Is spying ever ok?

[YouLostMeThere]

So, my (?D)H has several times now gone into my email accounts, checked my internet history, checked through my Amazon account. And he's only admitted it when I've worked out there is no other way he could have got information and confronted him, so not sure how much he has done it historically either. As far as I know he hasn't looked at my phone (nothing exciting on there btw) although he's very interested in who I'm texting and reacts to the 'ping' before I do. Is checking up on your other half ever ok? I haven't got anything to hide, but it has caused several rows because I feel invaded and that he doesn't respect my boundaries. He also manages to get and grab hold of the wrong end of the stick and WILL NOT let go! What do people think?? I don't know if I'm being over sensitive or if this is normal or what....

I have always checked up on partners, and I've always been proved right to do so.

(I now accept that monogamy is unrealistic.)

However I'm not stupid enough to reveal information that I gathered clandestinely, that's pretty strange behaviour.

I assume he's been cheated on many times before?

As far as I know he's never been cheated on, and certainly not by me, so his behaviour is really worrying me. He's been divorced before, that was 10 years ago, but she cited his unreasonable behaviour. I always thought that she was the bonkers one, but now I'm just beginning to wonder.

Has he ever given you a reason for why he does this?

I think everyone is entitled to privacy and to be trusted.

We have always known that you can't read someone else's diary, it is illegal to open letters that are not addressed to you and listening in to phone calls needs a special order from a judge. This need for privacy is universally accepted and the fact that the technology has changed does not alter that.

He says that we don't feel as close as we did, that we have lost the excitement that we had, that I'm not the person he first met (of course I'm bloody not, 2 DC and 8 years married and a lot of life experiences have taken their toll). He apologises and is shamefaced after I confront him, but then just goes back and does it again. He constantly asks me if I'm having an affair and doesn't believe my answer. He just says if it doesn't make sense to him then he can't accept it. Our sex life has suffered the usual bangs (sorry!) and knocks that everyone has to deal with post kids plus a bit - one child is very needy. but I now am really uncomfortable getting close to him because he simply doesn't seem to believe me - it's like I talk but the words don't make a sound or like shouting in a vacuum. It makes no difference. I've never given him any reason to check up on me. And it feels like a violation of personal space - like someone refusing to leave you alone, even on the loo! Sorry, rant over, bit upset and confused....

Thank you Atenco, that's what I feel too. Feeling very off balance.

Surely by not trusting you he is affecting the relationship, as no relationship truly works without trust.

I'd be very worried about him continuing despite you voicing your unhappiness about his actions.

The shame is more a case of him feeling sorry he got caught.

Personally, I think it's sad.
There are plenty of posts on this board where the DW is snooping on the DH and plenty of users are encouraging them.
If you feel the need to stoop that low then I feel it's time to get out of the relationship.

Yes, acatcalledjohn you're right, he is damaging the relationship. How can I share things with someone who doesn't understand boundaries, who flat out doesn't believe me.... I even found myself shaking while writing this thinking that no-ones going to believe that I'm Not having an affair - he's so persistent about it that I almost find myself doubting myself. Totally ridiculous. I know I'm not doing anything wrong, but I feel somehow in the wrong or guilty or misrepresenting...I just am baffled.

Don't feel in the wrong - you are not. He is for not trusting you without good cause and not respecting your boundaries.

FWIW, DP and I do not check each other's texts. Only with permission when we are expecting something from, say, a tradesman or friends, and whomever's phone it is on is busy with something or other.

It's normal. A relationship is one thing, but that does not stop you from being your own person with right to privacy.

Are you sure he's not projecting his own misbehaving on to you? E.g.: could he be having an affair?

I'm sorry you are having this in you life.

I felt that when I stopped trusting the other person. And it was all due to his refuse. I felt awful, unloved, unwanted and not sexy at all.
He literally ran away from me because I bursted into tears when he was using his phone. He didn't have anybody, but the way I felt was I'm not welcome in his life, he wouldn't share anything emotional and was completely distant. It ended bad!

Your H might be feeling distant and unwelcome from your side.

I do understand and would be angry with someone checking on me.
try to talk to him, politely, kindly and openly.

It's a torture really, and feeling is very overwhelming.

