Worrying about 'pity friendships'

[fiveacres]

Does anyone know what I mean - the sort of friendships where you sense that possibly people include you and invite you to stay because they pity you rather than because they really like you?

I have had a few pity friendships and it makes me wary that everyone sees me as a charity case! Can anyone empathise?

You may well be right in this particular situation, this family may invite other families over to 'be nice' or include people, or they may not. They may have one family one week, another group another week. But I don't think that's a huge pattern really.

If you don't gel with them, or don't feel they really like you and are just doing things for the kids, you don't have to go. Sometimes a family includes us in something and it doesn't really work out, we don't meet up again- it can be hard to find families where everyone gets on equally. But there's lots of types of friendships, we go to our neighbours for a BBQ but I'm sure if we didn't live near them and have similar age kids they wouldn't ask us. I don't classify this as a 'pity friendship', more a pragmatic one.

The easiest way to know if people really like you is to invite them over to yours- if they are not into you, they'll find an excuse.

Mumite your friend sounds kind, not pitying.

I really don't think 'pity' is what is going on here, in either situation, truly I don't.

I am nodding along at the 'mentor' comment.

I do think sometimes thinks can be next to impossible to 'properly' explain without knowing the people and the personalities involved. My non-invite the other week was not a deliberate snub and I didn't interpret it as such, but it did also send out a subtle message that 'you are not one of the group' which wasn't the intention of course. It's so subtle as to be subliminal: it is just a quick little flicker or change. Not really. Almost not quite.

It's okay - really! But I suppose I would honestly, truthfully (despite what someone said!) NOT be invited out of pity! Invite me because you like me - not because you feel sorry for me!

*think thing

Napoleon - I did explain that any invitations made on my part are politely rebuffed.

It's strange I know because complaints about friendship generally are along the 'all take and no give!' lines but I have the opposite problem in that these 'friends' will give their time and sympathy and invites but won't take mine in return.

It does make you feel churlish but then I also know in my heart of hearts that it is real.

I've read a bit more now and I totally identify with the example you have given of being invited one week and then others the next. My grandfather has a good phrase for the ones as described as the Christian couple looking after the younger lady: "do-gooders". I find such relationships very frustrating and hurtful too. For example, I have a friend who without fail remembers my children's birthdays and has always been there in an hour of need, but when I've asked if we would go out for a simple drink etc. she hs declined / postponed. Recently we did go out for lunch after she had cancelled twice and she told me when we met that she couldn't tell me the reason for cancelling before over text but her colleague had a disabled baby and those lunchtimes she was bringing him into the office and she wanted to support the colleague. It's hard to pin down why such a lovely person and obviously so kind could cause ME to feel hurt without, indeed, being accused of narcissism, but with "do-gooders" you really do feel that there is a kind of secret hierarchy of doing good and you are somewhere on the list based on "deserving of need" (i.e. a charity case). This friend is my age and because of her commitment to buying the children presents and saying she's always there if I need help, I have took that as an offer of friendship and tried to invite her out over the years to meal / cinema / walk etc. but always postponed etc. I finally plucked up the courage to say to her at the recent meal: "Do you manage to have much of a social life?" and she said it was hectic and she was out most evenings with friends. Which kind of crushed me (but at least I know where the land now lies...) No doubt she will continue to buy my children presents and will send me periodic texts as she does saying she's always there if I need a hand with anything etc.

Some people like to be the centre of a big circle, it sounds like these people are like that, and you all orient around them. The potential for really close reciprocal friendships obviously isn't there. You just have to decide if you are happy to go along every now and again, knowing how they operate.

I'm sorry if you took offence at my post. I read lack of self confidence into your OPs and a tendency to frame things negatively. I wanted to help. I typed my response between dc bath and bed whilst bf baby. If I stopped to sorry about every turn of phrase I'd never type anything on MN.

That said I clearly don't understand the situation in which you find yourself. If it's not working for you then branch out and make new friends as and when you find someone you gel with ask them if they'd like to meet for coffee or get together with DC.

I still maintain that by and large people don't make friends for pity. From your later example, It's not unusual for someone to be comfortable in their own space and be disinterested in doing things not on their terms providing they feel they are bring generous and are not bothered about reciprocation.

You don't explain very well what's bothering you. Apparently it's a ' know it when you see it' situation. I'm suggesting you could choose to view friendships differently. Or you can worry over every thing that might actually be negative even though it looks positive. It's going to be a long and hard life if you take that approach . Good luck.

Someone else nailed it higher up the thread -- its about confidence.

If someone invites you because they can see you are having a hard time they are not making any value judgements about you at all. Its the way you respond to that offer which impacts the way they feel.

If they sense that you are someone with a core of self belief who just happens to be down on their luck they will be chuffed to have made a good new friend.

If you give the impression that you are not worthy of the crumbs of attention they are giving, or try to get hostility or rejection in before they can, they may well conclude that you are someone to be pitied.

Of course it can be difficult to feel confident when you have gone through an awful life event. That's where the "fake it 'til you make it" thing comes in...

