Snooping: Acceptable in some circumstances or not on?

[Icelander]

Greetings Mumsnet, I'm new here and have spent a few days trawling around this site and lurking my way through an unhealthy number of threads on this board. I must say I am fascinated and have really enjoyed getting an inside look at human interaction that is quite different to what I'm used to!

I note that it is viewed as basically normal and acceptable behaviour by posters here for a wife or girlfriend to look through her SOs email, search and page visit history, and text conversations etc in an attempt to confirm certain suspicions that they harbour. I say this because I have encountered reports of this behaviour in many threads and not once have I read a poster having the opinion that this is a serious breach of privacy, disrespectful, or a betrayal of trust. I'm sure some hold this opinion, but I would imagine it is a small minority based on my own impressions of what I've read.

I am genuinely amazed by this and am trying to reach across the gender chasm in hope of being able to better understand where you're coming from. It has really been shocking to me because I have broken it off with two getting-close-to-being-serious women for this exact reason. I thought that there was really something there with the latest one too. But I don't think that I could possibly be in a serious relationship with someone that invades my privacy and disrespects me like that. It would be a deal-breaker for me, but it isn't something I would set out as terms at the beginning of our dating or something like that as it just seems obvious to me that this is relationship ending material and that anyone can see that it's totally unacceptable and would expect things to be over and finished if caught doing that.

Before reading through this site I would have thought that the vast majority of people would have agreed with me, but now I see that I was mistaken. What am I to make of this? Am I being unreasonable? Is it likely that any partner I have, even the mother of my own children, is going to snoop if the chance is open and its unlikely that they will be discovered? I must say this is quite unsettling to me ... deeply disturbing actually, and would very much appreciate any viewpoints or stories about the matter. Thanks in advance.

I think that if a partner responded to my upset with 'amused confusion' I would be upset and angry. It's really disrespectful.

I snooped once in the 16 years I had known my husband, and the one time I did I found out that my checking up was justified, he had been sending explicit messages to other women. So yes, I do think that checking up on someone that has made you suspicious is acceptable.

I had mentioned to him that he was spending a lot of time on FB and he didn't come clean so snooping was the only way I could find out. As it happens he was diagnosed with BPD and it has come out that he was planning to kill himself once we'd finalised the purchase of our house, so in a roundabout way my snooping saved his life.

I realise that this is an extreme example, and very unlikely to be the case in your situation but I for one am glad I snooped.

BTW, I hate the word snoop!

No double standard here. My DH knows my history, knows my fears are to do with this and my self confidence rather than him.

Luckily he thinks I'm worth it, I also thought he was worth reassuring the first time I lost all my weight and he feared he wasn't good enough for me.

So sad that snooping had been needed at times but I'm glad we both did because as time has gone on and we are 20 years in, our retaliation ship has never been better.

Neither of us see each other as the enemy or to be angry at.

I'm comparing snooping to dishonest behaviour from the male side. I'll give an example. Say a man goes out has too much to drink at an office party. His wife asks how the party was and he might tell what is in his view a white lie and downplay how drunk he was. He wasn't aware that wife had prior knowledge that he completely plastered himself and was only asking to see if he would tell the truth. Fight ensues. Man is told off sternly for lying and cold shouldered for a few days. But I'm assuming that a woman could justifiably snoop, in most of your eyes, find nothing and then justifiably keep this from her partner. I see this as pretty hypocritical.

kittybiscuits, in some cases it could definitely be disrespectful but in some cases it might be justified. As fallible people we are sometimes irrational and stupid, sometimes dumb opinions are best met with ridicule. Is a healthy relationship one where your partner is treading on eggshells around you 24/7?

A lack of openness undermines trust and feelings of security are eventually destroyed.
Personally I have no privacy concerns, my wife knows everything about me has access to all emails, sms, knows all my passwords and knows all my daily comings and goings and is kept in the loop about everything and I never ever lie about anything..
All this helps with being able to make intelligent decisions that take each other's feelings into account and also builds compatibility and means that we know each other..

Oh and I'm a bloke and yes I have walked in on my wife looking thru my phone, who cares, everyone has fears and scars from previous relationships..

