DH loses it and says/calls me these things, what would you do?

[Mrstumbletap]

Hi, I'm just looking for a bit of perspective/advice. DH has a bit of a temper and when we row (usually once a month) over something silly like remembering to pick something up, or where something is, it can escalate and end up with him just reeling off a load of insults or just nasty things. Such as, your stupid, horrible, ugly (only said that once), pathetic, I don't like you etc.

I have learnt arguing back in this situation is pointless and usually ends up with him walking out slamming the door. Then later that afternoon or the next day he is really sorry, says he knows he shouldn't say those things and that he just does it to hurt me, and that he knows it wrong. He grew up in quite a similar situation so I know where he gets it from.

On the whole he works hard, is sweet, funny, romantic, good around the house, good with DC and we get on well, but one argument a month his Jekyl and Hyde comes out. I'm getting a thick skin to it now and just wait for him to finish his rant and then speak to him that eve or the next day. Been together many years and it's never escalated to more than that.

Can you give me your thoughts?

How strange. OP in some of your posts you almost sound as if you are HIM, justifying his obnoxious behaviour towards YOU.

No, most couples aren't like this. Id find this kind of disrespect very wearing, wouldn't be able to put up with it. A man who loves and respects the woman he is with doesn't speak like that

But all the things you say seem to intimate he is such a good man and its not so bad. Perhaps you want to stay, and are posting here for "permission" to do so. You don't need anybody's permission if you think you can cope with it then thats what you do, even if you come here to have a vent at times

Whatever you do OP, it is vital to remember that abusers are never nasty all the time or they would never get anyone to abuse. He is abusive by the way.

Yes, anyfucker, if your ''partner'' calls you ugly and says he doesn't want to be in a relationshi with you then grab your coat you're free to go.

I think it takes time for the penny to drop. I think there is (for me anyway) a period of denial, coping, disbelief etc before realising that this kind of relationship is just plain wrong. The good bits can be lovely but they are marred by some appalling behaviour. When you are ready, speak to someone at Women's Aid. I am not ready to leave just yet, but I am gearing myself up for it. I have girls and they deserve to be brought up without an abusive man.

I agree. I also had the debates in my head that the OP is having now. I knew I wasn't happy, but instead of acting on that, I got all caught up in a side show, ''Who is happy?'', "Do I have the right to be happy?", "What is happy?" "was my grandmother happy? is my mother happy?" and "If I left, would being a single mother make me happy?".

I did leave and I was happier. But I made lists in my head. Pros for staying. Pros for leaving. I stared at them. Anaesthetised. So then I flipped it around. Pros of leaving. Pros of staying. Still paralysed.

Eventually one day I took a big breath and flung myself underwater and left him. That's what it felt for. Holding your breath, not knowing if you'll get to land. SOrry if that sounds dramatic but when you've trained yourself not to feel anything then to suddenly allow yourself to not only FEEL but to REACT, it feels like you're in Eastenders.

easytoeatTiger I wish you and your DDs good luck. I had a lining up my ducks phase too. You know in your head it's over, you just have to sort out a few logistics. You sound strong and clear in your own head and that's the hardest bit. Some of the worst will be behind you already when you leave because you have detached from caring what he thinks. You won't allow him to put you on trial for leaving him.

I have had a similar experience to you, hereyougo. I ended the relationship and at the time (and now) I felt that he emotionally abused me, but with distance and perspective, I can see that I possibly did it to him too. Not with shouting and intimidating, but with sarcasm, shutting down contact, refusing to accept his opinions. I made me realise that I had to work a lot on my own communication skills. I think we were better off breaking up as we weren't really compatible, but it wasn't all his fault.

My thoughts: if he heard those thing repeatedly growing up (not necessarily directed at him) then he seems to be reapeating them without realising where they're coming from. I know i repeat my moms rants at dad word by word when arguing with dh (and im not proud of it).
Talk to him?

