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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Do rocky starts ever lead to love stories?

77 replies

Banzai · 03/11/2015 11:23

Which do you think is true?

"Some genuinely wonderful and time tested romances were born out of unclear circumstances, differing momentum or a host of other factors that stray from the archetypal boy meet girl, boy chases girl scenario. Everyone needs different fits for their relationships."

OR

All the "rules" which exist as firm indicators of the value of a new relationship. For example: Making sure someone ticks every box, wants the same things as you, follows all the tried and tested pattern of boy chasing girl.

What I mean is, do you think sometimes we place too much expectation on men at the start of new relationships to be 100% sure they want us, 100% sure they want a relationship and for them to play the role we expect?

OP posts:
candykane25 · 04/11/2015 23:18

Saying big a person has commitment issues means you can make a lot of excuses about their behaviour.
They are either in or out.
The person may have previously had commitment issues, but to be in a relationship now must have decided, prior to embarking on it, that they were ready to cast those issues aside. No one else can do it for them.
I speak as someone who previously had commitment issues. I wasn't ready until I was ready.
I am now happily married and I made a conscious decision with my now DH not to push him away or wreck the relationship, but to behave like a grown up. It was initially hard but was worth it.
If your partner is blowing hot and cold / nothing you can do will make him ready. You will be tempted to excuse behaviour but ultimately he had to decide he is commitment ready.

Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:18

Sorry I didn't answer that question there. We met through friends. He asked me out for a fair while first and I said no (not playing games but I wasn't looking for a relationship and did not really fancy him) and then I did go out with him and never expected to actually really like him.

Both of us went on a date or two thinking it was only a bit of fun. I was clear I didn't want anything serious. He was clear he felt the same. We lasted all of two dates and both thought "hang on a minute, I like this person", so both of us panicked, not realising the other one felt the same and pulled away a bit.

Both quite reserved with giving away out feeling, we have had mixed messages from both sides. Misunderstandings. I hurt him without realising. He hurt me without realising. Both trying to pretend to be a lot more detached than we were. Bit of false pride.

Me expecting him to be a typical male pursuer and him not comfortable with the role. Me realising this quite slowly and realising I'd have to be the one to drop my ego and so now we have a kind of role reversal where I've had to sort of lay it all out on the line and tell him I really like him and want to try someting serious and him saying he wanted to as well.

We have muddled through it, both wary, but both willing to listen and make an effort. I have had more fallouts with him (not blazing rows but misinterpreted situations that hurt us both) in a few months than I had in a decade with the one before with whom it was plain sailing from day one with never a single doubt or confusion.

So maybe I was expecting love to always be like that, more simple and obvious and in this situation I think maybe neither of us expected it to turn out to be quite so great as it is and it's been a bit difficult.

I've had to, as I said, take the lead a bit here as I am the more open of the two of us and he's appreciated that and me being more honest and less guarded has allowed us both to start bringing down walls.

No he doesn't do what my last man did...like calling all the time and telling me nice compliments all the time or generally making me feel "wow, I am being pursued", but he does make me feel warm and happy and calm and I really like him and like what we have.

I was just wondering if I was not being silly, or going for someone who a wasn't making enough of an effort OR if he is making an effort in his own way and it doesn't have to fit a mould of how someone shows they care abotu you to be true.

OP posts:
RunRabbitRunRabbit · 04/11/2015 23:21

the male was the pursuer, he made it clear from day one he intended a relationship and he called as much as he could

That would creep me out.

To me, your "conventional" start is weird and patronising, your "complex" "rocky" start is normal to me. Everyone's different. It is only unconventional for you.

I wouldn't worry about it if the situation is making you happy.

Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:21

candykane we've both blown hot and cold, I didn't want a relationship either when we started. I think what we have settled on now is that we are a couple but taking it slowly and I am having to adjust my expectations to the fact that he is obviously the sort of man who starts of slow and builds to a crescendo when he feels ready and sure and that right now we both make each other happy. I was just checking really because I felt a bit like I was having to be the aggressor, or not the aggressor but maybe the driving force and I've not done it before.

OP posts:
Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:23

Thats good to know RunRabbit.

I haven't been out with that many people, so really only base it off what they were like and all of them were pretty similar. Maybe we all have a type and I've always been quite insecure and tended to go for men who made me feel absolutely certain

OP posts:
CherryPicking · 04/11/2015 23:29

I think the scenario you describe makes women passive vessels for male list - giving away any say in their own futures. If thats society's perfect scenario, society can fuck off. Taking control, taking responsibility for something as important as the love you need and deserve - that has to be better than voluntarily thing your own hands with Victorian rules about what nice girls do.

Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:31

This is going to sound ridiculoud but th truth is that I really, really like him and therefore feel vulnerable and therefore checking / observing him and what set me off really worrying about it is stupid things...like the quotes people post on Facebook...

"No message is a message in itself"

"If he misses you, he'll call"

"If he wants you in his life he will put you there"

"stop chasing him. If he cares he will chase you"

All of that sort of crap in my newsfeed and every time I see it I think, "Oh, God, he's not like that". But my gut tells me he is genuinely just not like that and it doesn't mean he doesn't care..just that he doesn't fit the stereotype all this silly quotes come from and it just so happens my exes have.

I think to make it work though, I am going to have to do a little chasing. I will have to be the one who suggests ways to get around things becaue he's just not the type of person for that role.

So I think that was just what set me off. I have had to leave my comfort zone to be with him (he's worth it)

OP posts:
OutToGetYou · 04/11/2015 23:32

How does all that fairytale shite stack up for same sex relationships then?

Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:35

I love that coment Cherry. I'd love to feel empowered by this new situation where I'm a bit more in control and taking the lead emotionally (and being honest actually enjoy it) and I love the way he and I have such great, open honest conversations where we lay it all out and there's no games or roles to be played and no one is romancing or doing anything but getting close as two humans. I actually love it.

Just my head keeps second guessing.

Maybe time to drop the old fashioned notions of romance and just take him as he is

OP posts:
Toffeelatteplease · 04/11/2015 23:36

Hmmmmm......

Love stories are just that. Stories. Relationships are difficult and complex because people are difficult and complex.

I think you need to look overall and ask is this person an enhancement to my life or does he detract from it.

Following preset stories isn't really going to work because you'll miss the good cues and possibly also the bad ones too

OutToGetYou · 04/11/2015 23:40

Just reverse the sexes in those annoying little homilies and you'll soon see how meaningless they are.
Better still, hide them from your fb page.

Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:40

He's a masive enhancement to my life!

Thanks Toffee, great way to see it.

I'm a real idiot for worrying about this.

OP posts:
Banzai · 04/11/2015 23:41

Very true outtgetyou and I think that was the whole point of my OP. I didn't know if people felt there were certain ways men should or should not behave...like courting behavior iyswim

OP posts:
CherryPicking · 04/11/2015 23:42

Thanks, I may have been reading Laurie Penny's latest book recently Grin she says some good stuff about trad relatíonships. And I've been separated for more than 18months and feel I'm starting to put right all the old rules I used to live by.

CherryPicking · 04/11/2015 23:43

By 'good' I mean extremely sceptical.

SpikeWithoutASoul · 04/11/2015 23:51

My DH was very odd and distant when we were first together. I trusted my gut feeling that he was just cautious but did care about me.

I can now, after 12 years, confidently say that I am adored. When I ask him about how he was at the start of our relationship, he just says he didn't know what he was doing.

Colourmylife1 · 05/11/2015 08:29

I could have written your post. Ultimately I ended it after 5 months as I felt he was just too passive and I was the one moving the relationship forward and always would be.
I have agonised over my decision as I know that he really does care for me but in the end it comes down to what you're looking for. I was spending too much time thinking about things and trying to interpret his actions.
From my experience when things are right you never have to do this. It just happens. I also felt that ultimately I would feel a bit cheated that I had missed out on a little bit of the romance which you hope for at the start. Maybe it's insecurity on my behalf but I do really need to feel that a guy is really, really into me before I can relax enough with him to give back.

Trills · 05/11/2015 08:45

The generic answer is that of course most relationships are not like in films.

The specific answer is that even though good relationships do come out of non-traditional beginnings, that doesn't give any indication as to whether YOUR relationship will.

Offred · 05/11/2015 12:13

Your idea of relationships is weird.

You have a relationship because you both want to not because someone is doing or not doing any particular thing - that is an approach you use for deciding to end a relationship not deciding to start one.

If someone doesn't meet your needs (not arbitrary ideas of what they should do) it isn't going to work no matter if they are nice or if you have chemistry etc. if someone in the past gave you a chance to sort yourself out and you subsequently had a nice relationship that does not mean it is what you should do or how things will work if you give someone who isn't meeting your needs a chance...

Casimir · 05/11/2015 14:13

So, your previous relationships followed the Disney narrative.....and ended. This is following a different original path and....

noclueses · 05/11/2015 20:59

how long have you been dating, OP , and how often do you meet? sorry if you've mentioned this already.

IMO there can be both scenarios going on here - one, he is lacking self-esteem or still recovering from the hurt of previous r-ship and so isn't ready to go all guns blazing, in which case patience and slow progress is good and it's fine if you lead (but only if he responds to that - which so far he does, it seems). The other, he is a bit on the fence and hasn't decided on the future, even though he does listen to you etc maybe he's just generally like this with people. But I need answers to the first Q to know which is way is more likely (imo).

noclueses · 05/11/2015 21:01

and I mean that in the scenario 1 he does think the world of you but due to those reasons isn't showing it very consistenly and his self protection is a priority.

Banzai · 05/11/2015 21:28

It's only been 7 - 8 weeks and how much we see each other varies. When we can. We both have busy lives with a lot of commitments.

I agree with your two possible scenarios. He's said things to indicate both are true. He's a man of few words.

OP posts:
Toffeelatteplease · 05/11/2015 21:33

Seven-eight weeks?!?!

Just enjoy and have fun

Ladylouanne · 05/11/2015 21:39

Banzai, I'm right in the middle of a similar situation with someone I've been seeing for approx 6 weeks (but got to know over a couple of months previously)

I actually posted a couple of weeks back as I was concerned that while he was lovely when we are together, I felt it was always me who suggested we meet up, even though he initiates texting etc

We can only really meet at weekends due to distance/ work

Anyway, I tried to broach this with him, in a bit of a jokey way. He seemed pretty surprised and said he loves seeing me. Things then moves into another conversation where we shared a lot of confidences, so at the time I felt much better.

However, the thing is, nothing's changed. It's Thursday and he's not mentioned anything about meeting at the weekend even though were on the phone for an hour last night. I've got some plans with friends but would still like to see him. however, I'm now sitting here thinking 'I'm not texting him first or bloody well asking to meet again'

While I accept all the comments about being proactive, it does get a bit soul destroying to feel that you're doing the leading, no matter how pleased someone is to see you.