Moving together, am I unreasonable or is he? (Finances)

[NameChange23]

I don't want to drip feed so here are the facts (relevant or not)

• We have been together for 3 years
• We both had been married before
• We both have children from previous marriages, his is an adult but still financially dependant, mine has become a teen pretty recently so still dependant as well.
• I am 46, he is 58
• I am an administrator, he has a senior managing position
• I earn 16k a year, he earns nearly 60k
• I drive a 12 year old £400k car which is falling to pieces, he changes car pretty much every 12-18 months and never spends less than £20k on each of them.
• I own a beautiful 3 bedroom period terrace house (medium courtyard, no garage) in a relatively expensive touristic area (Still mortgaged) and have about £6k in savings. He owns two houses (no mortgage), has a substantial retirement fund and in addition, about £300k in savings.
• we have always gone mostly Dutch on expenses, if we are out to a expensive place, he pays (I pay the babysitter). If we are eating in a cheap place I pay.
• if we go on holidays we go halves.

We have started thinking of moving together and he has come with the idea that I should sell my house and put the profits towards our "together" house. He will match the amount I pay towards it.

For him, that amount would be a small part of his assets, while I would be putting EVERYTHING I have. Which puts me in a rather dangerous financial position especially when it comes to pay for future expenses of DS.

He also expects that we should share the new house improvement expenses 50-50. All the houses he has suggested are slightly more expensive than mine, but they are either miles away in small villages, in need of extensive refurbishment or/and smaller than mine. He thinks that doing them up will cost a couple of thousands, I know (after doing up 3 houses) that we are looking at a possible bill of several £10,000s.

The additional problem is that he wants a detached house in the countryside, with a big garden and a place to keep his car safe. The problem is, I have lived in the countryside and I found the experience extremely lonely, most of my friends do not drive, I had to put up with a rather big share of racism, I hated having to spend so much time/money preventing the garden from becoming a jungle, and in general I was extremely unhappy. I love being surrounded by people and close to where things happen. He wants peace and quiet and hates the idea of city living.

I tried to explain yesterday that it isn't fair from him to expect me to put everything I have into a house that would eat all my assets, most of my income and where DS and I would feel isolated. I also mentioned that considering he earns far more than I, that the 50/50 divide would not be fair.

He looked at me with an incredulous face, and said no. He told me I was acting as if I was with him for his money!

Apparently, my request makes me look like a gold digger.

I ended up telling him that if it was money what I was interested in, I would be still enjoying the high life with my exhusband.

Am I being unreasonable or is he?

The more I read your posts OP the more I get a vibe of passive aggressive emotional manipulation coming off this man.

(Meant to say more than 3 times her income)

I fell pregnant with a man who I'd been with a short time and it was a shock but I didn't want a termination.

Out of necessity really, he moved in with me as I bought a house a few months before I met him on my own, but was very heavily mortgaged with a big tie in as I wanted the security of knowing I could afford my repayments on my own. I also had and still have, a car loan. He earned more than double what I did. Until we had DC, he only paid a very minimal amount towards the house (probably less than what I would get renting a room). When baby arrived, I explained I needed him to contribute more and to have a think about how he wanted to sort it. He wanted 50/50 even though he already earned a lot more and my wage would be reducing on maternity pay by a substantial amount and I wouldn't be able to pay the bills. He thought I should ask him when I needed money to pay something, but I said I didn't think it was fair for him to have hundreds of £ a week spare while I was struggling to pay bills and he lives day to day in the pub whereas I like to plan and know I have money for things when they come up. He is majorly financially irresponsible and had letters/bailiffs round all the time.

Three years on, he still thinks it's unfair he contributes more (2 DC later and I'm on stat mat) and has spent wasted so much money on a daily basis while I have lived very frugally, but has had to take a pay cut and is going to have to live like I have for the last few years because I want 'so much money out of him'. Just to clarify, this is money for household bills, including the full sky subscription I contribute to, which he won't live with me unless I have; a more expensive car loan he made me take out for a 'family car' etc. even though I questioned affordability.

I used to spend quite a lot of money on clothes, I have done one primark shop in 6 months for myself because due to two pregnancies, I have obviously changed shape a lot and I needed them. I can't cut back anymore. He went on a lads long weekend abroad and lost two days pay (I encouraged him to go) He wouldn't go away for one night with me before we had DC2 when I asked him though, as he'd lose pay so it wasn't worth it apparently. When I explained I was upset about it, he said its my fault, I encouraged him to go abroad so I can't complain now.

My friends hen do is abroad next year, I said I didn't think I could go due to finances. His friend (woman who has tried to sleep with him and is unhappily married) wants to go away to a sports thing when I am on no pay at all as stat mat stops, and he's had a hissy fit as I said we won't be able to afford it and my birthday is coming up a couple of weeks later and he'd better do something good after the last two years.