Some people are in relationships where it is the 'norm' to trade insults. Give back as good as you get. But if you don't want that type of relationship he must stop or else you tell him to go and find somebody who lives up to his high expectations because obviously you don't. (Tongue in cheek way of course) If this is hurtful to you then you shouldn't put up with it. What is the point of having a partner who puts you down all the time. No point at all.

So you are 'ugly' if you don't put the bins out? what does that make you (in HIS eyes) when you do put the bins out, bearing in mind that the bins are not known for their rejuvenating powers?

So, you are stupid when you don't X,Y,Z?? What about when you do X,Y,Z? How does he feel about you then, do you think?

Whatever, it wouldn't be enough for me. Whether he thinks it, means it, is using it to hurt you - none of it is good.

Talk about mn over reaction. Yes its shit, yes he needs to stop.

DH does not call me names but he twists things to make it my fault. So has just accused me of 'constantly attacking him'. Because I asked him to slow the car down. Which made me see red and shout - so I guess that makes it my fault, for overreacting.

That old chestnut, GOB. How are you attacking him for feeling endangered? An attack and a request are 2 very different things. My husband regularly accuses me of attacking him. He has been hauled up on it by the family therapist but I don't think he actually took any notice. Some people are saying here that the problems in the relationship are their fault. Although nobody is perfet, there is no reason on earth why anyone should have to put up with being called names, being accused of impossible things and generally having their head messed with.

hereyougo - I presume that given you have a non-sleeping baby, you get very little sleep? Does your DH then complain that you're not 'pulling your weight'?

Well Tiger that's what I said to him - I'm not attacking you, just asking you to slow down. Then he lost it, I retaliated and we had a huge row including throwing stuff at each other.

If I had stayed quiet and not reacted when he said I attacked him (or apologised) we would probably all be sitting down now to a nice cosy Mother's Day lunch. So it really is my fault.

Thank you everyone for your comments, it does help to get different people's perspective.

And its difficult to give you all the information about a person in a few paragraphs, in the past when we had bigger rows and they seemed more dramatic I had thought about leaving, but things do seem to be getting better. I know I know everyone will say but he called you this or that, and I can understand that will seem harsh, but I feel like we may be on the tail end of it if that makes sense. We had a very long 2 hour chat yesterday about it all, and he made some interesting points, quite similar to yours hereyougoagain about some things I say seem like I am attacking him in a passive aggressive way. And I can see his point, I'm not condoning name calling, but I can see there is no smoke without fire, and he doesn't walk in the house and start shouting and calling me names, it will be at the end of an argument when there is no winner. But the whole winning thing is ridiculous and needs to stop and we both really agreed on that.

He and I know exactly where he has got it from and he grew up in a house where name calling and belittling were and still are commonplace and everyday, I have sat at the dinner table so shocked at the things his parents have said to each other. But this isn't us right now, and I know some will say but it could be in 10 years, but that's only if I let it and he increases the rants, which I believe are more infrequent now than they were 4/5 years ago.

It also makes me a bit sad for the quick LTB comments because, for example if my DS were to hear these comments over the next few years and believe it was acceptable to speak to his wife that way, in the future if he spoke to his wife that way should she LTB and he be forever on his own? Or could she say to him oi, that's not on, don't speak to me like that it's unfair and over time he deals with his issue and works through it? Like a few posters above have said they have. I hope he wouldn't be immediately labelled as an abuser and not deserve love.

I'm also not saying that if in 2 years things got worse I wouldn't be on here saying "that's it I'm not staying with him anymore please give me advice/support", because you never know what's round the corner.

But for now I am hoping for ways to sort the short term, more preventative rather than summative.

It also makes me a bit sad for the quick LTB comments because, for example if my DS were to hear these comments over the next few years and believe it was acceptable to speak to his wife that way, in the future if he spoke to his wife that way should she LTB and he be forever on his own?

