DH objects to me lending a car to a male friend

[WotchOotErAPolis]

DH & I have a close male friend [lets use the acronym MF] who spends quite a bit of time with us, both together and separately. We are both very fond of him, he's a very nice single [Christian - though I'm not sure why that should matter] guy. He has done us lots of favours over the last few years whilst my DH has been oow, including helping with car breakdowns, giving us discounts on music lessons, fixing bikes and training my YS as a sprinter [quite successfully]. We've known him for 3 years and whilst I used to find him attractive, the relationship is and always has been platonic. Now, whilst I still like him of course, we are more like brother and sister.

He's the kids' [3 sons aged 17,15,12] music teacher and is now as much of a mentor and male role model for them as anything else. I find him very easy to talk to and he seems quite tuned in to female psyche as well as being a bit of a lad when he's out with DH. He often stays for a cuppa and a chat - again with all of us as a family, as well as with DH or me on our own.

Last night, DH was away overnight on business, and MF came over for his regular music lesson with the boys. His car has been on its last legs for weeks now and was making the most awful [and ££ sounding] noise when he arrived. He wasn't even sure he'd get it home. I offered him the loan of one of our two cars [DH went away by train, and I usually cycle into work locally so I don't use my car anyway during the week]. I phoned DH to tell him what I'd done and this did not go down well with DH who felt I'd done MF too many favours recently [he is down to his last penny cent so I hosted the last music workshop he ran - the fact that the only attendees this time round all live within 100 yards of each other and are friends of mine anyway meant that logically it made sense just to host it at mine rather than hire a venue].

Why is it that having done what I thought was actually quite logical, DH has kicked off about not doing him any favours [overlooking the many favours MF has done for us over the years] as he might take advantage and hang on to the car longer than he needs to, or hold his next music event at our house, etc etc. We weren't using the cars anyway!

I think DH thinks I'm having an affair with MF and just doesn't trust me at all. I have given him no cause to suspect I would have an affair as I behave the same with MF when DH is around as I do when I am on my own with MF.

My relationship with MF is closer than some I guess, [I am not a great socialiser and have a very short list of friends] but is the same as e.g. my closest girlfriend, but I wouldn't share intimacies with MF, where I would with my GF. Last night we were chatting about different types of cheeses, FFS and whether or not kids should tuck their shirts in at school!

How do I get DH off my back and reassure him that I'm not up to anything, but just lending him a car for a day or two. He has commitments he must stick to or he will lose even more ££.

Is the fact that he's a bloke the 'elephant in the room' and has anyone else got a close MF that their DH doesn't take issue with?

The car is a red herring. My friend (female) offered to lend me her car for one week when she heard I'd be stuck without one having to entertain my son (with special needs) during a half term. It was really nice of her but there is no way I would accept, I couldn't deal with the responsibility if something happened to the car.
In your case I think your dh is feeling threatened by this friend. You need to back off a little.

OP, are you coming back to this thread or not? Very rude to ask for advice and just fuck off.

Your post reads like you have 2 husbands! He's pretty involved with your family isn't he, after just 3 years? music lessons, fixing bikes, training your YS as a sprinter, and he is your DCs role model/mentor, and you hosted his music workshop? + he gets to drive your car now?

Tt sounds like you have heavily involved him in your lives and you need him around very much. You've said you were attracted to him in the past and maybe thats somehow apparent to your DH. In his shoes I wouldn't put up with all this. Would you like it if he involved a female friend this heavily in your lives and relationship? How is your DH supposed to feel that this man is such a feature in your DCs lives? they're his children too after all he could very well be feeling pushed out.

Does this man have a girlfriend/has he had other girlfriends in the 3 years you've known him? or is he busy just hanging around you? Tbh the car is the least of your issues I think, you and your MF need to wind your necks in a bit and sort out your boundaries sooner rather than later. If you want your relationship with DH to be good, that is. Maybe its this MF you'd prefer to deal with in which case, its probably best to come clean and take steps towards that.