Oh and just as an aside for a relatively big birthday, I got given....NOTHING. Not even flowers or a box of chocs. Apparently, he thought my birthday was the day after, so didn't have chance to get anything and he was skint couldn't stop spending £40 a night in the pub while working away. He said he would make it up to me, but it appears he'd rather go away with his female friend for her birthday, that he NEVER saw during his marriage to his ex. Don't get me wrong, I trust him not to cheat with her, but it feels he's more bothered about disappointing her than me. As someone who puts family first, I just don't understand it.

I've been coming to the realisation over many things and in part thanks to advice on here, that I need to LTB, but it does need planning due to my current situation. I wish I had never got involved, but I did. He's mean and he doesn't care about anyone but himself. He thinks, and has said, he works hard for his money, why should he hand it over I obviously have a walk in the park looking after a 6 month old and a toddler and even more so when I go back to work and no doubt will be dropping off kids, picking them up and doing all the housework. His only job was washing up. It never got done. We've just installed a dishwasher (at my expense) because I can't cope with the state of the kitchen anymore.

He will never change and I'm growing to hate him.

Please don't move in with him. He sees you as a business partner and an opportunity rather than a person to be loved and cherished. I wish my web was easier to untangle and you're at an untangled stage. I've been in love with him for a long time and was deluded. I've always thought he's the kids Dad and he does work hard (not for our benefit). He can be funny and sometimes loving. Other times, I'm walking on egg shells and he leaves and goes NC when he's not getting his own way.

Now I can't wait to get out, but I'll always have a tie to him because of children. Thankfully, it's my property which I doubt he'll claim on as it's the kids home and he's not on the mortgage or bills.

I fell pregnant with a man who I'd been with a short time and it was a shock but I didn't want a termination.

Out of necessity really, he moved in with me as I bought a house a few months before I met him on my own, but was very heavily mortgaged with a big tie in as I wanted the security of knowing I could afford my repayments on my own. I also had and still have, a car loan. He earned more than double what I did. Until we had DC, he only paid a very minimal amount towards the house (probably less than what I would get renting a room). When baby arrived, I explained I needed him to contribute more and to have a think about how he wanted to sort it. He wanted 50/50 even though he already earned a lot more and my wage would be reducing on maternity pay by a substantial amount and I wouldn't be able to pay the bills. He thought I should ask him when I needed money to pay something, but I said I didn't think it was fair for him to have hundreds of £ a week spare while I was struggling to pay bills and he lives day to day in the pub whereas I like to plan and know I have money for things when they come up. He is majorly financially irresponsible and had letters/bailiffs round all the time.

Three years on, he still thinks it's unfair he contributes more (2 DC later and I'm on stat mat) and has spent wasted so much money on a daily basis while I have lived very frugally, but has had to take a pay cut and is going to have to live like I have for the last few years because I want 'so much money out of him'. Just to clarify, this is money for household bills, including the full sky subscription I contribute to, which he won't live with me unless I have; a more expensive car loan he made me take out for a 'family car' etc. even though I questioned affordability.

I used to spend quite a lot of money on clothes, I have done one primark shop in 6 months for myself because due to two pregnancies, I have obviously changed shape a lot and I needed them. I can't cut back anymore. He went on a lads long weekend abroad and lost two days pay (I encouraged him to go) He wouldn't go away for one night with me before we had DC2 when I asked him though, as he'd lose pay so it wasn't worth it apparently. When I explained I was upset about it, he said its my fault, I encouraged him to go abroad so I can't complain now.

My friends hen do is abroad next year, I said I didn't think I could go due to finances. His friend (woman who has tried to sleep with him and is unhappily married) wants to go away to a sports thing when I am on no pay at all as stat mat stops, and he's had a hissy fit as I said we won't be able to afford it and my birthday is coming up a couple of weeks later and he'd better do something good after the last two years.

Oh and just as an aside for a relatively big birthday, I got given....NOTHING. Not even flowers or a box of chocs. Apparently, he thought my birthday was the day after, so didn't have chance to get anything and he was skint couldn't stop spending £40 a night in the pub while working away. He said he would make it up to me, but it appears he'd rather go away with his female friend for her birthday, that he NEVER saw during his marriage to his ex. Don't get me wrong, I trust him not to cheat with her, but it feels he's more bothered about disappointing her than me. As someone who puts family first, I just don't understand it.

