Is this normal 'protection' or is it control?

[Whitecup]

I'm so confused and could really do with some impartial advice! My dh has always been very controlling financially and emotionally but things seem to have got so much worse lately. I was a sahm for 4 years. He gave me money each month but it was nowhere near enough to support 2dcs. Without going too much into it he'd give me £200 a month and I'd be expected to do all the food shopping, insure and run my car and buy clothes for the children. He would give me extra but I would have to ask and explain why and make it difficult. He is a high earner (six figure salary) but said this is all he could afford to give me I knew it wasn't but I was grateful he provided us with such a wonderful home and comfortable life. I decided I couldn't take it anymore, that I needed to break the cycle and started back at work about 8 months ago and since he's been a nightmare. He's told me that the dcs are suffering (I work school hours and drop them off and do pick up every night), for the first time ever I asked dh if he could pick the Dcs up from school so I could go to a meeting. Now he's saying I'm jepodising his career and everything that enables us our lifestyle and that he's going to have to leave his job. He keeps telling me that the dcs are ill and need a day off school so I have to take time off work (I haven't because they are fine but he makes me feel dreadful). Now he's asked me if I'm having an affair with someone at work. I've found myself lying to avoid being questioned. I don't know what to do- I feel like I'm going insane. He's away all the time with work. This month he's been away 3 weeks but every weekend he's gone out for a day with his friends. I feel like such a mug but every time I tell him he's been desperately unfair he says it's me and how lucky I am to have what I have. I'm so confused am I really just ungrateful??? I'm so tempted to give up my job but I couldn't bear to go back to having no money and no independence. He says he knows he's controlling but that he wants to protect me. How do I change this?

I think you need to wait until DC are in bed and tell him you need to talk. Write down the figures of how much a weekly food shop is and the figure for your monthly car insurance and show him quite clearly that the figures do not add up with what little money he is giving you.
See what the response is.
Perhaps, but highly unlikely, he will see sense and start paying you more.
Then take a little time to evaluate your situation. Take time to think if you want to remain in this marriage. Might be worth getting some legal advice to see where you stand if you were to separate.
He is terrified that you might get your own life and enjoy the things that he does. By keeping you at home, with little money, he keeps control over you.
Do not give up your job. It is your lifeline to a better and happier life.
Do you have a friend or another mum who can collect children from school on the odd occasion that you can't be there.? That way you do not need to involve him at all and can save yourself the guilt trip he will try to put you on.

Agree with others you are being abused and controlled. I have a highly educated and clever relative who is in the same position as you but unfortunately she can't see what others can. Her dp controls her and their dd absolutely. He has cut her off from her friends and parents by seemingly to express "concern" and wanting to "protect" them. He has put into her head that her parents favour their other child and doesn't want her driving to see them as it's too far and the car might break down. He criticises her friends and relatives lifestyles and is so unpleasant that often they are not invited to gatherings which is another way he can separate her from others. OP needs to take note of what's being said here. Under no circumstances give up your job and start planning how to live your life without your DH. I suspect your DHs controlling issues are deep seated and not easy for him to change.

Morning op, how are you this morning? It's horrible when you realise the situation you are in isn't normal and requires you to make changes. A lot of the people on here, myself included, have been where you are but have made our tunnels and escaped.

Hi white. Lots of ltb and abuse calls here and tbh I agree with them. if however that is all too much for you to take in right now and you need some baby steps then let it be this - hold on to that job of yours!

Perhaps, but highly unlikely, he will see sense and start paying you more

I agree this may be a desirable first step.

But really, he should not 'be paying her more' - all money should be 'family money' with both of them having equal access to it IMO.

What a dick.

He's going to get a hell of a shock when the judge makes the financial orders when you petition for divorce

BTW, I can't imagine you were eating terribly well on the amount he gave you. Was he happy with that?

Whilst you sort yourself out, don't top up that £200 a month in respect of his good budget. As there are 4 of you, that works out at about £12.50 a week for him. I would stick to exactly that and let the tosser eat value beans on toast every night

He is financially abusive and controlling. I doubt he will change. You could try counselling but you sound afraid of him. Do the Freedom Program and it will clarify things for you.

www.freedomprogramme.co.uk/online.php

You don't have to break up the marriage straight away but you do have to start drawing some boundaries. He says he knows hes controlling but its to protect you? get him to clarify what it is hes protecting you from? People who suspect their other half of having an affair usually have reason to be anxious because they are doing things and not being honest about it. Im not saying hes having an affair (although the way hes set up his lifestyle how would you know) but hes deffinately being eaten with anxiety that you being out of his sight for 5 mins might mean you are able to do things he doesn't want you doing.