Everybody argues I should think, but its WHAT you say. If you think its normal to call your partner "ugly" and "stupid" and that doesn't amount to verbal and emotional abuse, then you are mapping out your DS' likely future there. He is likely to hear more than you think whilst growing up. & you think its ok. In which case yes, she should LTB. That in no way means he will be "forever on his own". But it does mean women are likely to leave him, in the main. He can't choose their reaction to nasty verbals, and nor can you. Although I suppose if you see this as "not so bad" and you advise him of that, you could very well have a hand in a succession of unhappy relationships. Remember his wife will not be YOUR daughter, if she has a good sense of her own worth and her parents have also instilled that in her then she won't put up with it

Or could she say to him oi, that's not on, don't speak to me like that it's unfair and over time he deals with his issue and works through it? Like a few posters above have said they have. I hope he wouldn't be immediately labelled as an abuser and not deserve love.

Yes of course she should say that to him. None of that would make him NOT an abuser, however. It would simply be a case of whether he took that on board or not, recognised he was hurting his partner, resolved to do something about that, AND did it

As said, yeah people argue. But to call the person you share life with, that you sleep with, stupid and ugly, is just low. I can fling some really choice insults when I get going! But those 2 things? No. I have boundaries and they are too personal, aimed to hurt someone to the core.

If you choose to advocate that then fine, but please don't try to convince women that they are over-reacting when they are upset about and won't stand for these things. There are enough men minimising verbal and emotional abuse of women and its effects out there already.

If you choose to advocate that then fine, but please don't try to convince women that they are over-reacting when they are upset about and won't stand for these things. There are enough men minimising verbal and emotional abuse of women and its effects out there already
Could we replace men or women with the word people? Not sure it's entirely gender specific

Fair point cashmere however my comment was triggered by a woman talking about a man who, when they argue, speaks in a personal abusive fashion. & gave a hypothetical example about her son for instance being abusive to his wife in the future, and how his then wife should deal with it. Hence why I said men"; in this case it IS gender specific

Also this is in the main a female message board with women going through abusive issues with men.

Aside from that OP - abusive men aren't always abusive from the moment they open their eyes, until they close them to go to sleep. They may just be abusive sometimes, at particular moments. That doesn't make them NOT abusive. However I do understand your are in a difficult situation, and that everybody has their own levels regarding what they can and will accept in a relationship and I think if it comes down to that, then thats fine. If speaking for yourself. But not to imply that women who don't minimise are over-reacting.

If a man did that it wouldn't go down well, I dont think. For me its the same when a woman does it.

I think it sounds like you have reached a sensible resolution for now, Mrstumble. I wish you all the best and hope things have turned a corner for you both now.

TheSparrowHawk I know it sounded bad with me not pulling my weight due to sleep deprivation, like he didn't appreciate the effects of it - he tried to - but to be honest the depression (about our situation, not wanting to get out of bed in for days after an argument even if we didn't have a non-sleeping baby) was the main thing which robbed me of all vitality. And made me withdrawn from everybody, but it was a Catch 22 situation, I felt if he only showed me more love and respect regardless of me not doing anything about the house and becoming a bit of a loner, I would have pulled myself out of it, but he couldn't because he was already doing his best trying not to remark on me "not doing anything"(I was looking after the baby and older DC, but doing below the bare minimum). Anyway, we both wanted each other to be the bigger person and show unconditional love which neither of us had capacity for at the time and due to the marital tension...

Actually, when things got better he offered for me to sleep in the spare bedroom(first time ever!) and to try and get baby back to sleep by himself. The trouble is, baby- now toddler- only gets angrier when sees him instead of me. I was so excited by his suggestion, but agreed to half a night of sleeping separately, didn't want to listen to the screeching baby for hours - it took him 30 min of singing to get DC back to sleep two times, and it takes me 5-10min of BF to get her back to sleep, but I already had to do it three times in the night before I left the room.

He hasn't offered to do it again :), but if he knows I had a rough night he doesn't care how nothing might get done any more, or at least doesn't complain - would try to tidy etc himself at the weekend(works lots of hours in the week, so unrealistic to expect him to cook or hoover in the week).