I think I understand what you are talking about but it has only happened to me a couple of times. The first time was when I broke my leg and had to hobble around secondary school, I suddenly found I had some quite insistent "friends" who had never been interested in me before. Then when I was frankly a merry single mother a friend of mine would insist on feeling sorry for me. She was lovely and kind but I very happily a single mother (I knew I was going to be a single mother when it was still early enough to abort if I'd wanted to), so I found it quite offputting.

But I wonder OP why so many people feel they should feel sorry for you? Either you are giving out lots of vibes that people should feel sorry for you or you are misinterpreting people who are genuinely extending the hand of friendship.

I can't help wondering if this is actually a way of protecting yourself. If you think people are pitying you when they offer help, you won't be disappointed if they don't. As that means you're not being pitied, hurrah.

You're also being very black and white. I have invited a friend for Christmas knowing they had nowhere else to go, and wanting them to have a nice Christmas because they are my friend and I care. I have also not invited people if I don't actually fancy spending Christmas Day with them.

I do think a lot of this is coming from within you, as you aren't seeing yourself as an equal. I have no contact with my birth family. If people invite me for things I am generally pleased that it occurred to them to ask. I suppose it depends how they ask, though. But I find most people don't feel sorry for others nearly enough so wonder how are you finding this people?

Is it possible that you are actually avoiding getting close to anyone?

The other thought I have is... sometimes when we are seemingly fixated on NOT wanting something, it's because we actually DO want it. You say you don't want to be pitied. Hmm. I'm wondering if you were shown enough compassion when you lost your mum. Is talking about not wanting to be pitied a cover for not feeling like people acknowledged your grief? Did you have access to any kind of counselling at the time?

Also, agree with this:
I think you are maybe confusing compassion with charity.

Are you proactively and inappropriately inviting yourself to things? I have one pityfriend but she's only that because she hounds me non stop. She's desperate be involved but is more of a nice associate then friend. We don't click enough to be more. It's still a pleasant relationship but nothing substantial or meaningful

Zen, don't worry, I wasn't offended :) But it was very kind of you to apologise anyway! I just wanted to clarify I hadn't been moping around.

Atenco, I don't feel a lot of people do. I think it is because I have real friends and I have pity friends and because of the contrast I am able to distinguish between the two. The pity friends very much want me to do things with them but refuse to do anything with me. The pity friends treat me as you would a child - a slightly wayward teenager which is exasperating!

Peppermint, not quite, as 'help' is welcome. I suppose it is the way that help is offered. My mum has been dead longer than I've been alive, now - I barely remember her!

Interestingly, I DO think I avoid getting close to people in a sexual and relationship sense but not in a friendship, particularly female friendship way. My female friendships are long lasting and strong, although I don't have as many as I'd like largely because of my twat of an ex.

I had a light bulb moment whilst reading your thread, five, I was very young again and my uncle used to take my mum and us kids to his house for the day. He was the one who "had done well for himself".

My dad was his brother and they hadn't got on, so when my dad died he took it upon himself to be the benevolent uncle.

It was all very nice and I used to enjoy it, but as I grew older I felt more and more patronised by it.

I realise that it has affected me throughout my life, I never, ever accept an invite unless I'm sure it's because they want me, as an actual person there. I've never spread myself thin, I love a few people a lot rather that lots of people a bit.

You post has made me think, five, so I thank you for that.

It is the charity/compassion thing, except I'm not sure that it is the OP getting confused as such but more that some people operate out of charity, and some out of compassion maybe?

I knew people who would offer invitations to people that they thought needed their help, and loved the 'oh, you're so wonderful' that followed, but would never actually include them in anything. It is a bit difficult to describe if you've not encountered it. And I can see why it's easy to assume that anyone who has is just viewing the world negatively. I tend to assume that the vast majority of people are basically kind and act out of compassion. I truly am pretty laid back and positive, but I have seen the dynamic the OP is talking about. Not very often admittedly. It doesn't make those people bad at all.

I went through a bad patch a while back and some people were very kind and I was overwhelmingly grateful for it all. It occurred to me that some people might pity me and then realised that in that context, I didn't care, but the help was lovely. If the help continued and I didn't feel equal, then that is a problem. When I haven't felt equal in friendships it has been quite a destructive feeling and it wasn't to do with pity in my case but it wasn't pleasant.

I am finding it difficult to explain because I appreciate that it is hard to talk about without sounding like you're ungrateful and view people through a negative lens. I'm talking about maybe a couple of people out of the many friends that I know well.

I think you are mixing up pity with kindness. Some people are very kind and genuinely want to help, others it can just be empty words/an insincere offer, others it might be pity.

However, I know/vaguely know lots of genuinely kind and helpful people. I'm part of a community

I would invite someone for Xmas but if have to like them.

Someone being kind to you doesn't always feel good.

I think I know what you mean OP, and I think I've experienced similar, but it doesn't bother me.

I split with my ex 10 years ago, and moved to a little village with my 3 week old baby, where I only knew one person. She was a very good and longstanding friend, but she worked full time so wasn't around as much as she would have liked to be. So basically I was on my own - no family nearby, no local friends - starting all over completely.

