But we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

It's March 2015 and the Stately Home is still open to visitors. Unfortunately I have not been able to make the links work; is it possible for one of you lovely people to do that?.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012
January 2013
March 2013
August 2013
December 2013
February 2014
April 2014
July 2014
October 2014

Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller

Personality Disorders definition

More helpful links:

Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker

Some books:

Homecoming
Will I ever be good enough?
If you had controlling parents
When you and your mother can't be friends
Children of the self-absorbed
Recovery of your inner child

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

Bravo, I'm really sorry to hear about your mother's sexual abuse of your younger sister, possibly now of the youngest (?) and of you all by her behaviour. You're doing incredibly well to have overcome PND and to be handling all the challenges life's throwing you. Meerka's reply was good one. Therapy can be hard going at times, but it does grant you the strength & insight to make your own choices for your own good, which is difficult when you grew up around dysfunctional people.

Middle Sis must be in a right old state, one way another, given what her mother taught her about her worth. I'm pretty sure her GP could refer her for therapy - if she's open to suggestions, perhaps you could also urge her to find a Freedom Programme near her (and post on MN?!)

Keep writing here, if you want. It can be a big help in finding clarity with this stuff.

stacey unbelievable. either the world's most thoughtless card of downright malicious.

What fascinates me about this thread is the patterns of behaviour that are so familiar to us all. Being sulked at for months for daring to stand up to or correct a parent. My father once refused to speak to me for 2 1/2 years because I asked him if we could meet but didnt want to say what about over the phone. He finally broke the silence by sending back all my childhood photos in the post.

Better than binning them I suppose.

I learned many years ago not to tell anyone in RL , because they would blame me . And it's taken me years to accept that it's NOT me, it's them and I can't fix them . So I can't handle " well meaning " advice from people who haven't got a f###ing clue what they are talking about ,who try and get me to fix my family . Not because it would work . Or it would benefit me . But because it jars with their idealised idea of what families should be .

A few times we have HAD to tell people - we had to tell our children's school because my parents tried to access the children through them. But we just told the school that they didn't have contact with their grandparents because they were a risk to them because of things that have happened in the past.

That was enough to trigger the schools safeguarding policy And they didn't ask for any more details , just made a note on their files . Once the Gp found out that that method didn't work, they gave up very quickly . It's not that they wanted to see the children, you understand, they were just very angry that they couldn't control me any more .

And of course they just wanted to make an attention seeking scene outside the school and make everyone feel sorry for them . They LOVE scenes . Any event that was not actually about my mother is turned into being about her because she causes a scene .

Eg at BILs mothers funeral ( so her daughter's MIL ) . You know at the end of the funeral , when everybody is standing outside the church and the undertakers carry the coffin out and put it in the herse, then the immediate family gets into the car behind , and everyone stands and watched quietly in respectful silence ? My mother started screaming abuse at my BIL as he and his father got into the car . Yes, just behind his mothers coffin . In front of about 200 mourners .

Eg at birth of my sisters child ( her first grandchild ) . We are in the waiting room , sister is in labour , her DH is in with her. BIl comes into the room to say they are rushing my sister to theatre as baby is in distress . He's been kicked out because its a general anaesthetic . He's terrified of course .

My mother starts to scream abuse at him ( in busy waiting room full of nervous families chain smoking ) because it's HIS FAULT . Because her " got her pregnant" ( they had been married for several years) .

She screamed at him " what about me ? [ your wife ] will die and I will be left to bring up the baby ! "

Sadly for my mother , my sister didn't die so she had to steal her child instead .

You'll not be surprised to know that this classy lady is very religious ( ha ha ) and very " respectable " , sees herself as Middle class . She woudl correct you if you used words like " bum " or " pregnant" as they are vulgar and practically faint if you swore .

Meerka - I don't think the card was thoughtless

You couldnt forget to tell one of your two children that her father had died . Then suddenly remember 6 weeks later and decide to include it on a card to your young grandchild instead . It wasn't in a separate letter addressed to me or anything, it was written in his birthday card

The irony is that DS woudl have opened it, seen that

(A) it was a babyish card
(B) there was no money in it

And thrown it aside . He's never met them ( they don't want to see him remember ) and he's never had a gift from them, only a couple of birthday cards in his life . And he's at that unpleasantly materialistic age where all that counts is presents , sweets and money . Cards don't cut it with him , there's no " oh well it's the thought that counts " .