I've been coming to the realisation over many things and in part thanks to advice on here, that I need to LTB, but it does need planning due to my current situation. I wish I had never got involved, but I did. He's mean and he doesn't care about anyone but himself. He thinks, and has said, he works hard for his money, why should he hand it over I obviously have a walk in the park looking after a 6 month old and a toddler and even more so when I go back to work and no doubt will be dropping off kids, picking them up and doing all the housework. His only job was washing up. It never got done. We've just installed a dishwasher (at my expense) because I can't cope with the state of the kitchen anymore.

He will never change and I'm growing to hate him.

Please don't move in with him. He sees you as a business partner and an opportunity rather than a person to be loved and cherished. I wish my web was easier to untangle and you're at an untangled stage. I've been in love with him for a long time and was deluded. I've always thought he's the kids Dad and he does work hard (not for our benefit). He can be funny and sometimes loving. Other times, I'm walking on egg shells and he leaves and goes NC when he's not getting his own way.

Now I can't wait to get out, but I'll always have a tie to him because of children. Thankfully, it's my property which I doubt he'll claim on as it's the kids home and he's not on the mortgage or bills.

Sorry for the long and double post. It said it had failed

OP "while I was driving an old car whose driver door doesn't open "

this worries me btw!

That aside, it strikes me that this relationship is costing you a great deal of money. You would be better off financially on your own. Have I got that right? If you are paying towards outings that are geared to his budget, yes, you have to take responsibility for that choice.

But now it's all in such sharp relief that everything, in his mind, has to be split 50/50, he just seems like a not-very-nice boyfriend that you can't afford anyway. Does that make sense? As I said before, I respect the fact that he might want someone earning equal money, that's his right. But I don't see any reason why you should spend money you can ill afford in order to keep him. I would say that even if he was lovely - because there is such a thing as a partner you can't afford, does that make sense? I don't have a lot of money so when I've been partnered up, I have expected that we eat out or have any trips at the level I can afford. If someone said "let's go to the theatre, tickets are £60" the answer is just no, doesn't matter who asks.

Ok, so he wants to move with you to a big house with garage out in the country, and needs your equity to do it.
If he wants to move to the country, why doesn't he just sell one or both of his houses and use savings to do it?
What about your financial security for the future, if it all goes wrong?
What about your DS and his schooling/friendships/independence - won't these be affected adversely? 13 is not a good age to have his life disrupted and have a new father figure brought into his life?
What if when you all move in together this chap does the "my house my rules" and makes your teenager's life hell?
What if you move in, but he decides to retire early given he has a good retirement fund and income from property. He's off playing golf or swanning off in his merc while you're still working 3 jobs to pay your part of mortgage and bills, and driving your son to and fro to see his friends and "why are you late home and why isn't my supper ready, or why haven't you ironed my shirt etc etc"
Due to Brexit, I think we're all in for a bumpy ride, financially speaking, over the next few years. Not the time to risk your ( and your son's) financial security buying this house? You may have to accept a low offer, to secure the house he wants.

If you must move in with him, please keep your house and rent it out. I don't get why he needs a third property?

I'm not saying this to excuse him as he doesn't sound great, but I suppose the thing is that whilst £60k is a great salary to have if you haven't got big commitments, it probably doesn't extend to paying for luxury holidays for 3.

Your DS sounds ace by the way, it sounds like he is gently telling you that this guy isn't good for you.

For everyone's sake, don't uproot you and your DS to live in the countryside when you have a home and a life that meets all your needs and wants.

Fine if he wants a 50/50 split, but only if your 50% is well within your financial reach. So if he only wants it 50/50, then he will have to accept that you get a much cheaper, smaller house together, one that you could afford if you were both earning 16k a year. And obviously you should both spend an equal proportion of your savings, i.e. if he demands that you put in 100% of your savings then he has to put in 100% of his. That would be making it equal.

And although you are telling me he wants all in his own terms, he says exactly the same of me.

Of course he does, he's selfish and manipulative and wants everything his own way - if you don't play ball he labels you as the selfish one.

From the info here you have been far too accomodating of a very mean and grasping man. He does not see your PoV, nor does he care about it.

Your son is very sensible, and his advice was good. I think he can see this relationship is not making you happy.

It's making you question yourself, but you are not the problem.

Your dp sounds like the gold digger. Not you!

OP, have you read the current thread in Step-parenting , headed A long post about step-child and property ? There is a lot there to interest you.

I posted earlier about also having a 16/60 split but being the higher earner. And that my fiancé who will move in with me will lose out financially by various payments he'll lose - including a student maintenance grant, so we're talking big sums. As it happens, we're delaying the moving in for 2 years for practical reasons - but that also gets us over the worst of his "losses" from moving in with me.

Anyway, my point is this... We have had several very detailed up front conversations about money.

