to think there is never an excuse for violence no matter how much somebody is "provoked"

[PuddinClub]

Without going into full detail I am having a very bad time with my father in law and how he speaks to my DS2. It´s hard to explain like this but every time we visit (usually once a month) there are comments about my son´s lack of ability at school, how he doesn´t speak clearly enough, how he acts like a baby, how he doesn´t eat enough amongst others. DS2 is 5 by the way. FIL has an obvious preference for DS1 and makes this very clear when we visit.

I realise this might not sound like such a big deal, but it is every single time we go there and the older DS2 gets the more it will start to affect him.

Such constant negative comments over the years have become too much for me to take and I have had countless arguments with DH who refuses to challenge his father as he will "take it badly". In fact all of DH´s family have this attitide, they creep around him, say best leave it be, don´t create bad feeling etc. Well, I have had a gut full and last visit you could have cut the atmosphere with a knife.

Anyway, today I was about 20mins from wanting to serve lunch. DH has just bought a webcam and was testing it out with his father supposedly so that the children could chat to him on Christmas day. I politely asked DH to leave it as I wanted to set the table and serve dinner. He was sitting at the dining table. DH took no notice and carried on with his "chat".

At this point I admit I saw red and said in a loud voice that I couldn´t understand all the sudden fuss in order to speak to "nasty man" and that the children weren´t even bothered as they were too busy playing with their toys.

At this point DH blew up and hit me twice on the arm and pushed me into the door.

Please don´t think I am being weak when I say he is not an agressive man, he absolutely isn´t but his reaction today has left me devastated. I don´t see how there can be any going back from this.

He came to apologise about 5 minutes later saying it was hurtful for him, as it´s his Dad and the Childrens´ grandfather. He was genuinely sorry.

Today has been awful and I am sitting here crying now. I feel so alone and I don´t know what to do. I don´t even live in the UK and have nobody to talk to.

Agree with AskBasil4StuffingRecipe when they say Please don't focus on your rudeness, it really isn't the issue here.

Domestic violence is NEVER acceptable
What you said about his FIL is irrelevant.
You are not safe. Your DCs are not safe.

What your h did is a criminal act, in the UK and many other countries. It may well be the first time, etc, but it indicates a mindset.

I have known a man go from a 'shove' to the very next time, throwing a glass so hard it dented a door and a paint scraper so hard that it embedded itself in the door frame, inches from his dws head, who was holding their year old child in her arms.

When people say to leave, that this is serious and it will happen again, they are spot on. It may seem like a massive leap in your mind but things can and as described above, do inevitably escalate rapidly and dangerously. Apologies from abusive men are truly empty words.

Please call a domestic violence helpline for a chat (in the UK I'd recommend women's aid). They really are best placed to support you through this safely.

I have known a man go from a 'shove' to the very next time, throwing a glass so hard it dented a door and a paint scraper so hard that it embedded itself in the door frame, inches from his dws head, who was holding their year old child in her arms.

When people say to leave, that this is serious and it will happen again, they are spot on. It may seem like a massive leap in your mind but things can and as described above, do inevitably escalate rapidly and dangerously. Apologies from abusive men are truly empty words.

Please call a domestic violence helpline for a chat (in the UK I'd recommend women's aid). They really are best placed to support you through this safely.

You were not to blame for this. Your DS needs protecting from this negative influence. Your H's reaction was entirely violent and criminal and as someone else said he hasn't apologised, he has blamed you.

If you can share what country you're in, people may be able to link you to national support.

The grandfather is a bully, I hope you can see that. Stop taking him to a place where he is regularly bullied.

The bullying has taken it toll on you, which is why you snapped. Perfectly understandable.

You need to put some distance in between your FIL & your son.

Thanks again for all the opinions and to those of you who have wished me well.

I have asked to have the thread moved to Relationships.

I am in an EU country, and as far as I am aware they take domestic violence seriously.

I am very aware that the grandfather is a bully and I feel like an accomplice having to sit there while he says what he likes to my little boy. It´s hard to be the "outsider" that stands up to him. I was only talking to sister in law about her father´s behaviour 2 days ago and her attitude was the same: ignore...she also pointed out that I am not his daughter so he would 1. take no notice of me whatsoever and 2. cast me aside. Not that that would bother me in the slightest.

Have you asked DH why he reacts like that when someone criticises his father, but has totally the opposite reaction when someone criticises you or DS?

He has done it once now, leave before it happens again. I know you think it won't, but it will. It will probably be your fault, this time and the next, for being so bloody rude, not doing what you should have etc etc etc
I probably sound harsh but my ex was cute and cuddly for 7 years until the first time he hit me, it wasn't hard and was only on my leg. I stayed, believing it was a one off. It wasn't, didn't just happen teice, or three times.. Until 2 years later and I almost died. Wish I had left after the first time

I have been there and my sincere advice is that you report it.
You don't want these people to have a serious influence on your boy's life.

