Suddenly feeling jealous about affair, eight years on

[MrsPorter]

DH had an affair in 2006 - chatting over FB, then hotel rooms with her when he told me he was at his hobby.

He told me in early 2007, after the fact, but in order to get in before OW's H contacted me.

I was ok with the sexual side of their relationship, as weird as that sounds, but felt very betrayed about the emotional side. However, we did not split up and have since had DC together. I believe very strongly that he was horrified by his behaviour and does not want to risk losing what he has, particularly now DC are part of what he'd lose.

Tonight we were talking vaguely about V Day which is when we got engaged in 2003. I said something like ooh I've been wearing this [engagement] ring for twelve years, and he said something like "you've had me for longer than that".

And suddenly it hit me like a ton of bricks that although I can say I have slept with nobody but him for those twelve years, he can only claim the last eight.

I have PTSD from a previous abusive relationship and issues related. This week I've been dealing with flashbacks and low-level panic attacks. The PTSD has manifested as psychosis since I was pg with our youngest, now a toddler, and is approximately under control but simmering away unhelpfully.

I don't want to break up. I don't even really want to talk to him about it. I want to know why after eight fucking years the sex suddenly matters.

I'm going to sleep now (I hope) but needed to get this down.

Oh gosh, I'm so sorry.

Please don't feel like your feelings aren't valid - it doesn't matter how many years down the line it is, if you don't feel okay about it then you're perfectly allowed to feel not okay about it.

How did you deal with it at the time? Did you have counselling related to it, did you have a break for a while, or did you try to patch things up and carry on as normal?

I think it would be worth talking to him about it - if you're feeling upset then it is really his responsibility to try to make things better, no matter how many years ago it was.

Are you having treatment for your other issues? How is that going? I hope I'm not being nosey, I'm just curious if these feelings resurfacing could be as a result of something else too.

A big hug for you, I know that words aren't really enough but I really felt for you when I read your post.

Thanks for your reply.

Other issues are essentially on the waiting list.

But I'm struck by your comment that it's his responsibility to make it better. Interesting and compelling.

This is why its important that affairs are dealt with properly at the time - sweeping things under the carpet often means it comes back to bite you on the bum.

I agree that its his mess and therefore his responsibility to help you recover - no matter how long ago it was.

I may get shot down for this.

Firstly please be aware that PTSD and PN psychosis are not easy! They set your whole body onto alert mode and can make reasoning and rationality almost impossible at times. The panic attacks etc are your body's way if basically misfiring. It's on high alert constantly because it feels at risk.

The smallest (this is not small) of things can upset the balance and trying to regain that balance is hardwork and can take a long time.

Add to all of this the realisation that actually your dh has been emotionally and physically connected to another woman is incredibly hard to bare and manage.

I wonder how much of this is your feeling vulnerable and therefore your coping mechanisms aren't working so well or how much is actual realisation of the full impact of what he did.

I'm not making excuses but 8 years on is a long long time and it sounds like your both very different people. Has it made your relationship stronger etc. How did you used to manage it. Surely it's come up before for you simply in books and films with similar story lines.

There's a lot to consider.

I think you may be experiencing the result of repressing your feelings at the time of the affair. You said it sounded strange that you didn't so much mind the sexual aspect and I think you're right. At the time you may have had reasons for dismissing it as 'only sex' .... perhaps you didnt set much importance on intimacy..... and your opinion has since changed.

I'm very clear, and have always been, that the betrayal centred on the cosy chats about me.

DH told me about the sex and although I was annoyed I was also kind of relieved. I was under the ED unit and the psychosexual health unit at the time so had zero libido. If OW was satisfying his needs/wants then it took the pressure off me.

(Since The Bad Man I have learned not to link sex with love. It's convenient to love the person you're shagging, and vice versa, but it isn't a given in either direction. Similarly, absence of one doesn't prove absence of the other.)

But when OW's H contacted me he told me things about myself I thought only DH and I knew. And I hit the fucking roof. My reaction properly scared him. That's dealt with and over.

I am surprised by my ... I don't know, sulkiness? resentment? on the sex thing. I don't think it's even the sex per se but rather the fact that he can't split sex from emotional intimacy.

I do worry that he'll do it again - by which I mean he will tell someone my secrets. I feel pressured to have as much sex as he wants in case he looks for it elsewhere and shares secrets again.

