who pulls the plug ]

He also said as she had depression that no judge in the land will give her the kids.

Can anyone give me some advice? I am the only one who knows what's going on. I will feel awful if he does something to her & I haven't gotten her away from him soon enough

THanks for getting this far.

Just called them.

The lady said it was up to her to leave & if it was a planned escape it would be much better. She advised she had the boys birth certificates, passports, clothes & maybe their fave toys if she knew she was going. And to plan to go when he was out, even just for an hour.

She said they can get her a refuge near where she lives now or near where I live. She advised that I get her to call in at the advice centre, either near me, or near her, & have a chat, they will advise her of benefits etc..

She also said that the plan to stay & save was a very common one & also a delay tactic as she is scared to leave her abuser, everything I said to her is text book stuff she said. She said not to worry about saving, just to plan to leave when she can, after advice from the women's aid place & that they can help her retrain & do whatever she really wants to do.

They also said that if she was really in trouble she can call 999 & they will help her. She advised that I don't tell any of my family, but to call their line as it's for realtives to talk too.

Stuck between a rock & a hard place now.

Concerned, if you are very worried about your nephews and your sister is too afraid to seek help you could phone the social services, you don't have to give your name, but they do have to investigate, and someone trained to look for this sort of thing seeing your sister and her children might get the ball rolling for her to seek help and leave.
Also did your sister ever get help over your father? It seems she finds putting up with sick and abusive relationships and hiding the truth and feeling ashamed the norm.

Please think about calling the SS.
Good luck.

Also children are alot more adaptable then we think, sure they would rather have a safe home and a happy mommy then their old school, also toys are easy to replace.
I'm sure between us on MN we have everything your sister needs to walk away from him and start a new life.

Kimi, thankyou. I know I should call ss. I just feel so torn. If they go & see her she may doubt that she is a bad mother.

I have toyed with the idea of calling & saying I am a neighbour & I heard a ruckus at 6am on Thursday morning & that I have reason to suspect there are children involved in a DV situation.. ??

How awful for you all - could you arrange for her to go to a family solicitor just so she can find out her legal position? she would qualify for legal aid and even if she does nothing then she might feel stronger if she knows what she can/can't do

Concerned, SS are not going to think she is a bad mother, because she is not, she is someone who is hurt and is being abused and can not see a way out, and if this is the sort of thing she thinks is normal (from what you have said about your father) she is going to find a way out hard, do you think the children might be being hit too? Even if they are not they must see / hear what is going on between mommy and daddy.
I know t is hard for you, and i am sure what ever you do you will take some of the brunt of your sisters hurt and anger.
Do you think you could maybe talk her in to going to see her G.P?

How are you right now concerned?

I agree with Kimi, SS know what they're doing in these situations 9there are so many ) and although I've worked in childrens services, I never met a situation where a woman has been penalised by SS for DV.

Hi everyone.

Kimi, she is no stranger to her doctor. She is there every week with one or other of the boys as they both suffer from asthma & chest infections/throat infections.

She text me this evening to ask about a dress I was looking for. I replied saying "I have that info for you we talked about. Happy mother's day for tomorrow, you're a fantastic mum"

She never replied. But I know she is at work right now as her text included the words "I am just headed to work" but I don't think they are allowed their mobiles at work. She is a carer in a home for the elderly.

Would it be ok to tell ss I am a neighbour? Or can I say a concerned relative? What if they tell her it was a relative reported it & she knows I'm the only one who knew?

I'm really going to need your support over the next few days whilst I try to support her & figure out what to do. I do know what I have to do.. but I', so, so afraid of making it worse for her... does that make sense?

Zookeeper, I may suggest family solicitor to her, or I may call my own & ask his advice.

Peachy, thankyou so much for the support. You are very very kind.

You can ask SS not to reveal who you are. It may be obvious to your sister who you are but the social worker will do everything she can not to reveal too much.

I am having probs with my pc at the mo otherwise i would say add me to messenger and i could talk you though it all.

try and get her to call Refuge or Womens aid. 0808 2000 247

Even if the time isn't right for her to leave they will be able to talk her though what is happening and what her options are, she cvan get independant and non pressurising advice from them.

Unfortunatly whilst she knows you care for her and are only trying to help she knows that you are willing her to leave. she will undoubtedly feel guil;ty for letting you down by staying...as you can imagine this is a burden she just doesn';t need right now.

When you speak to Social services you can explain when he is out of the house and they can arrange to visit when he isn't home. they will be bale to speak to her alone and she can speak freely.
Unfortunatly they will tell her that by allowing for the violance to continue in front of the children she is abusing them...it sounds screwed up and indeed it is but that is the fact of the matter....i am a social worker and was told the exact same thing!

they will explain that she needs to do something, either leave or get help as otherwise the children may be placed on teh at risk regsiter. this doesn't mean they will be removed from her so she should not be scared but hopefully it will bring it home to her that the vioolance is not just affecting her and that she needs to leave for them as well as her.