I'm sure there will be a local domestic violence support agency (I am in Portugal and there is a main one that provides support including legal). Talk to them first if you don't want to involve police now.
But beware that even if you were to separate now, I suspect the police will be involved at some point. Might as well go now.
And if you don't separate, again, you will be walking on eggshells and keeping quiet because of what you will be risking.

For what is worth, I called the police on my now exH for a somewhat similar assault (the second within a month, despite his apologies).

How are things with him?

My dh is a bit like your dh...his father is rather over exuberant while playing with the girls & while he is never inappropriate, he does hold onto them & has hurt them. He did this once & dd screamed out, he yelled at her to stop yelling, so I told him that he can't tell her off for yelling when he caused it by hurting her.

He hasn't done it since. It can be done op. You have to stand up for your child, or no one will.

He never listened to anyone else either, because they constantly let it go & ignored it, yet I was firm & made my point clear.

I'm not sure it's useful to distract the OP from the violent assault she suffered at the hands of her supposedly loving partner.

Is that to me, Lweji Because it certainly isn't my intention to do that.

I think lots of people have commented on the fact that her dh was violent with her, I wanted to point our that her son is being bullied too. I didn't mean to purposefully distract her.

To many people.

Yes, this man bullies many people around him, including his son and grandson. His son is not a child. He can choose what to do. And he is choosing not to stand up to his father. And he chose to assault his wife.

The best way to protect the children is to stand up to these bullies. All of them, to stop them and report them, so that they won't have a bad influence in their children's lives.
Starting with their father, your husband, I'm afraid. :(

Because he fails to protect them from bullies AND because he assaults his family.

You know the answer to this. It's never just one punch, once they have done it once and been forgiven for it.

Look at your FIL. Look at your husband. Look at how your husband enables your FIL's behaviour. Is that really what you want to spend the rest of your life with?

Fair enough.

Could you tell us which country you are living in OP? It would be helpful in terms of finding out what kind of support is available.

his father is a bully and he is a bully. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree. I think that hitting you was unacceptable. Yes, what you said was harsh - but not unfair or untrue! Why the hell should people behave in horrible ways and never have to hear how their victims feel about that?

He has ensured that his father is protected from the consequences of his bullying behaviour for years, and now he is copying it by hitting you into submission.

People say things I don't like all the time. I don't hit them.

Hope you do report. What did your FIL do when your husband hit you and throw you to the floor? Did he not intervene?

Yup, vitalstollenfix has it. Sounds like grandfather is on the coercive control / emotional abuse spectrum somewhere, brought his son your dh up that way, and unless those issues are acknowledged, to start with and then addressed your dh will increasingly go the same way.

It may be true that he 'is not normally aggressive' but the anger is in there and it will boil out when it snaps.

You can try proposing counselling but if your dh isn't keen or insists that there is no problem then imo you will have to leave eventually. Sorry but as a child survivor of this sort of environment your kids won't thank you if you don't.

In case you haven't seen it... www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2155666-Support-thread-for-those-in-Emotionally-Abusive-Relationships-30

(Sadly) you're not alone. Lots of links on that thread.

Even counselling should be away from the family, because he is not safe to live with.

YANBU. I would ask him why it isn't hurtful to see his father bullying his grandson. A bully has raised a bully sadly. What you said was out of line, you snapped because your husband was annoying you and it was an unnecessary comment but we've all been there- who hasn't said something hurtful?

Saying something hurtful and actually lashing out in response and hurting not once but twice, I don't know if there is any going back from. Even taking out your relationship and the shattering of trust, you will never feel able to say anything negative against his father- even if it's simply telling him to leave your DS alone.

If your husband wont stand up for his children and turns on his wife then it sounds like he could well go the same way as his father.

Do you want to still be with this man? Not just do you love him or for the kids but would you trust him? Do you think he'll never do this again? Would he be willing to go and see RELATE with you if you wanted to make it work? Would he ever stand up for you and the kids?

How is he reacting now as well, is he trying to blame you? Make it all your fault? Minimising? All those actions show he has a lot of potential to become his father.

It's meant well, but this is not for Relate, nor any form of joint counselling.
A good counsellor will advise that the violent partner leaves.
Joint counselling is supposed to se a safe place, but when a partner has been violent, it can't be safe.
If anything HE should have counselling to address his violent response. Away from his victim.
But, ultimately he chose his response. He felt entitled to do it. Perhaps because be was in front of his dad via skype? But his choice nonetheless, and later blamed the victim as well.