To put that in context, that's a once-a-month worry, by comparison with the hourly "my children are dying" worry, twice-daily "DH has been flattened on the motorway" worry and thrice-daily "I might trip on the landing and drop/push the toddler down the stairs" worry. I run at 80% adrenaline potential 99% of the time.

Tell us what did your H do to help you recover? What is he doing now to help gain your trust and make you feel secure?

I can imagine how betrayed you must feel that he shared personal things about you. It sounds like you do not trust him anymore. I wonder if all this is causing you to feel insecure and vulnerable and therefore anxious and paranoid?

The fact that you feel obliged to have all the sex he wants isn't helping your feelings. You do not feel secure enough to tell him that you don't feel up to it.

I don't quite remember what he did at the time, except accepting every condition I put on anything (eg if he went to do it had to be with a particular friend who knew about it, so I could ring friend to speak to DH if I felt he might be using it as cover again). There was a death in my family shortly afterwards which interrupted the process and changed my views on life generally. We started TTC which wouldn't be recommended under the circumstances but which I absolutely do not regret.

I do not regret staying with him, and I can't think of anything else I would have wanted him to do. I did threatent to make him tell his mother

It doesn't come up for me often, to address an earlier question. I can go weeks or months without even remembering, if our respective libidos are equal.

I feel able to say no to a particular instance of sex. The pressure I feel isssbout the general frequency and leaves me struggling to understand whether or not I am keen. Sometimes I think I say no to test that he will stop, which he obviously does, being not a rapist. I feel bad that I test him.

Interesting that you mention an ED. Often a form of self punishment or self harm. If 'the bad man' means you suffered abuse and your response included punishing your body then, on any level, have you kept your cheating husband close as another form of self rebuke? Even though you are most angry about him betraying your confidence, at the same time you seem to blame yourself for not being sexually available.

Do you think you sold yourself short?

The EDs predate the marriage by at least five years, but I recognise your comments about self-punishment.

Technically I didn't choose to stay with a "cheating husband" but a "husband who had previously cheated". I don't see that infidelity should necessarily spell the end of a marriage.

However, in the spirit of the question, I don't know what I think about whether I punished myself by not leaving him. I've punished myself for many things inc mc but I don't recognise the idea of punishing myself for that.

I'm not saying it should have been the end of marriage. However the rationale you applied at the time has to be examined.... whatever it was... because it no longer appears to be quite as satisfactory as it was initially. Several years on you are bound to be a slightly different person with a slightly different perspective. If, for example, the self-blame was a factor in your original decision you may now not feel the same way.

Also... hurt lasts. You can forgive it rationally but it's tough to forget. Even if you don't want to hold a grudge, it's going to float into your mind occasionally. If the same person annoys you there's always that feeling that they are not grateful for their second chance.

I empathise OP - I wouldn't be able to forget (and therefore to forgive), even after that much time.

MrsPorter - your last post isn't namechanged just FYI!

You are only human, and you are right, you can't trust him, he's proved to you that he can't be.

You seem quite ok about the sex side, to me, sex and emotions are the same, i.e., it's a form of some kind of relationship, for me, that would be the end of my marriage if my partner cheated on me.

Perhaps it's a delayed reaction, your feelings are perfectly valid, he's lucky you are sticking with him.

Thanks, elephants - have reported to MNHQ and hope they get to it soon.

That's all I fucking need: my usual name is comprehensively outed already, hence the nc.

Hi MrsP,
we have completely 'disappeared' that post and name, for reasons that will be obvious to anyone who saw them... fingers crossed it wasn't too many folk.

Thanks, Helen, although, out of interest, can you not just nc posts any more?

Only it took aaaaaages to type (hence nc cockup) and contained pertinent information. And I didn't even know you could remove posts, as opposed to emptying them.

[ungrateful]

again.

For those who didn't see it ... I talked with him for a long time last night. Am reassured on some technical details and that a repeat is vanishingly unlikely, but now libido has flattened to zero.

And I feel very, very lonely.

Sometimes an unexpected trigger opens up old wounds because our subconscious has been niggling away at us. You've had eight settled years with DCs and no repeat infidelity and I was all set to say I don't think a hiccup necessarily means you have unfinished business until I read the part where you say,

I do worry that he'll do it again - by which I mean he will tell someone my secrets. I feel pressured to have as much sex as he wants in case he looks for it elsewhere and shares secrets again.