Thank you lovely people, I haven't really posted much on MN before, and even changed my name to do this as I'm so uncertain about whether he's still checking up on me. It's nice to hear that I'm not going mad and that other people have relationships with personal space in them.

This is not acceptable op and you feel it isn't . That's why you are asking here.

I was cheated on for many years by my exh but no way would I snoop on my new husbands phone, etc etc

He's bang out of order. I'd be furious. What a horrible thing to do.

I think I'd send myself an email from a pretend address saying

when shall we meet for sex

Then when it's opened say
Hello DH
Did that grab your attention. Good, because it looks like you are snooping again. I bet you thought you had found what you were looking for.
Sorry to disappoint you cos there's bott all going on...as usual.
However, I'm not prepared to be spied and snooped on any longer. I hope this is the last time you do this because it's the last time for me. This failure to trust me is ruining our relationship and is going to lead to us eventually breaking up and divorcing.

I hope you will take this in the spirit that's it meant as I'm seriously pissed off now and I mean business.

Your furiously fed up and unbelievably trustworthy wife.

That might do the trick!

Dowser Lol! brilliant. Sorry, I do retain my sense of humour whatever is happening, and this did appeal. I might try it. But seriously, thank you for the support.

Hello OP

The behaviour you describe is exactly how my ex-husband started to behave. He'd go through my bag (I would leave it in the kitchen at night), my pockets, my internet history.

He had convinced himself that he just wasn't snooping hard enough and it escalated over a period of 3 years. He recorded me in the house - video and audio - and had me followed by his mates. I would be given an allotted amount of time to get the weekly shopping and would be questioned at length if I took longer than expected (which shops did I go to, who did I talk to, etc etc). When my train home was delayed, I would have to text him a picture of the departure board to prove that I hadn't gone out after work.
He isolated me from my friends and family and told what I could and could not wear to work.

Most scary of all, he stole my used underwear and said he was going to send it away for forensic analysis. (He was high-ranking in the police at the time). He became very emotionally and physically abusive and ended up having a full-on psychotic episode. He got a 12-week suspended sentence for one thing he did to me - by then I was well aware that I couldn't 'fix' him. He only left me alone because of a restraining order.

What my ex did was so slow and insidious at the start that I didn't see how dangerous he was becoming.

I hear through extended family members that he still wonders how I managed to 'get away with it' when the truth of the matter is that I am a very boring, plain-living, full-time working mum with never the inclination nor time to be a cheat. Ironically HE was the cheat (three women, to my knowledge).

I'm not saying that your husband will go to these extremes, however I am concerned by his inability to acknowledge that what he is doing is exceptionally disrespectful to you. Like my ex, he seems to think he just hasn't found the evidence yet and cannot accept that there is no evidence to find.

If your husband is anxious about other aspects of life I would suggest he visits his GP.

Are you happy to go on living with him if he refuses to stop snooping, or is this a deal-breaker for you? FWIW I don't think he'll stop snooping unless you issue an ultimatum and are willing to see it through.

Good luck

goldierocks that sounds awful, I'm so sorry. Two months ago I'd have thought this was all totally ridiculous and I was being mental, but something has shifted in the last little while. I don't know what, but I feel so alone and isolated and I desperately want to share my feelings, but the person I want to talk to the most is my husband, but that's impossible because it's About him IYSWIM. The snooping is not the only issue, he's angry and shouty and paranoid and gets anxious. He keeps thinking that every tiny virus is him getting a tumour or going mad, he drinks waaaaay too much and works hard. He thought he was having a heart attack, and I took him to the doctor and they told him it was an anxiety attack (which I'd told him already as I recognised the symptoms - I have a history of dep/anx which is now well controlled). Theres more that I want to get off my chest but I'm worried about him finding this and identifying me - I'm not ready for that argument.

This all looks so bleak and awful as I write it. I do want things to work, and I don't want to break up a family and a a marriage. There are always two sides to a story, and I guess I'm only use beginning to properly look at our issues. Not ready to leap to the LTB conclusion - I'm stubborn like that! ??

DH never goes into any of my accounts. He could look if he wanted to, as I leave stuff open but respects my privacy.

I'd be very pissed off if he was always going through stuff though.