As for calling people names. To me it's a mystery, where DH got it from. FIL is the meekest gentlest man I've ever met, MIL appears to be quite bitter in general and gets very cross very quickly(even though FIL absolutely worships her!), and for my DH his father definitely played his Mother's role throughout their childhood.
He remembers mum as being quite bullyish towards Dad a lot, and him getting upset for dad and deciding no woman would ever order him around. But at the same time his brothers are really laid-back and quiet, nobody swears! He is the only one like that, who swears easily in general (at the telly, at the weather etc). I come from a family of non-swearers, so for me all these constant Fng this and Fng that was a bit of a shock to start with.

However my sister is married to somebody I perceive as the kindest soul - and I used to work alongside him for a year, I introduced him to my DSis! However, though she is very happy in her marriage and adores him, she says when they have arguments(not often though!), he never swears or name-calls, but manages to say things he knows would hurt the most ever . She didn't complain about it, she accepts it and mentioned it in passing.
I did wonder whether the swearing partner was in some other ways a more straightforward, easier to manage option - people might say it's never acceptable, and I agree - but at least it's something easy to identify and stop, compared with when someone is killing you softly (not saying that what my DSis is going through, she worships her DH the same way FIL worships MIL now that I think about it)

I hope he wouldn't be immediately labelled as an abuser and not deserve love.
If my sons called their girlfriends abusive names in arguments, I would expect the girl to end the relationship.
If I had daughters, I would tell them to walk away from anyone who behaved in such an abusive manner towards them.
It is not the job of their future partner to fix them. The abuser needs to stop abusing, then they are in a place to start a relationship.

I was in a relationship like this for 14 years.
And, over time it did get worse - i.e.: more often, called more vulgar things.
Also "just" to hurt me.
Apparently I should know not to take what he says when we fight seriously.
And I used to think "but WE are not fighting - you are".
I started standing up to him more and more as I refused to get worn down, then he had an affair and became physically and financially abusive too.
Probably "just" to hurt me.
Realise this: men like them can control themselves around their bosses, their colleagues, the young girls in the office they are trying to impress.
But they CHOOSE to not control themselves with their spouses.
I realised, for no good reason, that my husband actually resented me. Hated me even. But for no good reason, other than perhaps his life wan't the way he thought it would be.
He wasn't rich enough / established enough / respected enough - whatever - and it couldn't possible be his fault, he couldn't possibly be an adult and take ownership of his situation - he has to blame, blame, blame.
But I think they know deep down on some level they can't.
BUT when you don't wipe up the ring of coffee from under your cup straight away - well, that IS you fault isn't it? Yippee - an excuse to dive in and say all the evil shit in their brains.
Makes them feel in control and powerful to hurt you.
I was told I was fat and ugly, stupid, etc…
I eventually started doubting myself, it affected my self confidence socially and in the workplace, I started becoming a shell of who I was.

Now, 3 years later, I can honestly say I am so glad he had the affair, because I don't think I would have ever found the strength to leave him.
I am a different person, and would never EVER put up with that again.
Somebody shows the slightest wait of that behavior and they are gone.
As it should be. But I bet your husband waited until you were in love and emotionally invested in him BEFORE he had the confidence to start this bullying.

So like other posters, I can't tell you what I did do, but rather what I wish I had done: leave as soon as you can. It will never get better. It won't.

You say what happens if your son learns this is the way to talk to partners, should the partner LTB or teach him it's unacceptable.
Surely, SURELY the onus is on you to ensure that he doesn't grow up with that belief? Because yes it will likely make for a lifetime of unhappy relationships for him!
No it's totally not normal having your DH verbally abuse you on occasion. My DH has never, ever once got personal when we've argued.
With a boyfriend many years ago it was a different story. It was damaging. Deeply so. I also thought I was growing a thick skin. Had a nervous breakdown afterwards.

To be honest with you, if my other half called me names or "stupid" I would probably give him 1 more chance and then be done with him if it happened again. I just have zero tolerance for that kind of behaviour, regardless of everything else. But it's entirely up to you if you feel it's something you can deal with without feeling disrespected, but for me I couldn't.