*prefer to be with

Lending someone a car is a big deal. You said in your OP you "rang to tell him what you'd done" which isn't the same as "asking DH before confirming with MF". Frankly it sounds like you did the former under the guise of the latter. If you'd had any intention of genuinely asking DH's opinion on the matter then you wouldn't have lent MF the car when it was clear DH wasn't happy with it. It's common courtesy. Is there any reason you couldn't have just dropped him off at home?

Does your DH work away a lot?

Can I pick up on the point that he is described by you as 'Christian'?

A family member is closely involved in an evangelical church and I have noticed the pattern of very intense, friendships with lots of quite intimate 'helping out' from people whom they have only just met. Normal boundaries get crossed very quickly - round each other's houses all the time, providing childcare, giving faith-based counselling on quite private matters... Yet when my family members had a faith-related disagreement and moved to a new branch of the church, all those 'friends' disappeared overnight. I don't know if you are Christian too, but the intensity of this friendship (particularly his involvement in your family life) rings a bell.

Likewise, the church believes in the 'prosperity gospel' eg. God will provide anything you need and riches will flow to you if you believe... However, rather than showers of gold, this takes the form of a perpetual series of 'hand-me-downs' from and to other people who are involved in the church - there is something of an obligation to share or pass on anything that you might have, likewise an obligation to accept anything that might be offered as it is a proof of God providing. Need a venue for music? Well, God has provided in the form of a friend's house. Car on the blink? God is working again as a friend has loaned you another. All lovely, but I also notice that it comes with with a form of wilful blindness to social norms of what might be appropriate (aka a sort of 'blissful grabbiness'), which your DH has clearly identified.

Think carefully about the path you are treading.

By the time he's paid for insurance, he would be as well hiring a car with it included.

MF is way too involved in your lives. He's your friend, he's your children's music teacher, he's your son's sport coach, he's your DH's mate, he is your confidante - is there any role this man doesn't fill? Maybe its the final straw for your DH? Its nothing to do with him being male as I would find a female friend who encroached on family privacy this much really annoying too.

Is this car thing not an excuse for him to get even more involved in your lives? Do you ever wonder about his motives? What does his own wife or gf say? Where was he until 3 years ago?

Its just when you said sprint coach...hmmn...

And tbh if he is having to borrow cars from people and not in a position to hire them, what kind of role model is he? Maybe not a very successful one who is overly involved in your family?

Re the insurance. If your MF would be using the car for travelling to music lessons, then, if you don't have business use for the insurance he will be uninsured.

Generally, if you have fully comp insurance, then if you drive someone else's car when you are driving their car, you only have the legal minimum ie third party.

If you insurance allows say, anyone over 30 to drive, and he fits this category then he's fully comp, but bear in mind the business use. Normally, unless requested otherwise, use is just "social, domestice and pleasure" ie driving to and from work, and doesn't cover using your car for your employer's business where you get mileage expenses - for that you need business use.

Probably is time to back off a bit with MF, esp as DH is away on business a lot. DH is an incredibly jealous type anyway, even when he is around.

I genuinely feel I have given no cause [despite mumsnet posters' very balanced comments "THANK YOU!" and taking those on board] to be so distrusted as DH spends a ridiculous amount of time with MF too and they get along really well, despite everything.

The answer to the 'fixing bikes, etc' issue, when DH ought to be doing it, stems from earlier in the year [July] when I had serious surgery and DH was no use at all. I wrote a list of things I needed/wanted him to do [regardless of whether he thought they were worth doing, they are things I would usually do, but couldn't, such as heavy gardening duties, fixing the leaky boiler, checking out the overflow, etc].

MF offered to do them for me, as DH simply didn't do them, despite reminders [in fact I gave up reminding him and simply wrote them on a whiteboard in the kitchen, along with the list that my 3 sons all had too. Whilst my sons stepped up and got on with their lists, DH didn't [and still doesn't / hasn't]. I only said yes to MF doing them for me when it became clear after several weeks that DH wasn't ever going to do them, and after MF got exasperated with DH. MF spoke to DH too about his not doing stuff for his DW, but DH just seemed to agree with MF and then resorted to ignoring everything.

All that said, I am going to continue with my friendship with MF as there is honestly nothing 'going on' [since this is Mumsnet and anonymous, I'd tell you guys if there was!] and no inkling of anything 'going on'. Maybe part of it is that at 51, this is the first time I've ever let anyone of the opposite gender get anywhere close to me. It takes a bit of getting used to and that goes for DH too.