I had assumed that it was just a coincidence that they held the funeral on my birthday and now decided to notify me on my sons birthday . I know I shoud be devastated but I'm not - I just think how stupid and pathetic they area, that they have nothing better to do with their lives than plot to hurt me or my kids .

Sigh

I'm an infrequent poster and lurker on this thread and just wanted to offer my support to recent posters. I'm and for you all and you all sound so lovely.

Sorry, it takes me so long to think and type, it looks like I'm ignoring everyone else posts

" My father once refused to speak to me for 2 1/2 years because I asked him if we could meet but didnt want to say what about over the phone. He finally broke the silence by sending back all my childhood photos in the post. "

Oh my word Meerka , refusing to say something on the phone ? What a heinous crime !! Surely it deserves 2.5 years !! Isn't it weird the small things that set them off? Just any sign of us having our own thoughts or opinions. Not Being controlled be them ,deviating from our script in the soap opera that is their lives , in which we have walk on parts .

At least I commtted a capital crime - we refused to let them see our children without ( our) supervision. That resulted in a phone call in which they said " we no longer consider you to be our daughter " , followed by not speaking to me for years . Then telling everyone in the family that I had said I'd never speak to them again and forbidding them to have anything to do with me

The they tried to access the children through school , and when we stopped that, they because even more threatening . Of couse, all this did was show up how right we were to not let them see the children alone , and how so much better life was without them .

Because any reasonable person woudl try to make amends, negotiate , build bridges . And all they did was guerrilla warfare , trying to hurt our children .

Thnak you fuzzy , it's such a relief to have somewhere to talk about it , where people understand . I'm sure that if I told anyone else in RL , they woudl think I was a heartless b##ch

Fortunately Dh comes from a stately homes family too, so he understands. Although his way of dealing with it is to ignore it / not talk about it . Maybe that's more a male thing ? ( or am I just stereotyping )

This is so hard. I've read so many posts on here in the past giving advice and nodding and agreeing. But as soon as the advice is to me about my own mother I feel the need to back-pedal furiously. I thought I was on top of this but I'm clearly not. I'd been convincing myself I have no FOG anymore but I obviously do evidenced by the fact at right now I'm too scared to look in my inbox in case there's another email from her.

In her first email on Sunday she said she was very hurt and although she loves my kids was cancelling the visit. DH was shocked at the coldness of its tone. DD who's 12 said "where's her concern for your feelings? Is she not even bothered about how upset you were?" None of this had even occurred to me. It all seemed perfectly normal.

Thanks everyone who's read my posts and given me advice and support. I can't tell you how relieved I am to finally get some of this out.

Meant to add, Stacey at the birthday card. Beyond belief.

Hi everyone, just catching up on everyone's posts and I'm shocked but a tiny bit glad that there is people out there with parents like mine!! Makes me feel like I'm not alone! I have told 2 dear friends about my family and thankfully they understand and one of them even told me she always thought I used to do too much for my family ( this is when I was still trying to seek their approvel)
Anyway I'm off work last few days due to pregnancy sickness ( all day vomiting) and when I called my boss to inform her that I would be missing work she was very understanding and told me to look after my self and to get plenty of help and she asked me was my mom helping me out, I said yes cos it's easier to lie but when I got off the phone I did have a little cry.

I know it was my choice to go LC with my family and I had to do it for my own sanity, but it's comments like my boss made that make me yearn for the type of mother who would come in and look after me, clean my house, make my dd something to eat etc I know I sound pathetic and I am all hormonal which isn't helping matters!! But does anyone else get me?
Luckily I have great friends who have helped me with my dd etc and dh has been very patient and kind putting up with my moods and sickness and keeping our house in order so it's not that bad.

Privatematter

That is why I mentioned FOG earlier; you are still mired in FOG really with regards to your mother (who is not worthy of the term). Your behaviours are typical really of an ACON (an adult child of a narcissist). You've been trained/conditioned by her to put her needs first and yours dead last.