You need to start telling all the family about his behaviour and get them to support you. Esp this nonsense about the kids suffering because you work. Tell them exactly how much money he expects you to manage on and exactly what he says to you when you ask for more. Keep a diary very important when trying to remember detail beyond the gaslighting experiences. Get some control over this situation or you will become unwell and he will use that against you. Do you know the family finances - ie do you have proof of his earnings and can you get copies of that paperwork for your personal records. Have you got friends who will support you whilst you re-evaluate this situation and get yourself sorted. Don't forget you will see things more easily from his point of view as he has taught you that the way you see things is flawed. So you need a trusted source of support who will hep de-program his manipulation. This sort of living situation is extremely draining and very hard to deal with it takes time to get out of it but you can,

Get a divorce. This man's abusive. And won't change.

Swap him for tax credits! He will have to pay you least 20% of his take home pay as a bare minimum if you divorce him, plus you may be able to stay in the marital home until youngest is 18.

See a solicitor and get proper legal advice, you don't have to act on it straight away but I would

This is such a sad post.

If the love he feels for you is gone I can imagine an abusive man treating you like this but to do this to his children????

THIS IS NO WAY TO LIVE!

At all costs keep your job.

Go and speak to a solicitor pronto.

Do not quit your job - you will need it.

I'm so sorry you are going through this OP

It sounds like his abusive behavior is escalating as you gain some freedom. Be very cautious as this is quite often a trigger to physical violence. Google how to form a safe exit plan as you may need to grab the kids and go at some point.

To give you an idea of what is a more normal relationship: my DH has a high pressure job with six figure salary. All our finances are shared. I earn considerably less. I can spend what I like, as long as we never go into debt (never have, never would). He collects dd from school at least once a week, so that I can go to college to do a course that interests me. His salary pretty much pays for the college course, and he has to collect dd, and he is happy to support me in this interest, because it is something I care about.
He could try thinking that because I earn less I should do more housework and gardening etc, but instead we have a cleaner and gardener, so that we can have free time together at weekends.
Next Sat he is going out for the day with a friend. I am planning a weekend away with some of my friends, staying in a hotel, shopping and eating out.

He has no problems with any of this. He is as involved with dd as I am. We get equal opportunity to have free time to ourselves. We can both spend how we wish within out budget. No guilt or pressure or control. We are not perfect in any way, but we see each other as equals worthy of respect.

That is what should be normal in your household.

I agree with everyone else, in that this is a controlling man.

The main thing to remember is that he may not change and he likely won't agree with you when you say anything to him. If he did, he wouldn't do it in the first place, but he is.

My advice would be to have a plan b, but then talk to him and see what he says. If you don't like it, fall back onto plan b. And save money like MAD.

Thank you all so much for taking the time to respond. Dh has just left for a business trip. I struggle to respond whilst he's here because he's also now taking to tell me I spend too much time on my phone/iPad and again that I must be up to something. I'm a bag of nerves I'm constantly assessing my movements. He had gone away for the day drinking in Saturday when I wrote my op. Sunday he came back as nice as pie. He'd bought me a bottle of perfume... My heart sank I felt like id been so cruel. He said it was lovely to see me smile, I thanked him and gave him a kiss and then he told me "no one else bought their dw's anything... You need to remember how lucky you are". I think the penny dropped that he does things like this to keep me hanging on. Last night he kept asking me if I wanted to book a holiday after Christmas. I felt sick the last thing I want to do at the moment is go on holiday with him (I'm still getting the last holiday he took us on thrown back in my face "aren't you lucky").

I've decided to stay put for now but I won't allow him to bully me anymore. I'm going to start saving some money for when/if I leave. I spoke with my DM last night who was surprisingly supportive. She also said she hadn't told dh she was worried about me (I don't think I wrote this in my op but dh told me my dm thought I was up to something). I'm also going to suggest we visit a counsellor, at least then I can say I tried.