I have a couple of mates who are endlessly sneaking about, nipping into the bookies, looking at porn, going to the pub instead of doing what they said they were doing, hiding their phones..Too tiring..

trying to reach across the gender chasm in hope of being able to better understand where you're coming from
I don't think gender is even a factor in this. There are as many men who snoop on women as there are women who snoop on men.
I think that it generally shows up huge flaws in the relationship. Trust is a basic foundation for me. I couldn't function in a relationship without it.

Me and my dh are completely open about our phones computers etc know each other's passwords both have been cheated on in the past and we needed that to build our trust as it were never check his things nor him mine but knowing that I can at any time makes me happy as bad as that is I think it will take an awful long time for me to get over my issues I have caused by previous relationships and if he was secretive I would never of been able to build my trust in him and the relationship would not have worked.

Ice - maybe in the future if you just open up to women gradually in the early getting-to-know-you stage of dating, they won't feel the need to try and find out on their own. Some women might want to give you a chance despite your emotional unavailability and will snoop to rule out "married" or "serial killer". Me? I would just bail. I don't care that much.

In a marriage, snooping based on probable cause should be expected.

I can't abide liars.

If somebody proves they are capable of lying about something so petty as how drunk they were, how can you know where they draw the line at what they'll lie about?

Their lies show they put their wants before their partners needs and are untrustworthy.

Having not read the whole thread: Icelander, I'm female and I'm with you entirely. I don't think this is necessarily a male/female thing. Invading my privacy would end a relationship.

I can see why people do it; still doesn't mean it's behaviour I'd tolerate from a partner.

I have read the whole thread and feel like I am in some sort of research programme!

How old are you Icelander? Have you ever lived with a woman ( who wasn't your Mum?) it all sounds very text book.

I think your previous girlfriend that mentioned aspergers was on the money!
While snooping per se is not a good thing, I don't think it's quite as black and white as you seem to feel it is.
If someone is feeling insecure about the relationship, this could lead to minor snooping.
In this case, the correct approach might be to ask why the other person is concerned enough to snoop, and seek to reassure them in some way.
Not treat it as though it's a hanging offence...
You can become fixed on the logic of your arguments, and continue arguing your case as you have been doing, but generally speaking this will not help you with your romantic relationships.
It's hard sometimes to appreciate the subtle nuances of different situations, but perhaps you might give it a go before writing off girlfriends as you seem to have been doing?

I think you are a bit of a wind up!

I have never snooped. Never even thought about it. Never checked my STBXH s phone and was not a friend of his on the dreaded FB. However one day I just felt something wasn't right. I asked him outright if he was having an affair. He said no. I thought I was going bonkers. I felt insecure and emotional yet couldn't work out why. One day I looked in his suit jacket and found a second phone. Broke into it and there were lots of messages from OW declaring their love for each other. I then kicked him out.

I'm in a new relationship now. It is very very very hard not to be insecure. But I have to trust him And I will not snoop as it isn't a good basis for a new relationship.

There is no mantra on MN to snoop. Every post is different. It also isn't just a female issue.

Icelander, my first impression of your OP is a bit gloating about other people's misfortune and reading through the Relationships board as a bit of light entertainment.

Not that nice, really.

I don't need to trawl through my DPs devices looking for 'evidence' but I recognise some people have a terrible time with infidelity in their relationship and resort to it through desperation.

I certainly wouldn't come on here expressing such opinions, I would butt out and not be so judgemental. Maybe you should try it sometime.

I must say I am fascinated and have really enjoyed getting an inside look at human interaction that is quite different to what I'm used to!

Nice you get such entertainment out of other people's misery

I'd just like to point out that women here are not representative of some "out there". Many women post knowing, deep down, that their partners are up to no good but wanting solid confirmation to make leaving easier. That's where the snooping comes in. In some cases they know their dps are up to no good, in some way, but have had their head fucked with so much they doubt their own sanity. "Confirminf" gives them their sanity back. Either way they were intending to finish things. I'm sure you follow.
Basically- MN isn't "all women".

I'd also like to point out that women aren't from Venus, etc...we're the same, honest.