I would also now start putting in place small but significant boundaries; these need to be consistently applied. Blocking her e-mail account for a start would be good. If you do not want to totally delete her e-mails, put these in a spam folder without reading them.

Do read "Will I ever be good enough" by Karyl McBride as this is about the daughters of narcissistic mothers. Also the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers website is worth a read too.

goldenrose

Welcome to you (and the other newbies).

Congratulations on your pg and I hope you feel better soon. If things do not start to improve do seek medical advice. Am glad that your boss was understanding of you; it also shows you that there are some decent people out there. Am also glad to read that your DH and DD are supportive too.

It is NOT your fault that your family of origin are the ways they are; you did not cause them to act like that. Their own parents likely did that lot of damage to them.

private But as soon as the advice is to me about my own mother I feel the need to back-pedal furiously. Me too! I've just been reading back through some old emails between me and my sister regarding my mum. My sister has been telling me for at least 5 years that our mum is a selfish twat, but I just didn't want to see it.

We had phone conversations where my sis would say "Yes, she makes you feel awful when she visits because she's a horrible person!" and I'd be and say "No she's not!" Even though she blatantly is! It's so, so so hard to break the habit of a lifetime and accept that this person who you needed to be warm and loving and nurturing is actually a complete waste of space. :(

Hello goldenrose I hope you feel better soon. Yes it's upsetting sometimes when you have to realise "I should have this support from my mum and it's just not there."

Peppermint I've been NC quite a few years now, and I agree that the grief kicks in more as you go further down the line. Partly I think because as you heal more you get safe enough for those feelings to emerge, but also partly because the knowledge of it, the way it goes on and on, is painful.

I probably hoped at the back of my mind that going NC would bring them to their senses, although that wasn't why I went NC of course. As the years have gone by and I've realised nothing will bring them to their senses, and the initial desperation of just getting them out of my life, getting them to stop hurting me and messing with my head has passed, the sense of just how huge the loss is hits harder.

It's still the only healthy thing I could have done, it's still been a huge positive in that it's given me the space and the safety to deal with and process a lot of the past, and grow into my own person, but I think it's a myth that NC will stop the hurt.

It stops them actively hurting you any more, and I would never minimise how important that is, but it doesn't stop the hurt of not being cared about, not being loved by your own parents - in some ways that's all the more vivid and obvious when it's not hidden behind a smokescreen of a fake, barely functional relationship.

I've often wondered about starting a separate thread specifically for support around being long term NC with your own parents (as opposed to ILs, not that that issue doesn't need huge support too, but I think it's a very different journey). Is anyone else interested in that?

My warmest wishes to all on this thread, whatever stage you're at of dealing with abusive/dysfunctional family. We all deserved better, each and every one of us.

Goldenrose - remember that it's not because you went LC that she's not there helping. She wouldn't be there anyway, however you behave. I was once told by a locum GP that I didn't have PND, I just had no one around to support me. (He was wrong, I did have PND but the fact that DPs were a few streets away and too wrapped up in their own social life to care didn't help.)

What concerns me is how mean spirited and bitter it has made me. Not towards DC, at least. I do think I've got that one right. When DS2 was one, having been touch and go ill for a year, DF had an accident and was in a wheelchair for a year. DM was dying for help but she knew she couldn;'t ask me because she'd been far too busy to help me when I was snowed under with two tiny children, one of whom was ill. So she had to cope with that horrible aggressive man barking orders at her all on her own. And I'm afraid I did think 'Karma.'

Now they are getting too old to keep up their astonishing social whirl of a life and they're wishing they had closer family ties. DM even said so. I said nothing. I was supposed to reassure her but didn't. They've shown no interest in us, and scant support for us in hard times over the years, and now they are all baffled that I'm so much closer to DH's loving family.

I know they are trying to make amends but those amends are self serving. I'm the only one left nearby and they are feeling a bit lonely now they don't have the energy to party every night. But I feel hard hearted towards them. I feel: too late. And I even quite like watching them work out how their behaviour has landed them in it. Actually all this refers to DM, who is the sweeter of the two. DF doesn't care who is in the room with him as long as all the attention is on him and him alone. But then I feel guilty and mean spirited and down about it all.

