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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Emotional abuse, husband threatening to take the children

61 replies

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 16:34

I have posted in the mental health section too.

My husband moved out some months ago. He has continued to see the DC at the family home and we have arranged marriage counselling. There had been past abuse on both sides, I have serious mental health issues which I've never been able to receive proper help for. I have recently started counselling individually and we are on the waiting list for marriage counselling.

Today I walked out of the home after it all became too much. I had been in tears last night and my husband shouted at me and was angry with me. This is standard behaviour on his part. He also walks out during rows and goes to his room and refuses to speak to me or answer my texts. Sometimes for days.

I'm going to stay with my Mum and try and speak to the council about housing there. Also women's aid, although I'm not sure what they can do? My husband I suspect, thought I'd come back later today as I would never usually do anything like this and now he knows I am on the train he has started sending me messages saying he will not let the DC move with me as they aren't safe with me as I'm suicidal.

I feel so broken and emotionally abused by him I don't know whether I'm coming or going. Any support or advice would really be helpful right now.

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 08/02/2015 16:39

How old are your children?.

Joint marriage counselling is NEVER ever recommended where there has been or is abuse within the relationship. Any joint counselling sessions need to be cancelled. He will simply use that as a further stick to beat you with even if he did attend any sessions and you've been beaten down enough by him already.

His comments re your mental health are designed to keep you in line so he can still abuse you. Such men do not let go of their victims easily.

Womens Aid can and will help you here escape your abusive husband. Their number is 0808 2000 247. Please call them, they will help and not at all judge.

TheSilveryPussycat · 08/02/2015 16:55

I suspect your mh will start to improve now you are away from him. Keep strong! sending warm wishes

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 16:56

Thankyou. The counsellors know about the abuse and we have had additional (separate) assessment appointments to address this and will start counselling individually at first with a view to couples counselling after that. Is that still not a good idea?

Although that said, I'm in two minds about whether to just leave now. He says he doesn't love me, he doesn't care if I find someone else. That our marriage is shit. I am aware he is abusive, but I can no longer separate the abuse from what he actually means. I've told him i think he is being nasty as a way to upset me and control me, he denies this. I suppose he would.

I have spoken to women's aid before. He knows this. He refers to my 'women's aid shit' and 'women's rights shit'.

OP posts:
Vivacia · 08/02/2015 17:13

Why do you want to stay with him?

trackrBird · 08/02/2015 17:17

You shouldn't be in a position where you walk out of your own home to get away from a husband who has already moved out. Did he move back in? Or is he using child access time to push the boundaries, and berate you further?

Please do call women's aid. They can support you, and help you think clearly about your options.

Couples counselling is really not recommended if there is abuse in the relationship. It can do more harm than good.

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 17:18

So the DC can live with both parents. Because I'm scared of the alternative and I think it means I'll be single forever. I don't work and haven't done for years and I have no financial security. I do think I love him, but how can I when he treats me so badly?

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Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 17:25

He hasn't moved back in. He stays at weekends to help with the DC at night/so that I can lay in. Although the lay ins are few and far between. We take the DC out together. We sleep together. I cook for him every single day. I am a bloody mug. I know I am. It's all completely on his terms. I feel like he genuinely believes he isn't abusive though and fat the problems are my fault. He has even got me believing it.

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Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 17:27

And re: the couples counselling. We are going to relate. Well, the Scottish equivalent. Why would they agree to se us if it was potentially damaging? My individual counsellor has also said she thinks couples counselling will help.

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Lweji · 08/02/2015 17:31

Right, you need boundaries.

No bloody visits at home. No contact with him except via email or text. He should arrange for someone you trust to do handovers, or go to a place you trust and it's public. Use the counselling to support you and forget the joint part.