I must have been acting differently because last night dh told me he felt unloved??? He shouted at my dd terribly because she stood at the side of me whilst we were eating dinner. It's quite a regular occurrence his very fraught shouting and it comes from nowhere there's no middle ground (never violent) but before I've always felt sorry for him thinking he must be stressed at work... I feel like I've woken up my poor dcs I've done a lousy job at protecting them from it.

Thank you again your support has been amazing x

My heart sank I felt like id been so cruel.

This is standard behaviour. It's predictable. They push you away so much and than have to do something to reel you back in. Has the added benefit of keeping you confused. But, "You need to remember how lucky you are" fuck me, he can't help himself, can he?

It's your call to plan your escape, but be aware that he will sense you pulling away and this can be the most dangerous time. Please,

• ensure your internet use is private and that he can't check up on you.
• can you get important documents such as passports and birth certificates to your mum's? Can you get copies of financial documents such as bank statements, savings and payslips?
• ring Women's Aid for advice. Would this be something you can do today?

Finally, have a think about why your daughter was standing next to you. She's not being raised in a safe environment, and she knows it.

It's classic for them to do just enough to enable them to to keep on controlling you.

How can you save on £200 a month?

My DH generally doesn't get me gifts when he goes away, but then, there's no need for him to and he certainly wouldn't make a point of highlighting the gift.

Oh god. Yes, I got the, 'aren't you lucky', line. A lot. And, 'some men hit their wives', got that one yet?

I beg you to seriously think about LTB.

Even if you aren't thinking about separation in the short term, please think about seeing a solicitor soon for advice. Find one who specialises in this area and will offer you a half hour free consultation. I did this a while ago and it was really helpful.

I think your DH knows he's onto a winner - he gets to live his life as he wishes while you are kept well and truly under the thumb for barely any expense at all. You're his equal, not his hired help.

Do not under any circumstances go to counselling with this man - extensive research shows that abusers rope the cousellor into abusing the victim as well. If your DH is plausible to outsiders this will happen.

Go to a counsellor on your own who specialises in abuse who will help rebuild your confidence.

Also buy and read Lundy Bancroft's book "why does he do that?" which will explain why your husband does what he does and how he will never change.

You have to leave him, once your children become teenagers he will turn on them so badly - because they will challenge his authority.

This man is bullying you all within the home which is now akin to a warzone; it is by no means a sanctuary for either you or your children who are also suffering now at first hand. That's why your DD was standing beside you.

His "you need to remember how lucky you are" comment just gives him enough rope to hang you further by. It is a further means of controlling you and keeping you confused and acquiescent. This man actively targeted you to abuse you. He has indeed done that and dragged these unfortunate children down with him as well.

No, no and no again to any form of joint counselling; it is never at all recommended when there is abuse of any sort within the relationship. No decent counsellor would ever see the two of you together anyway. You need now to make plans to get out of this and seek legal advice to end this marriage asap. I would do this sooner rather than later, Christmas is all but two days anyway and the Solicitors busiest months are January and February.

Staying put just allows him to abuse you and by turn your children even more. The damage he has done here is likely going to take a long time, years even, to undo as it is.

Saving money as well takes time (and time that you cannot afford to lose here) and he will likely do everything in his power to keep you from going. Controllers as well do not let go of their victims (the plural is deliberate) easily.

All his actions are abusive and abuse is about power and control. He wants absolute over you.

Seek legal advice and divorce him asap. That will be the way to set yourselves free.

You need to see a councillor on your own. Relate are quite happy to do this. Please do the Freedom program online if it is difficult to get out alone.

Do NOT - I repeat - DO NOT go to counselling with this man.
It is never ever recommended to have counselling with an abuser.
Don't even suggest it. He will use it as another stick to beat your with. Don't put yourself in that position.
Go on your own to understand why this behaviour is something you are prepared to put up with.
Believe us all when we say, he won't change.
He will initially because he'll see he's losing control but it will ramp up again, make no mistake.

You are being abused and so are your children. Your job is to protect them not to keep them and yourself, within that environment.

Please contact Womens Aid. They can help you to see this for what it is.
Please also complete their Freedom programme. A previous poster has linked to it.

The only amount of abuse acceptable in a relationship is NONE!!