Stacey yes it is a huge relief! No-one in RL understands my DM issues either! It's only here that I've truly had my eyes opened to what her behavior is, and that it's not my fault, and that it's not me that's 'difficult'. This has defined me for many years, and I'm in my forties!
I've successfully gone LC with my DM in the last 9 months, with guidance from Attila and other wise mumsnetters. Their advice really works! (I keep conversations light, impart very little detail about my life and keep boundaries high. I offer practical, unemotional responses to her endless stream of ailments.) I occasionally feel like I'm being a cold bitch but boy has it released me to enjoy and revel in the healthy relationships I have with other people.
Lots of love to all Stately Homers!

Thanks all

It's just so good to hear from other people that their parents behaved like this!! I used to look at some of my friends when we were growing up with envy because I could see how well they got on with their families, I used to look at mine and wonder why!! My mother reading my diary when I was a teenager and coming in from school to have all my private thoughts thrown into my face not just by my mother by my siblings too and laughed at and jeered at because I had a crush on a boy.
My siblings all got involved too looking back I think it was a case of trying to please my parents by going along with their little games especially in my younger brothers case, he was and still Is the scapegoat like me and used to do anything to get their approvel ( he often was the one who used to find to diary and give it to my parents)

This is just one example of the shit I put up with, know it might not sound like much but it was all about how to belittle each other my parents encouraged this is the worst part.

It sounds like a lot goldenrose. A whole family ganging up on one family member, one parent as the ringleader? Grim. What an awful betrayal of trust on your mother's part.

Goldenrose That is really similar to something that happened to me... More than once unfortunately... Absolutely mortifying and had an effect on my perception of myself and my ability to enjoy my own sexuality for fear of being a 'slut' for years - well into adulthood. It's so harmful.

My situation was that I was living with DGPs at the time due to other family ructions and was visiting DPs regularly as part of access agreements. There was a boy in their street who liked me and in my little teenaged way, I really liked him. Very handsome etc - I think I was about 13 and it was my first kiss... You can imagine the swooning - we've all been teenagers, right?!

Dsibling (the golden child) told DPs (who despite telling everyone who would listen how liberal they were and prancing around naked in the house etc to show us how liberal they were) with a few added details for good measure and scandal and DPs absolutely hit the roof.

I told the truth, mortified to admit that I had been kissing but denying the rest (DSIB said he had showed me his willy - he hadn't) was told I was a show, was bringing shame on the house, all the neighbours were talking about me as he had boasted it all over the street (pretty sure this was all lies - who cares about two teenagers snogging?!) and that I was a tart, slut, slag etc. Was told that if that was the way I chose to behave then I shouldn't darken their door again. After I had gone home they then wrote to me at DGPs during the week before my next weekend access visit to tell me that we were now NC. This was the first of their NCs. I was 13.

MENTAL.

golden if you are still very sick with the preg, do come to the Hyperemesis Support thread. Lucinda and the other women there are truly supportive (I don't think you've posted there yet?? or is my memory cell malfunctioning again?).

There's a lot of good tips on how to cope with severe nausea and vomming in preg.

It's a funny thing about my father and that 2 1/2 years not speaking. For me it was a triumph because it was the first time ever that I'd stood up to him. It gave me a bit of self-power back - power that should have been mine years ago.

It's a very long time ago now mind you. Even then it took some years for me to realise that his behaviour wasn't normal for a loving father, wasn't right. But it was a big step on the journey to becoming free of inappropriate control; a journey Im still on, but now it's in my head. His conditioning is still powerful. As time goes on it's easier to see though and while I can't crack the conditioning yet, that's ok. I know it's there and probably the time will come.

privatematter isn't funny how we think it is all our fault and we deserve it and it takes a 12 year old to show us that our parents should be thinking of us! She is wise one and is a credit to your parenting.

goldenrose your comment but it's comments like my boss made that make me yearn for the type of mother who would come in and look after me, clean my house, make my dd something to eat etc That's what we all want it's called a a normal mother.