Get yourself a solicitor and work on extricating yourself from him. Get WA on board.

mix56 · 08/02/2015 17:32

If you have been reading the threads for some time, you have learned the ground rules for an EA.
Everyone says "I think I still love him" until slowly the manipulation & trauma wear off, BY BEING AWAY FROM HIM. by speaking to "normal" people
You need to call WA, get on the FP, & start learning that the way you have been living is actually living hell.
He tells you you have mental health issues, he has lead you to doubt your very sanity.
Please take your kids & leave. He will try & rope you back in as soon as he realizes you have really gone.
Go NC, do NOT listen

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 17:33

It's so hard because I love hundreds of miles from my family and he is often the only adult contact I have. It's also hard to cope due to my mental health problems/depression.

I am hoping if I see the council they will try and house me urgently, but I don't know if I am being too hopeful? Will womens aid be able to help with that at all? I've looked at private lets, but it's so expensive and hard to find anywhere if you're going to be on benefits.

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Lweji · 08/02/2015 17:35

Relate has been consistently considered by MN posters as useless in abuse cases.
Counsellours are not likely to be trained in abuse, but just normal couple stuff.
You need someone who is experienced in abuse.

Having said that, they may have used a stalling tactic, in suggesting individual counselling first and only couple later.

Lweji · 08/02/2015 17:37

It's also hard to cope due to my mental health problems/depression.

Have you considered that your problems are caused/made worse by him?

Just thinking of him going again to your home must make you desperate.

Try a lengthy period without any contact with him and see how you feel. Get out, talk to people, enroll in voluntary activities (a friend, for example, visited elderly people).
I bet you will feel better.

Higheredserf · 08/02/2015 17:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BitterAndOnlySlightlyTwisted · 08/02/2015 17:42

Not all counsellors are adept at spotting or dealing with relationships where there is abuse. Some women have suffered terribly as a result. By all means accept the individual counselling.

As to the arsehole you are unfortunately married to: you have separated, you are living apart. He gets to collect your children and entertain them elsewhere on his own. He does not get to cross the bloody threshold and sleep in your damned bed! All of this is causing extremely fuzzy boundaries for all of you, most especially your poor children.

Abusers are often deluded. Their template on how adult, loving, equal relationships work is faulty or non-existent. So telling them they abusive, most especially from the lips of the one they are abusing will fall on deaf ears. Because he doesn't respect you and won't respect anything that you think, feel or say. This man is not your loving life-partner: he is YOUR ENEMY. Never forget that.

I have a feeling that once you have extricated yourself from this hell of a marriage, your mental health will magically improve.

Lweji · 08/02/2015 17:42

And if you do have a diagnosis, was it before or after you were with him?

My ex could make me a screaming banshee. I am not normally like that, I assure you.

26Point2Miles · 08/02/2015 17:43

Is the house jointly owned? Rented?

Depends now on how he plays it..... He's got school runs/childcare and day to day stuff to organise on his own. How do you think he will cope?

Not the best move to leave.... Depends on him now, he could claim you left and refuse to have you back etc

26Point2Miles · 08/02/2015 17:43

So you say you are BOTH abusive?

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 17:55

I had post natal depression years ago, before being with him. I have since been diagnosed with depression since being with him, but I think a lot of it stems from issues/abuse during my childhood.

The house is an army house. I won't be able to stay in it once he declared himself single. He hasn't done this yet, although he's living in single accommodation. The army welfare service are involved. I am cautious of giving too much info in case it outs me tbh.

He tells me I am abusive. I have damaged things in the past, usually my own things. I do think this is abusive. It hasn't happened in past relationships, but surely it can't be his fault, in the way his abuse of me can't be my fault?

I feel like I can't even think clearly any more.

OP posts:
Lweji · 08/02/2015 18:01

Regardless, it's an unhealthy relationship and it would be better for ALL for you to separate.
WA and CAB could help you find accommodation.
If nothing else traps you there, move in closer to your family. It makes a difference.

But damaging your own things sounds more like self-harm than abuse, unless you throw them at him.