I will try and log on as much as i can to keep up with whats happening and help in anyway i can.

Thankyou Mamazon. if I thought he didn't open her mail, I would print this thread off & send her it. She really needs to hear this from someone who isn't me IYKWIM.

She could never let me down, she & I have been through far too much, I will never leave her to suffer alone. But at the end of the day, by me staying silent & keeping her secrets, I am an accomplice to what he is doing to her.

She is the type of person who doesn't like talking about her problems so it really took a lot for her to open up to me yesterday [albeit by text]

It's mother's day tomorrow, my betting is that he will take her to my mums early in the morning & be gone before the rest of us arrive. Although now she can drive, she may come herself without him, I hope she does & I will try to grab her on her own a minute to see how she is. I didn't like to ask her if she had bruises, but if he had her on the bedroom floor punching her legs & arms my guess would be that she is She said she fought back & nipped/scraped him, so he is bound to be marked too.

If there is the chance you will see her tomorrow, print off this thread and give it to her then? Even if she nips off to the loo at your mums and only gets to read one or two posts, it might help?

I have nothing constructive to add, just to say that I'm lurking on this thread with my fingers crossed for a good ending xx

concerned, I have been stuck in a bad relationship, and lacked the courage to leave.
As you know, your sister is staring a terrifying prospect in the face, of walking out of her familiar life into the unknown, and her confidence is clearly very undermined. From my own experience, I would say that its vital that she speaks to womens aid, and as many other people as possible who can encourage her and reassure her about her future. Womens aid are so practical, and they have good answers to the scary practical questions about accommodation etc.
Thousands of women have been there before her, and have rebuilt their lives, and I dont know of one who wishes that she was back with her abusive h, or thinks that she harmed her children by leaving. The most scary thing is nerving oneself to go - everything after that is far easier.
Bullying men always say they will get custody of the children, it came up on another thread just a couple of days ago.

if you see her tomorrow and she is bruised take photos of the bruising if you can so that she can use them as evidence against him if she can find the strength to do something about him.

Thankyou Nutty, nightynight & zookeeper. Your comments mean a lot to me.

I have done something today & I am torn whether it's right or wrong. I told one of my other sisters. She said she has has her suspicions but that what I hd told her just confirmed it. She said we have to let her see how bad it is for the boys. she cried Said we should have noticed & knew why she never came home for weeks at a time & why he was always there when we arrived.

She recalled sis's birthday, we wanted top take her out but she had no babysitter. So we all arranged with her that the other 4 sisters would go up & take some wine, nibbles etc as she said he would be in Scotland on business for the night. When we got there, we had all went to a lot of effort, getting all dressed up like we were hitting the town, we had arranged a driver & we were all full of gifts & balloons for her etc... when we arrived we were surprised to see his car there, & he himself sitting in the livingroom like a bear. He hd a face like thunder. She hadn't told him we were coming until he asjed why she had nice stuff bought in, then he said he wasn't for scotland He ended up going up to bed, the room above the livingroom.. & telling us to keep the noise down. When he took a pic of us all he said we were all beautiful, he wondered if XXXX was related to us We all told him to stop it & sis laughed as if he was joking, but we know he wasn't.

Good idea about the camera zookeeper. I will do that, even if she doesn't come over, I will have the camera & it won't look out of place. I got a text from her this morning saying "Thanks for getting that for me" I assume she means the info.

Other sis says she's glad I told her & that we have to use the children as a lever to make her see sense. Could what they see stunt their development? They are very badly behaved & play her up, but when he is there they sit like mice

I'm going to get her some more stuff printed off here & take it tonight incase she is at mums.

concerned,
"They are very badly behaved & play her up, but when he is there they sit like mice "
I could have written that about my children.
I kidded myself for years that the benefit of having their father around outweighed the harm, and I still believe that it did while they were small. But as they get older, the harm becomes more apparent. They are just learning such bad patterns of behaviour, of violence to get what you want in the family, of bullying and might is right. They are living under huge stress as well, never knowing when their father is going to lay into their mother again. This makes them miserable.

Once you have left and built up your own life, they can see their father for visits, IF he behaves himeself, and they don't have to lose touch with him. (sorry if that sounds patronising, and may cause a pang to fathers reading it, but my ex has really behaved badly (eg smashing all our windows?) and now I feel reluctantly that I have to treat him like a toddler!)

your sis is lucky to have a concerned family. I am sure you did right to tell your other sister, these things should not be kept secret - thats how these bullies get away with it for so long.

Here are some more arguments to persuade her:
Life is just so much nicer when you are not wondering what mood your dh is in all the time. You can relax in the evenings, instead of being bullied or hit, or running around doing what he says. This could also help your sis to recover from depression!!

Tell her to start planning practical details. She doesnt have to do anything yet, just get everything worked out in her head, and get the answers to all the unknown questions, also know what the police will and wont do.
It may seem crystal clear to anyone else that she should leave now, but she has to get used to the idea that it is possible, and work up her courage.