The anxiety stuff sounds very familiar. My DP also suffers from anxiety and thinks every little glitch in his body is a life long condition. He's learning to deal with it as I don't give it much time & thought, and he appears to be picking this up from me.

Thing is, he sometimes jokingly asks if I am going to see my lover when I get dressed up to go out with work or friends (which is rare). I dryly reply 'yes' and carry on with my day. I know he's messing, he knows I'm messing. We keep it short, sweet and lighthearted.

If your H is feeding his own anxiety he needs to see a psychologist. I would recommend visiting the GP.

1. He’s having an affair and is projecting his insecurities onto you. ‘If I’m able to cheat and get away with it, then I bet she is, too’
2. He’s a twat

I’m a naturally jealous person and I know I am – I also know that it’s not OK to ‘check up’ on your partner unless you have some serious doubts – I’ve snooped on exes and every time I have, I had a ‘gut feeling’ which was proved right and has ended 2 relationships to date. I’ve borrowed my current partners laptop and it was open on his email – as much as I want to ‘snoop’, I’ve shut it down quickly and I can honestly say, hand on heart, I’ve never looked at his phone, email or anything else that is his as I don’t have any justifiable ‘gut feeling’ as he doesn’t behave like an arsehole and his behaviour isn’t suspicious.

If he snooped on me, I’d feel very invaded and be very angry, therefore I give him the same respect and don’t look at anything.

The issue you seem to have is that your partner knows it’s a horrible thing to do, but he does it anyway – again and again and again.

I’d leave him – He doesn’t show any desire to change his behaviour and if you don’t give him consequences, you’ll be living with him behaving like this for the rest of your relationship.

1. He’s angry
2. He’s shouty
3. He’s paranoid
4. He snoops on you
5. He constantly asks you if you’re having an affair
6. He doesn’t respect your boundries

Sounds like a catch?

I think to do it regularly is strange, but every now and then I think is fine.

My dad cheated on my mum when I was 9, so yes I know I have trust issues, but it doesn't manifest itself in any other way other than once a month or two when DH is in the shower I will have a quick look on his phone, but I always say he can look at mine and I even say if I ever have a niggle of doubt I will look through it and he says "fair enough, you know all my passwords anyway, look through things whenever you want".

That in itself makes me trust him more (I would never say I trust him completely because I think it's very naive for anyone to say that, you don't know anyone's inner thoughts no matter how long you have been together)

Actually whilst DS and I were watching Dr Foster last night we were talking about being open with phones/laptops etc. And we both agreed that this whole culture of "well you should trust me to not look through my stuff" is a bit backward, I think it should be more "if you ever have ANY doubts please ask me, and feel free to look through my phone to reassure yourself, as I have nothing to hide."

If people are very sensitive about their privacy (not necessarily you OP) - it's usually there is something you don't want people to see.

Again if they checked every week it would be annoying, but once a month/couple of months, personally I don't see the harm at all.

Goldierocks WOW.

OP, It's not exactly 100% normal.

My relationship with DP is founded on our trust for one another. He doesn't even open my notepads (full of sketchy design ideas and shopping lists). Let alone my shopping accounts.

I have never looked through his phone or attempted to hack into his emails during our entire loving relationship. (1DC 1 more on the way).

Sorry, not trying to be gloatful, just offering a comparison for you to balance your opinion.

Emily, I am sorry for what you've gone through. I admit I have snooped on one occasion due to a gut feeling which was proved right. I'm not proud of it, and would not consider it again without very good cause.

Just a regular check every month or couple of months is not normal. The need for it shows you do not trust that person.

This is not ok at all.

I have nothing to hide but I would be really pissed off if DP went through my email and online activity because it's indicative of a total lack of trust. Everyone's entitled to privacy, both online and off, we do not have to open everything we do up to another's scrutiny just because we are in a relationship.

Sorry to hear that Goldie.

The reason why I likemy idea is that it sort of catches him red handed.

You aren't going to open the email and once it's opened you know he's read it and can deal with it.

It sounds like a nightmare situation and it's going to suck the lifeblood out of you if he doesn't stop.

He sounds a bit of a sick man Tobe fair. I mean mental health issues. Sad in a way that he's ruining j
His relationship when it's so unfounded.