Feeling pressured to have sex is wrong, wrong, wrong, whatever the reason.

To put that in context, that's a once-a-month worry, by comparison with the hourly "my children are dying" worry, twice-daily "DH has been flattened on the motorway" worry and thrice-daily "I might trip on the landing and drop/push the toddler down the stairs" worry. I run at 80% adrenaline potential 99% of the time.

The second paragraph sounds exhausting, a mix of catastrophising and normal worries. Coupled with the flasbacks and panic attacks it doesn't seem at all surprising this elephant in the room would re-appear.

I don't know why I posted really - he had just come back from a work trip overseas (I don't doubt this, btw) and I lost interest partway through and he fell asleep afterwards and I was lying there in the dark all lonely and confused.

I don't feel any better. You've all given me a window on to my soul and although it has been useful and enlightening it has not been nice.

Given what you said earlier about feeling pressurised into sex in case he goes elsewhere again, do you feel anxious that because you're not interested it's only a matter of time? Or do you feel nothing?

There's a phenomenon known as 'hysterical bonding' which some people - the injured party usually - experience post an affair. It's a kind of desperate attempt to shore things up by literally clinging to someone physically as a response to infidelity. It's normally short lived and it says a lot about someone's self-image and self-esteem. Now eight years would be a long time to hysterically bond - especially as you say that you can totally separate love from sex - but that empty feeling you're describing is pretty typical of how it feels afterwards. As would the idea of 'testing' someone's affection by withholding sex.

Have you really separated the two?

I do worry that he'll do it again - by which I mean he will tell someone my secrets. I feel pressured to have as much sex as he wants in case he looks for it elsewhere and shares secrets again.

So sad to read this - we don't stay with people out of sex, we stay with them out of love and respect, your ideas of how to hang on to a cheat are completely skewed.

You can't trust him to keep his dick in its place, nor can you trust him to keep any of your secrets, private conversations, really, is he worth the stress?

You stopped physical intimacy last night and DH respected that and after he started snoring you felt that old sting of abandonment and rejection.

It sounds a bit lame but do you keep a private journal or diary, does writing stuff down and seeing it help untangle thoughts?

I don't how you dealt with being upset when you were growing up? Sometimes children become almost ashamed to cry in front of people because their parents or peers ridicule them for being soft or overly emotional. They grow up unable to process being hurt without feeling somehow ashamed. They develop a horror of being judged in case they're found wanting in some regard. Later if they are lucky they find someone they trust who's supportive and realise it's not about losing control or being weak or dwelling on something for no reason other than to be vengeful if they work through it rather than hide or suppress it.

I suppose I am trying to say what was said more concisely upthread, your feelings are valid, you matter. If you want to sort this out you should be able to talk to your DH, maybe see about talking to a counsellor.

Pretty sure, yes. My first experience of sex was rape, I've since had chaste relationships and ONSs, then DH.

We've had droughts since 2006, mainly because I've been pg, bf or both without a break since summer 2007. He used to cope very badly but got better as he's learned not to take it personally.

I think at the heart I believe a man is entitled to have sex with his wife, and is entitled to tell her what to do. She can say no on a particular occasion and he should respect that, but she can't expect to keep him if she does that all the time.

That's a very un-MN position but it's what the Bad Man taught me and I see evidence of it all around. Thread upon thread in Relationships concluding that you don't have to and probably shouldn't stay with a partner who doesn't meet your sexual needs.

I think at the heart I believe a man is entitled to have sex with his wife, and is entitled to tell her what to do

Oh dear, this gets worse, no he is actually not entitled to FA - tell her what to do, really?

Sex is a two way street, it's no fun if the other person isn't as willing or as excited, you sound like a woman from the 1950s who has been brainwashed into thinking that men are far superior than women and we are here to serve them, shocked.com

He's coping, that's big of him isn't it, he sounds about 12!

Crossed posts, was replying to Cog.

Jan do you think you're helping? I find your posts very angry and I can't help thinking you're angry at me. I don't think I deserve that. If you think I'm beyond help, maybe this isn't the thread for you. I appreciate your taking the time to post but I don't know what you want from me.

Donkeys you've described me well. My family didn't do verbal or physical conflict. I don't know how to argue. The merest hint of a row shuts me down. I don't give in, necessarily, but I don't engage.

Family is very highly achieving, academically. Aristocrstoc heritage. No failure, ever. No dirty linen in public, ever.