He will gain from being with me. He already is - I'm paying 50% of a holiday that he's on for 2 weeks + 2 kids, me 5 days of it + 1 kid. I pay for a lot of family meals out, theatre trips. I earn more, we're a family, end of.

Some of the conversations have included pre nuptial discussions, about protecting my assets for my child (and his for his own children).

We've managed to have these conversations without a single snide remark about "gold digging".

After 3 years, your partner should know you well enough to know that you are not a good digger. If he cannot even have a practical conversation about money with you without saying that, then - you're simply with the wrong man.

I love my fiancé. I know he benefits a lot from my salary. He's equally generous in other ways. Moreso even. It wouldn't cross my mind to say he was a gold digger, or angling for me to buy him a Mercedes. Just as he doesn't think I'm not committed when I say "I want my child to get all my pension".

If you can't have the conversation without that nasty insult, he's not the man for you - even if you date and don't move in together.

Run for the proverbial hills!!!

Op, compare and contrast your dp with this dp: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/2706419-When-DP-earns-a-shit-load-more-than-you

'I have not told him about the house move as I don't want to stress him out until we are clear about what comes next, but I have tried to find out his opinions about other areas'

You are being very foolish to still be contemplating it at all. Do not move this man into your house and offer him rights to it because he alters it to his taste. Are you insane? That would be so far beyond stupid.

This man is manipulative and mean. Of course he tells you you want it all your way. It's how he wears you down.

You're breaking your back going Dutch with this guy. Think of your son and how much more you'd have to spend on the two of you if you're not spending it trying to keep up with this guy.

Honestly, the sooner you make it clear there'll be no moving in together at all, the better. In fact, I'd tell him I did a lot of thinking and I don't see the relationship progressing, so I need to call it quits.

You have a good life right now, a home you like in a place you like, friends, etc. Why give it up to get financially screwed with a person who doesn't give a rat's arse about you and your son financially?

A couple of months ago he came to talk to me and told me I like him very much but you need to do what makes you happy, if you want to break up with him, don't worry about me".

Your son is very sensible. Listen to him.

Your BF wants to leave you with nothing that's entirely yours. You will have half a house and he will have 2 and a half.

That's a very selfish and cunning man. He doesn't care about your financial situation.

He just wants you with him in the country, or he'll be lonely.

I repeat do not sell your house.

Ok, I'm back. For those asking why insist in a relationship with him, here are his good points:

• we are very different but we react to life in the same way. We have the same sense of adventure, can take measured risks, and are up to adapt plans to make most of the day.

• I'm a strong woman, no shrinking violet here. If I disagree with something I would say so and explain why tactfully and I am mostly willing to compromise. I don't know if I tend to attract manchildren or they become like that with me. One of the things I have found more attractive of him is that he does NOT need to be mothered: i don't do his laundry, iron, keep his diary, or sort his problems. I cook for him when he is around and he does the same for me.

• He puts needs and likes of DS first, to the point I have to stop him to avoid spoiling DS. He has taught him a lot of new things, taught him about music, introduced him to new sports, he really cares about him. A few months after the relationship became more serious, he decided to find a new rental house, where DS could have his own space and my geriatric incontinent dog was welcome to visit. I was very touched by that.

• He is very sensible and a rock in a crisis, he can calmly extricate the important issues in a problem to concentrate on that and doesn't get overworked with pety stuff. (I really don't get why he can't understand the finance issue though)

• He has a sensitivity that I adore. He may have not read much but he can appreciate a good piece of music, wine, art and little details in life and be moved to the point of tears. (He would hide them, but I know him well).

To his defence, I would say that he got married to his teenage sweetheart and since they both always had similar incomes and built similar assets, sharing finances never came into the equation. He simply doesn't know other way than going halves.

• his houses... one he inherited (currently rented), the other is a holiday property that he shares with his ex. The big savings pot is his 50% share of the former marital assets.

He says he feels as distraught about moving to a city as I do about moving to the countryside.

He thinks he needs to provide for his son (right on that) but also for me. I'm not clear how in the case of the later as he has not discussed with me anything in detail.

"He says he feels as distraught about moving to a city as I do about moving to the countryside."

And that's why, as I said before, you two are not compatible in the longer term - not when in comes to living together.

Don't think you should move in with him but if you do, don't sell your place. Rent it out and pay your dp rent in his place, minus the extra it will cost you to commute to work...

Talking of cost 50% heating bill in a small property is very different to a large one

Do you want to live with him?

Could he move in and rent a local garage?

Big commitment before you've tried to live together

He has a sensitivity that I adore. He may have not read much but he can appreciate a good piece of music, wine, art and little details in life and be moved to the point of tears.

Don't you remember Hannibal Lector?

Good grief Imperial... I wanted to show this thread to him!