A bully can go on taking your time and energy and money for years, while you think that you can afford it. The truth is, that you can't afford it, because when you are losing all the time, instead of laying by for a rainy day. One day, your children will need you in some way, and you will realise that you aren't there for them, because you have given so much to the bullying h over the years. Harsh, but true.
Quit now, or quit after he has driven you past the breaking point? Because believe me, the breaking point will come.

I dont mean to sound blaming, btw. A lot of this was only clear to me in hindsight. I completely understand why your sis is still there, and hope v much that you can help her to a situation where she can look back on this time as just a bad period on her life.

My son is autistic so already has behaviour problems but since leaving my ex he has changed dramatically.

Seeing what they see will damage them. it may not be obviouse but they build their idea's of normality form whatr they see at home. they will think it normal to hit women or to get hit. they will misbehave for your sister because they see her being treated badly by their father so will assume they can treat her in a similar way.

if you can get a chance to talke a picture of any markings please do. even if she chooses not to leave just yet she can use them if and when she does leave as if there are any issues over custody of the children or if she ever wishes to press charges she can use these as evedence.
I would advise trying to stick the headline of a newspaper in the picture as well to show the date the picture was taken, then when they are printed put them in an envelope and post them to yourself so that they are date stamped. do not let her keep them at her house!

The fact that he will not allow her to be alone with her family and deliberatly making her feel bad is a typical sign of domestic abuse. he constantly points out her percieved faults so that her self esteem lowers, with no confidence she is less likely to leave as he will have told her she can't cope alone, no one would beleieve her, that he would take the children away as she is such a bad mother etc.
he wont leave her alone for fear she tells any of you.

Make sure she has deleted any messages she has sent you.
See if you can persuade her to set an email up that he doesn't know about....if she uses a yahoo one or MSN it doesn't have to be saved on the pc she can just log in and out and he would never need to know.

she could then take alook at the WOMENS AID website. seeing their descriptions of what constitutes abuse is sometimes quite an eye opener. you don't realise what you are going through as abuse sometimes so to see it in black and white and to be able to tick box after box is often quite shocking.

SHe knows you love and support her in no matter what she does but he has made her feel as if this isn't the case. living with an abusive partner is often like chinese water torture...its just drip drip drip until you get to the point where you no longer know what reality is.

the punching on the arms and legs is also typical. such places can be covered with ease and explained away if noticed. this is a very clever and calculating piece of scum and you must always think very carefully before taking any action and make sure you cover your tracks.
It is very easy to miss a text message or forget to throw away a reciept that shows you have met family.

I don't mean to scare you but i am trying to explain why it is she is so terrified of leaving or indeed even telling you anything, she is probably petrified you will do something that makes it worse but atthe same time hoping with every breath that you are able to help.

Hopefully you will have managed contact with her today and can pass on at the very least the number for WOMENS AID 0808 2000 247.
she can call anytime 24 hours a day and there will be someone there who can speak to her, she wil not need to give any information about name or where she lives but she can hopefully get to speak to someone who can help build her confidence about moving.

i think you did right to tell your sister. this is such an awful situation, she needs you and your sisters to be there for her. i'm sure her self esteem is rock bottom so she doesn't want anyone to bother about her. so sad. i'm really glad she's got you.

Hi mamazon.

Sis was not at mums tonight. But text mums mobile when we were there. I replied saying we were getting drunk & wished she were there, she said she was in spirit.

I have a thick brown A4 envelope sat here for her. full of details about domestic & mental abuse. About what it will do to her boys.

Nightynight & warthog, thankyou also for comments.

I am a bit flustered at the minuet as I have had a few drinks at my mums & will post im monr when more able

Please call the ss, say your a neighbour or (if your nephews are in school) could you speak to the head? Someone needs to get your sister help.
I don't want to scare you but you read such terrible things in the papers and some one always says "oh I wish I had done something", You can do something concerned.

Glad to see you have told your other sister, well done.

I have been thinking about this a lot - would she open up to SS if they were to come? If she were honest then they could help her, but if she denies it all then surely there isn't a lot they can do?

i didnt read this whole thread (forgive me if i repeat anything already here, as i wanted to respond before i have to wake ds up.)

did she leave?
she can go to a refuge, if she has no where else to stay. there arent all horrible places. (i speak from experience.)
have you spoke to anyone about this? the police? she has options, but SHE has to take them. and by gods, i hope she does.

i will skim this thread in a bit when ds is awake... thinking of you both..xx

in addition: he is WRONG about the courts not going to give her custody. he would have to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt WITH evidence (not just hearsay) that she is unfit. (i was going down this road a few months ago with my husband...)

of course she is depressed, she is being abused

ok, will read more now...x

ok, read over this thread...
please update, concerned. am worried too.
if you want, i can contact my friends at the refuge i was at. they could help. they are lovely.
does your sister know you've been online asking about this stuff?
she will almost most definitely qualify for legal aid.