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Original poster

Doesn't want to marry me

62 replies

Moopants · 03/03/2015 21:35

We've been together for over 7 years, lived together six of those and have a five year old. We were planning on trying for another baby at his request. Neither of us are spring chickens. Today I approached the topic of marriage. He's been engaged before in much shorter relationships but he has never approached the subject with me. After years of hoping for a 'surprise' proposal, I finally got the courage to ask what the issue was. I got all the usual lad bible crap. It's just a bit of paper, we're already living together and have a child together so why do we need to etc. I explained why it was important to me and he got angry. Starts shouting and crying, saying that I doubt his feelings for me. He managed to turn it into my problem. Thing is I know how he feels for me and I don't doubt it for a second, I just thought it would be nice to make it all official, to go to the next level. For our child to have parents with the same name (yes I'm old fashioned that way). I don't want a wedding just the marriage. It's not about dresses or parties. I've felt like crap all day. If he loves me so much and if it is only a bit of paper, what's the problem? He can't or won't divulge more than I've explained. He takes my wanting to talk about it as thinking he doesn't love me, when it's the complete opposite. If I thought there were problems I wouldn't be approaching the subject of marriage, I'd be discussing separation. Turns out marriage is the problem. I love him with all I have but can't help feel there's more to his reasons for not wanting to marry me and I don't know what to do. It will niggle away at me in the back of my mind and I'm worried I'll end up resenting him. What should I do? Forget it and move on or move out?

OP posts:

NaiceNickname · 03/03/2015 21:43

Ask him to look into the legalities and practicalities of being married, especially when you have children. It's not just about having a wedding and a party, it's also about protecting your family. Perhaps raise that argument for it and see how he responds to that? It's a typical blokes response.. "it's just a bit of paper". I have to admit I'd be quite insulted if he has proposed before yet went on to have kids with me and then suddenly had these opinions of marriage.

blueberrypie0112 · 03/03/2015 22:08

marriage is important for some, just a piece of paper for others. It was important to me, though. Afterall it is just piece of paper, what's the big deal if we are married or not. We plan to be with each other for the rest of our lives, and share everything, anyhow. It is up to you. But do prepare that your relationship may not go back they way it was if you decided to leave him. You will have to move forward and maybe you will meet someone who feel the same way.

SelfLoathing · 03/03/2015 22:09

but can't help feel there's more to his reasons for not wanting to marry me

I think you're right. Happens all the time. Look at Johnny Depp - with Vanessa Paradis for 14 years + children. He said:

"I never found myself needing that piece of paper," he said. "Marriage is really from soul to soul, heart to heart. You don't need somebody to say, okay you're married."

And oh look at that he's now married to Amber whatshername.

It's worse if he's been engaged before.

It's your call. If being married is important to you, it's unlikely to happen here unless you give an ultimatum you are prepared to follow through on.

Be prepared for a future split and him marrying someone else in the blink of an eye though. There maybe something to be said for an exit on your own terms with dignity if it is a deal breaker for you.

KatelynB · 03/03/2015 22:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

blueberrypie0112 · 03/03/2015 22:10

(That post above about how I feel about marriage apply to me only so I don't expect anyone to agree)

IAmAShitHotLawyer · 03/03/2015 22:17

If it's only a piece of paper then why not get married?

blueberrypie0112 · 03/03/2015 22:19

And another suggestion is to drop the whole thing and continue as you are. He knows how you feels, one day he may decide to ask you afterall.

CharlieSierra · 03/03/2015 22:24

I would be very concerned about his irrational response to a perfectly reasonable question, he's behaved like a child. Is this normal for him? He may have reasons for not wanting marriage, if so he should be prepared to justify them and have an adult discussion so that you can decide what you want to do.

I do think that 'waiting years for a surprise proposal' is the wrong way to go about things too though, why would you not discuss your plans and expectations for your future together, especially since you have a child?

Primadonnagirl · 03/03/2015 22:28

It's fine for people to have different views about marriage, but it's NOT fine for one person to refuse to discuss and try to see a way forward. I'm sorry Moo, I think you are right in saying there's more to it. But it doesn't sound like he's going to give you the courtesy of telling you.I do think you need to have the " is it a deal breaker?" conversation with yourself. In the meantime tell him you want to seek legal advice so you and your child can have the best protection possible, sort out wills etc.

3mum · 03/03/2015 22:29

Fine, then I think you need to understand what he is really saying. Because I think he is trying to shut you down with his crying and carrying on.

Being married gives you certain rights to property and in law. Those rights are not given because the law is terribly benevolent, but because they are necessary to protect and stabilise families, particularly where children are involved. It is possible to pretty much replicate the position you would be in if you were married by written agreements which any lawyers should be able to draw up and which would not cost that much to do. (Marriage is much more tax efficient on death though). Nothing to stop you using his surname as yours even if you are not married. Deed polls are cheap and easy to do.