I wouldn't say I'm massively private. For this reason exactly I would be quite thrown by someone snooping on me. I'm open, therefore snooping would seem very strange. I don't think it's ever happened. I do think it's going from 0-60 ending it over a single incident without any knowledge of what "justified" it (something which the snooped on party might be able to understand and would have acted similiarly on?) but if someone was systematically doing it to me, I'd finish it. With some sympathy, but I have plenty on my own plate without the insecurity of someone else. If multiple people were systematically doing it I'd start looking at the options as previously listed ("am I contributing to this/am I choosing vulnerable partners?" etc).

Icelander snooping is not acceptable in any circumstance, it's only on here that you will find people trying to justify its ok, there are lots of women on here who will back each other up as well, it's not normal to snoop.

It's rude and invasive to casually snoop, but you can't put a blanket 'terribleness' ban on it because there are times when it is necessary. One of the things I found most odd about my dh's reaction to my finally confirming he was having an affair by looking at his email was how very angry he was about that and how he somehow felt that it was equivalent to his behaviour. That he had been lying and deceiving me, denying point blank that there was anything going on, making me feel insane, giving me the hard shoulder, slagging me off to his OW etc etc, that was nothing compared to the sin of me seeing he'd left our lap top on and logged in and flipping to his email account. Just weird.

Several years later and we both know each others email passwords and it's just not a big deal, I don't feel the need to look and wouldn't hide it if I did for any reason open his email/FB etc. You either have trust or you don't, looking at someone else's private correspondence is generally a symptom not a cause.

The attitudes found on a relationships board are not representative of the general population. Relationship boards are are going to be biased towards the views of people with a problematic relationship history, as they are the ones who tend to come here for advice on relationships. Its not surprising that spying on partners is endorsed here more than amongst people who don't have relationship issues.

Just to reassure you, OP, I'm not a snooper. Never have been, never would do. Neither do I go through bathroom cabinets or bedroom drawers. Ever.

If I had cause to believe something was amiss, and it wasn't just idle curiosity, I'd just end things, nowadays.

I wouldn't share passwords or let someone look through my phone because I don't have to give someone access to all my thoughts and conversations, and I wouldn't want or expect it in return.

So no, it's not everyone who does it routinely.

Anyone posting on MN saying "yeah, all is cool in my relationship, I just like to read his emails to find out what is going on at work" would get short shrift.

If someone is a few months into a relationship, no kids or other commitment, and puts on here that their partner is making them suspicious, many posters will reply "it's such early days, bin him if you don't trust him"

It is posters in long term relationships with kids, houses, other assets who are usually considering checking their strong suspicions, and those suspicions are usually of an affair, gambling problem or other relationship ending possibility. Not of having had an extra couple of beers than they'd said at first.

And if you actually HAVE read the boards as closely as you say, I'm surprised you didn't notice that. But confirmation bias is a tricky thing.

Hi, I'm also new to this site so pardon me if my lingo doesn't adhere to mumsnet norm! My SO and I met through the world of glamor modelling and when we met I agreed to give it all up. Now a few months later down the line I felt like I missed some of the thrill and decided to flirt with doing it again, well I was caught red handed and vow never to do it again and I'm even going to counselling. So all this happened on 31/10/14, and since then I have told SO every time I've gotten a text or email from an old 'friend' from that world. He is very touchy and worried as he travels abroad and I can understand he may think im getting up to things while he is away and dd is at school. Now here is the problem, he is snooping like no tommorow. Every chance he gets to go through my phone or iPad , emails he does and I know this as I strategically place it and it's moved or I can see when the emails have been updated as well. I can understand this to a point but he won't admit it. I don't want to keep bringing up the subject as we are working on moving on, but all he ever says is noo I haven't gone through your stuff. Anyways, Its constantly on my mind and I'm even contemplating inventing new email accounts and having false conversations which show me being good (which I am) in order to prove to him that I'm no longer wanting to go back to glamour modelling and that world. But then if I do that it's just opening another can of worms when really should just talk about it. I don't know, I think snooping a little bit here and there is ok, like checking your other halfs credit card statement or emails - If you have a suspicion , but not it becoming an obsession where all he does is check my phone whenever he gets a chance. My mom always told me, if you dig for £hit , you are going to find it.