26Point2Miles · 08/02/2015 18:02

This was a similar situation to mine

SSAFA housed/helped us. Please use them, they are amazing

You can choose where in the UK you want to get rehoused, in the meantime there are units ( 2 in the country) you can live at which are excellAnt

Women's section at RBL can help with costs and furniture. Your DH regiment can also provide help

26Point2Miles · 08/02/2015 18:03

Google saafa stepping stone homes and also the Cotswold centre

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 18:42

Thankyou. I think you're right that the damaging of my things is a sort of self harm. I have self harmed in the past and I do this instead. Maybe this is why the counsellor is still insistent on individual counselling? After she saw my husband for his individual assessment appointment she had said she may just go straight to couples counselling, but after mine said individual at first. Perhaps this is why?

26point2miles. Thankyou. I had no idea homes like that were available. That might actually be a huge help.

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AttilaTheMeerkat · 08/02/2015 19:03

"The counsellors know about the abuse and we have had additional (separate) assessment appointments to address this and will start counselling individually at first with a view to couples counselling after that. Is that still not a good idea?".

No it is not a good idea at all and this is why:-
To use mediation is to subscribe to the mistaken idea that abuse is related to "misunderstandings" or lack of communication. If discussion and compromise, the mainstay of mediation, could help in any way most domestic violence situations would be long ago resolved because victims of abuse "discuss and compromise" constantly. Mediation assumes both parties will cooperate to make agreements work; the victim has always 'cooperated' with the abuser; the abuser never cooperates.

Your H will never co-operate and will use mediation as a further stick to beat you up with.

Mediation can be and is ordered by judges/courts, as can counselling and mental health evaluations. They are tools in the abuser's arsenal to be used against the victim as often as he chooses. In order for mediation to work and to not make situations worse the parties involved must have equal power and must share some common vision of resolution. This is clearly not present when domestic violence has taken place in a relationship.

Mediation practitioners must be alert to the need to interview partners separately with specially designed questions in order to determine if abuse is or has been present. Many domestic violence professionals can train others to screen safely for domestic violence. To not do so risks unsuccessful mediations, at best, and increasing the victim's danger by colluding with the abuser, at worst.

A person who has been terrorized by an abuser is not free to participate in a mediation process with him, even if the mediator(s) assume or believe that they "understand". Being truthful about any of her needs or experiences in the abuser's presence or proximity practically ensures that she is in more danger later.

The mediator is left with a no win: either the victim's danger is increased, or she is not fully or truthfully participating, or both. The well meaning mediator may actually encourage the victim to feel safe enough to share information that could seriously compromise her safety. In any case the whole intent of mediation is lost.

To engage an abuser and a victim in a process that implies equal responsibility is damaging to both. The victim is once again made to feel responsible for the abuser's behavior, and the abuser is allowed to continue to not accept full responsibility for his behaviour choices.

Joint counselling is never recommended where there is any type of abuse within the relationship. He will simply use that to manipulate the mediator (he has certainly done a right number on you and I do think he has made any underlying problems you may have that stem from your own past far, far worse. I think he targeted you actually).

Individual counselling solely for you is however, an excellent idea.

He should no longer come and visit you at your residence, he is basically marking his territory by doing that. You are also compounding that error here by further sleeping with him. That also needs to stop, you are really sleeping with the enemy.

WA and SSAFA are certainly worth contacting now and they can both help you get away from your abusive H. It will do your children no favours at all to be brought up seeing their dad abuse you as their mother; they could well go onto be abusers or abused themselves. That is certainly no legacy to leave your children.

Better to be alone as well than to be badly accompanied. You and he need to be apart before he completely destroys you and drags your children down with him.

Needmentalhealthhelp · 08/02/2015 19:34

Thankyou. It's true, I am a mess. I used to be confident and outgoing and I have no confidence left. I feel like I have nothing.

It's hard to believe he has done this deliberately, but I can see what you are saying makes sense. It's made worse by the fact his family facilitate his behaviour and blame of me. There were a couple of instances of violence years ago, they haven't been repeats since. It was a particularly stressful time, but obviously that doesn't excuse it. I've often felt like he hasn't been violent since as he knows I will tell people. I am aware though that the ignoring is another form of abuse, but he blames me for this. I drive him to it apparently. The thing is, I almost believe him, so I'm sure others will.

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