Ask him if he will agree to protect you and the children by replicating the legal position of marriage. I bet you this supposed aversion to marriage is all about him keeping control of "his" assets. Whose name is your home in? Do you make equal contributions to pensions? Do you have equal savings? Do you have equal access to cash and assets? Who pays for childcare? Is he worried that is you were married and subsequently split, he would have to pay you maintenance? Ignore this at your peril.

Quitelikely · 03/03/2015 22:29

Tell me: does he have lots of financial assets or a high earning job?

Is he expecting to inherit a large fortune?

NeedABumChange · 03/03/2015 22:31

If he doesn't want to get married than you can't force him. If the piece of paper is the be all and end all then you'll have to leave him and find someone who does want to get married.

HootyMcTooty · 03/03/2015 22:32

Do you have wills? Do you work or are you a SAHM?

Personally I wouldn't consider having a baby at someone else's request, married or not.

MelonBallersAreStrange · 03/03/2015 22:32

Are you financially independent from him?

username12345x · 03/03/2015 22:38

It's not just "a piece of paper".

Firstly, it is an official, formal and legally binding commitment. Not just a "trust me because I live with you" informality.

Secondly, it gives you as a wife legal rights you wouldn't otherwise have over property and on death.

Thirdly, it legitimises your children. That may be a terribly old fashioned view these days as so many children are born out of wedlock - but it is still true.

Fourthly, because of all of the above, it gives your children a great psychological security because their parents are married.

100% not just a piece of paper - especially for a woman from a property and financial point of view. You are not being unreasonable to want it and a man who is seriously resisting has a big problem. If he really thought it was "just a piece of paper" then the answer is "it's no big deal to you is it so lets do it". He knows it's not just a piece of paper as does any rational person. When was the last time you heard a woman use that phrase?

WaxOnWaxOff · 03/03/2015 22:39

There's a horse's arse disappearing over the horizon, the conversation about marriage is 5 years and one child too late.

I second a PP's suggestion that you ask him to get along to a solicitors appointment with you to ensure that you have as much of the legal protection and privileges that marriage offers, without needing that pesky 'bit of paper'. His reaction to that will be quite telling.

Meanwhile, please don't give up your career and make yourself financially dependent on this man.

Original poster

Moopants · 03/03/2015 22:41

I had to laugh at the people bringing up finances. I'm the one with assets and money. It's always been that way. It's certainly never been about the money, we have discussed that and that should something happen to me it goes into trust for our child. As for any inheritance, I've no idea what his family have. In scots law any inheritance he gets I would have no access to should we divorce unless it was spent on eg a family home. We have no need for that.

OP posts:

Original poster

Moopants · 03/03/2015 22:45

It's interesting those who feel marriage is just a piece of paper and that all I'm after is a piece of paper. I have access to lots of paper. What I want is the personal vow, the commitment, the unity, the declaration to the world. Perhaps that's old fashioned of me. Lots of cynical responses making gender stereotype assumptions. I'm sad at that

OP posts:

MelonBallersAreStrange · 03/03/2015 22:46

I didn't feel that marriage was important. Yep, waaaay back all those years ago, I really wasn't bothered.

DH felt differently. Marriage was important to him. So we got married.

It happened that way because I didn't object to being married to him. I just wasn't bothered either way.

Your DP doesn't want to be married to you.

He had a tantrum.

He really doesn't want to be married to you.

This is not a "not bothered much about marriage, it's just a piece of paper" situation. He is having tantrums FFS. He is not marrying you despite it being important to you. He really doesn't want to be married to you.

What do you think is the real reason he doesn't want to be married to you?

Quitelikely · 03/03/2015 22:47

Ok, so you have the money and it all goes to your dc if anything happens to you - what about your dp, does he not get a look in then?

Anyway IMHO the fact that he was crying when you raised the issue is a massive red flag, totally ott response to a standard question and for that reason I'm going to say he was trying to disguise the real reason he won't marry you.

What that is, well I've got no idea. Only he can tell you but he doesn't want to because he knows you won't like the answer.

Good luck

MrsWolowitz · 03/03/2015 22:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GooodMythicalMorning · 03/03/2015 22:58

I agree. Dont have another baby yet. It doesnt sound great but does sound like another conversation is needed.

eveylikesv · 03/03/2015 23:00

Move on but be prepared to move out. I am in the similar boat to you op. Almost 10 years together, 1 dc. Was kind of promised years ago that yes we will get married, just need to buy a flat first blah, blah, blah.

I am sick of people saying with surprise: oh, but l thought you are married. Nope, good enough to clean, cook, cheap in to mortgage but not to marry.

I am now passed the point of wanting to marry him. I accepted l am passed the 'sell by' date now, just happy l have ds.

Sorry, not much advice/ happy ending story to share here.

If it was 'just' a piece of paper gay people wouldn't spent decades fighting for the right to marry. It is a written commitment to other person, rather than l am with you but keeping all my options open in case someone better turns up.

LisaMed · 03/03/2015 23:07

I don't know how it is in Scotland, but in England if you died he would have no right to bury you.

KatelynB · 03/03/2015 23:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

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