I used to be jealous of my friends as their mothers used to buy the DC school uniform when they were starting a new school. I was envious closeness of them knowing it was a new school (my parents couldn't be bothered to remember) and going out together to buy the uniform. I sound pathetic. They were of course quite happy to spend £30/40 each of the DC on some plastic tat though

Congratulations on your pregnancy!

lastlines First thing I thought was 'karma'!

Hello I have been lurking on this board on and off for years but only diagnosed my mum with NPD recently. She is unbelieavably difficult and always makes me feel like everything is my fault and what a shit daughter I am even though I tried for 30 plus years to be the wonderful daughter. Never quite made it. I have to rant because I just failed at not being dragged into a crap conversation.

Anyway my Dad is totally henpecked and does her dirty work (like mean phonecalls on her behalf) for an easy life. He does EVERYTHING for her - cup of tea in bed every day for the last 50 years, dinner cooked, lifts given etc. She had a high profile job and has since retired which has made her worse - she has to remind people of her job all the time or tell complete strangers etc.

Anyway I have been trying LC but enduring horried snidey phonecalls and just now I snapped at my Dad. He was saying 'we never see you and the kids (lie) now that we;re old it would be nice if the impetus came from you.' He would never ring up just to say hi how are you - there is always something that they need to tell me (how shit I am) or something I have to do. Currently they just want me to go over and sort out their technology issues - not even under the guise of having a nice lunch and oh while you're here..... My mum even calls it 'Payback time' - ie we put you through university now you need to pay us back.

once they came round for lunch and my mum told me, apropos of nothing exactly how much I had cost them to the nearest pound, (for university, donation to wedding, first house etc. I was gobsmacked. She had gone through 30 years of accounts to work it out.

So I told my Dad it would be nice if when he called me (I usually call them) that it would be to have a nice chat, not to tell me that I had disappointed them, again. He said I was over-sensitive and I said, no I just have normal feelings and I am fed up of always being told I am rubbish. He pulled the 'we're not as young as we used to be' card plus various non-illnesses to try to make me feel bad. I stuck to my guns and said I would be seeing my sister and her kids for my birthday soon and would they like to come along. He said he would consider it and then hung up. WTF!!!??

Hippymama1 In the slut stakes I was at the opposite end of the scale. I feel very ashamed of that now and would be mortified if my DC knew. I know it sounds a bit of a cliche but I wanted love and attention.

'we never see you and the kids (lie) now that we;re old it would be nice if the impetus came from you.' that is the sort of thing my parents would say. Except they weren't exactly racing up and now the motorway all the time when the DC were younger.

privatematter listen to your DD! She is a very bright.

goldenrose Congratulations! The best thing to do is think that if your DM did come to help there would be a price to pay and you would feel worse

innerturmoil

What you describe are precisely the inner workings of a narcissistic family structure right down to your mother's DH aka enabler and hatchet man. This type of dysfunction is repeated over and over. He has also acted out of self preservation and want of a quiet life, he has also totally failed you here and has failed also to protect you from your mother's (I use that term advisedly) malign influences and abuse. Even his words are typical of the enabler. Such weak men like him need someone to idolise.

People from dysfunctional families end up playing roles; what are you to them?.

Having ever a nice chat with either of them is simply not possible.

May I ask why you thought it necessary to ask them along to your birthday celebrations?. Again that may be because you were being nice and reasonable or even conditioned by them to do that. Honestly they would do you a huge service if they did not attend; you owe these people really precisely nothing. Narcissistic women cannot do relationships at all and it may well be that her H your dad is just as narcissistic as she is. At the very least he is self serving.

It is not you, its them.

I would seriously now consider going no contact with them; it is not possible anyway to have any sort of relationship with a narcissist.

I would also keep these two well away from your children as well because narcissists in particular make for being deplorably bad grandparent figures. Such people tend to either over value or under value the relationship with their grandchild, I cannot stress enough how awful they are as grandparent figures. They were not good parents to you and they are the self same now although they will act a bit differently with your children. The methods they used on you will not be precisely the same as used on them now. They are still narcissistic.