I went for walks in the village and chatted to random strangers, and joined all the available baby groups, and in the course of this I acquired several of what could be described as "pity friends". They were kind people, who didn't really know me at all, but saw that I had a tough life at the time, and tried to help out and involve me in things. Sometimes I wasn't invited to things because they were "couple" events (dinner parties etc) and I didn't fit, being a single parent. But it honestly didn't (and still doesn't) bother me. I don't have a dog, so I wouldn't expect to be invited on a dog walk. I don't have a partner, so I wouldn't expect to be invited to a couples dinner party.

Of course over the years I have met and made many friends, and some of the "sympathy" friends have become real friends, whilst some of them are just acquaintances who I just say hello to. But whatever their motives, I will always be hugely grateful to the people who picked me up and helped me out at a very low and lonely time in my life.

If you can, I would try and take the good from these friendships, and try not to think about anything that might be negative. And also remind yourself that they must like you, because however much pity someone can inspire, no one wants to spend time with someone they really don't like.

I'm not sure Jolly - the examples that I am thinking of are not really quite the same as dog walkers not inviting a non dog walking friend along.

At times, it reminds me of being with my parents. Liked and tolerated but not on an equal standing and not to be given equal 'rights' as it were.

I think I am more likely to be on the other side of this and now worrying about that.

Isn't there a place for kindness though?
I would totally offer a young person on their own at Christmas an invite to ours if I could even if I didn't know them. I would do this because I would imagine it's not nice to be on your own at that time. I wouldn't be offended if they declined but I would offer.
My parents are Christians but not major churchgoers but we very often had some extras at that time. Is it always a patronising bad thing? For myself I would rather spend Christmas with a kind stranger than alone although I appreciate others might feel differently.

I don't do it so much myself because I am too embarrassed/ very busy/ had a bad experience in the past but I have an American friend (not a Christian so no religious motive) who will always issue an instant invite for dinner or to play to anyone new especially anyone having a hard time. It a very socially mixed and mobile area around here with lots of people coming and going from all around the world and I have always thought it is really nice that she does that.
It couldn't be mistaken for friendship but it is an offer of hospitality which could then develop into friendship or it might not. I am struggling to see it as a bad thing. How do friendships start when you are new to an area otherwise?

I would invite people, not wanting friendship, but just to help them out. I wouldn't expect an invite back, because I don't need any more friends. However, I would expect that when their life gets back on track, they would invite someone else round - sort of pass it forward.

When I had a nasty accident, someone I only vaguely knew really helped me out with various jobs. I didn't think this was an offer of friendship. She just saw that I needed help, and I was really grateful. I didn't expect to maintain a friendship, and we haven't, as we had nothing in common. She was just a very kind person.

I think there's a room for kindness. However, I can see that it could be construed as pity friendship, depending on the circumstances.

This thread is wandering into ethics territory

If someone was going through something, alone at christmas etc. I would definitely invite them over.

You could argue that it's about me (I wouldn't like the thought of them alone, I wouldn't want to feel bad about that, it's not how I would like to be treated)

Ultimately, I like a bit of company / fellowship so try and be the friend I would like to have.

I have been advised I try too hard and just to take or leave any offers of friendship more casually - Good advice :)

I think you're expecting too much, five. Every family has its own friendship style and, on top of that, there are friendly activities which we do as social lubricant. For most people the 'lubricant' relationships may or may not become close friendships: most won't. This doesn't mean they exist for hidden reasons; it's just what humans do.

You must have heard the saying that true friends can be counted on one hand? Is it possible you resent not being (or crave to be) among everybody's five-or-less? I think that, if you closely interrogated the motives behind each friendly gesture, you'd often be disappointed as they are mostly shallow!

Might the 'different Sundays' family have been a case of close friends the following week ... and might your Sunday have been a trial run preliminary to inviting you into the circle? I wasn't there so can't tell either way, but I would suggest you might find this stuff easier if you take people at face value unless & until they start to become very close.

it reminds me of being with my parents. Liked and tolerated but not on an equal standing and not to be given equal 'rights'

Ah! Pardon my amateur psychologist hat (I think it suits me.) If your parents didn't manage to treat you as highly valuable, then it would make sense to be unconsciously seeking the unconditional love & deep respect from other people as an adult. I empathise a lot with that, and am sorry you didn't get the boundless support you deserved as a child.

The long-term answer is to learn how to love yourself unconditionally and find yourself rather wonderful In the meantime, there's a lot to be said for "fake it till you make it", while remembering that no-one is your parent. We're all just muddled-up human beings, like you!

Not quite Gilrack - it's that sort of amused indulgence i am treated with that very much reminds me of being a teenager with my parents. Both are dead now.

I do think perhaps it is something you have to experience to 'know' really. I see how on the face of things I risk looking churlish and sulky and I don't mean that.

This isn't about me finding myself wonderful. It's about others trying to make themselves feel wonderful and look wonderful and using me as the mechanism.