"I only said yes to MF doing them for me when it became clear after several weeks that DH wasn't ever going to do them, and after MF got exasperated with DH. MF spoke to DH too about his not doing stuff for his DW, but DH just seemed to agree with MF and then resorted to ignoring everything."

I'm sure that your DH not doing his bit was frustrating and annoying for you. But are you absolutely sure it was MF's place to feel "exasperated" and to speak to your DH about the matter? All sounds a bit "three people in this marriage".

Agree with NoRay. Your DH should have been helping, but it's an issue that needed to be dealt with by the people in the marriage - you and him. Not MF.

It was probably him overstepping the line there that made your DH realise what a strange relationship you have with him. He is almost your back-up husband. If your actual DH isn't around, or isn't doing what you want him too, you use MF instead.

That is more than enough cause for your DH to be feeling pushed out and manipulated, let alone jealous. If he's already a naturally jealous person, it's a recipe for disaster.

You don't seem to care that much, either. You will continue the relationship because you don't think that there is anything wrong with it. The thing that is wrong with it is that it upsets your DH, for good reason.

It may well be related to MF being the first male friend that you've had, because you appear to have some very strange boundaries with him.

Although I do still want to be friends with MF, I think the overall feeling from your posts here is that I am allowing MF to get a bit too close for DHs comfort. I have had quite a strained relationship with DH as he is very manipulative, controlling and has never felt comfortable with me talking or spending time with anyone outside the family[female friends included], so this means that my friendship with MF makes him feel extra uncomfortable.

I have almost packed his bags many times over the last couple of years recently, but nothing much has changed. That said, the issues we have are between, and should be dealt with by, the two of us. We do have an evening together this week where we have booked in to a hotel to stay after a party. I don't want to use this as the time to talk to him, but maybe I'll discuss it at the weekend? However, I've said it before - that I'll speak to hi and we'll get our marriage sorted - but maybe this time he'll listen and we can actually do something about it?

I'm going to close down [or whatever you do with it!] this thread now and thank you all again for your balanced and objective [if at times painful] views on the situation. I really appreciate it.

Is the MF married? There was a thread a while back from a woman whose husband was a music teacher, went over to fix the kid's bikes, etc. She was very upset because of her husband's inappropriate friendship. If you are the woman he was overly involved with, I think you should back off.

That's why I already asked OP if he was married sonja, the similarities are amazing. So much so that I even wondered if it were the married man's wife posting a reverse thread.

OP I think you need to back off from MF and concentrate on your own marriage and the obvious problems within it. It sounds like your dh doesn't listen to you or respect your feelings and, equally, you don't listen to him or respect his.

sonjadog I remember that thread too, Im sure it was a few months back it was quite a long thread. I agree with what you've said about "back off"

OP if your DH is "very manipulative and controlling" Im surprised that you were somehow able to install a MF into your personal and family life under his nose so to speak, and for it to be ongoing? the 2 somehow don't correlate..but whatever the ins & outs of it this its an unhealthy situation.

MF is single if I saw correctly, I agree the similiarities between those threads are amazing. Maybe MF is single because he wife left him for being such a dick.

I think there are lots of things here. Where as Op doesn't feel there is anything going on. I think if another male is offering to do lots of things and showing you a great deal of interest even if on your side there is no spark or connection, I think you do need to ask yourself why.
He is trying to replace your dh OP read your thread again as if it was someone else posting and I think you will see it.

Where did you see that Tali? I think OP is being quite cagey about the whole truth. She obviously doesn't want to hear what we are all telling her. I think she is more involved that she is admitting to tbh.

Oh yes, I see that she calls him single in her OP. I wonder if he is the same man and they have now separated?

on that other thread there was something about a cake too ?

We are both very fond of him, he's a very nice single [Christian - though I'm not sure why that should matter] guy.

X post.

An apple cake, I think it was.

I saw the MF was refered to as single, but there are a lot of things that don't quite add up here. The OP seems to have disappeared too.

OP has been quite selective about what she "reveals"