Have reached an impasse with DH. WWYD?

[SandandSeaweed]

Have been together 8 years, married for 3. Have two DCs - 3 year old and 6 month old. Happy on the whole but we cannot resolve this one issue (which is a pretty massive one!) and I don't know where we are going to go from here.

DH's work takes him away a lot and I hate it! By a lot I mean between 10-14 weeks per year for up to one week at a time, sometimes away for one week, back for a week and then away again. His trips take him all over the world (sometimes very long haul). I have been unhappy with this situation for a long time (basically since I was pregnant with DC1) and have made my feelings very clear. We don't have any family near (or even close friends very near) so when he is away I have no support, apart from neighbours who I know would help out in an emergency. For the past few years my parents have generally come to stay with us when he is away but this is not sustainable as we live in a two bed flat, can't put them up properly and there is only so much I want to ask of them as they are getting older and things are more difficult now with two DCs. I also have a chronic illness and whilst I am well most of the time I can suffer from fatigue and lethargy. It's just all too much for me really.

I have lost count of how many conversations we have had about him getting another job but even though they generally end with him saying yes you're right I need to get another job he never does anything about it so really his words amount to very little. I know he loves his job on many levels - he really enjoys the work, has made the job his own, has lots of respect from colleagues and bosses. Apart from the trips abroad it is, in many respects, the perfect job for him. He has had two pay rises this year so they are very keen to keep him and he says this makes it harder for him to get an equivalent job elsewhere. I probably should also say he was diagnosed with depression and anxiety last year and that has obviously complicated matters hugely though he seems a lot better now and says he is feeling better.

None of the above changes the way I feel about him going away though and the thought of living this lifestyle indefinitely fills me with dread. It's not just him being away either, it also has a knock-on effect on our time together as he is often knackered or jet lagged when he is here and whilst I understand this it can get me down too - I want to get out and do things as a family while we can. I hate the lack of control I have - I feel that there is absolutely nothing I can say or do which will change this situation and that fills me with resentment and anger. I am wondering what the best thing to do now is because DC1 starts school next year and we do need more living space. We can't afford to move to a house where we currently are so I have been thinking recently should I just accept things the way they are now and move closer to DH's work? I broached this subject with DH at the weekend and he seemed quietly very pleased but the more I have thought about it the more I think such a move would basically be an agreement that he will stay in the job indefinitely, although I think maybe he intends to do this anyway. But if I won't move and he won't change jobs how will our lives go forward?

WWYD? I would really appreciate any input you may have, especially from those who have been/are in a similar position.

You are right re my options and for the past few months l've tried to do the latter - accept the way things are and I've been getting on with things, really enjoyed the summer but then for various reasons (eg. struggling with Dc2 not having own room and feeling cramped in the flat) I start to think about what's going to happen in the future, where we will end up in the long run and I start to worry about everything all over again! I do wonder how I will feel if he never gets another job and when enough will be enough. After all I've said to him about being unhappy and yet he does nothing...

Have you made it crystal clear that the day will come when his selfishness will be a deal breaker and you will no longer facilitate his chosen lifestyle?

How will he cope when it is his turn to have the kids if you seperate and he also has to work? Bet he hasnt considered that!

what conversations did you have about this before Dc2 planned /on way arrived? I ask this because My DP had work/ hobby (he played in a band which paid ok) which took him away 14+ weekends a year and it's just me, always, no help. He gave up the weekends and managed his music in another way. he knew he had to do it and I'd never have entertained idea of dc2 unless he understood I did not want that life and it's not half as bad as your situation. What did you agree?.

Dp works away a lot and even when he's not working away he's rarely home before 9 pm. So we're used to being on our own during the week and having him round during the weekends and tbh I prefer it when he's away in the week. It also means I don't have to cook for him when he gets home so it's less work for me.

But I don't have an illness and although no family around, I have lots of friends.

It does get a lot easier when they aren't so young.

Cerealqueen - that's such a good question because our situation has been made so much worse by having DC2, although I don't regret it. At one point I did say that I wouldn't consider having another DC whilst he was still going away and he agreed. But when I realised that he wasn't going to get another job anytime soon, I knew I wanted two DCs and didn't want a large age gap and I went back on what I'd said. So my desire for DC2 did override rational considerations. I have considered how things would have been if this wasn't the case and I think I would be feeling resentful about wanting to have another DC but not being able to because of his job - so not good for our relationship either way.

Bogeyface - I have talked to him about the possibility our relationship may not survive if we can't overcome this, thinking this may make him 'fight' for the relationship but so far that hasn't made any difference. I can see he does try hard in other ways though - helping me when he is around despite being knackered, he is trying his best in every other way except finding another job.

Slightly comparable lifestyle so I would flag two thing

a) it gets soooo much easier as the kids get older, so do think long term about this. Would changing job now, make him resentful later when kids are older and life is noticeably easier? What impact would it have on your finances and is this worth short term pain, for a longer term benefit?

b) ties into kids being older but focusing on your own life may mean that you're are happier (or in the worse case better equipped to deal with things if your relationship doesn't survive). What would make life easier for you? Au Pair? Can anything be done to help the health issues (you don't need to say what it is but will it get better/worse over time, is it related to have young kids ie sleepless nights make it worse?). Job wise - would being a SAHM mum be better or worse for you, will going back to work exhaust you or give you a welcome break? Do you get time for "you"?

Yes he is being selfish but sounds like he loves his job - what would be the impact on his own mental and emotional health if he gives it up?

Sorry many many questions but with jobs, kids, aging parents, house moves - these things are never black and white. How would a conversation go if instead of "I want you to change jobs" it was "this doesn't work, what changes do we need to make - for it to work?" and that could include many different factors not just his job?

For the record I would say it took our family a good 2 to 3 years of juggling to get the balance right, very much driven by kids getting older and changing elements so it worked better for me

bogey face I expect OP will cope in exactly the same way that millions of single parents cope every day, As for how her dh will manage with contact visits and his job ? back in rw men who love their work as much as op's husband does, do not start cancelling trips to facilitate contact. they cancel contact. So instead of coping on her own 1 week a month she gets to do it full time.( On much reduced income) Not really the way forward, especially seeing as she opened post with how happy she was with dh excepting this issue. The problem is that none of this has been planned out. OP went ahead to have another child, without the discussion or agreement that dh would find another job. The best compromise will probably be to move to an area where you can buy a house and garden , have space enough for parents to visit, get yourself a part time cleaner and start to enjoy the fruits of dh labour's, after all, he is not just doing it for himself but his family. There are God knows how many people out there who would love to have a great well paid job for themselves or partners, time to think of the positives and embrace them, the kids will not be little for long..

My dh works away all week and returns on Friday evening. I work Friday evening until 10. Therefore, I see him just before I go to bed and sat/sun.

Dh has worked away for many years. My dc are older now but my ds was a toddler and dd was 4 when he first worked away.

It is hard. I don't really like it and at times I am lonely. Especially at night.
I have got thru it by having a strict routine for everything. Dc, housework the lot. This mean that the weekends are quality time only and no mundane stuff is done. We go out for tea and do fun things. We live for holidays.

When your dc are younger it is much harder. I had a few hospital stays for ds when mine were little. Times when I was really ill and struggled on at home alone with a life threatening illness until I was hospitalised myself for 3 weeks. But you make it thru. I had a cleaner for a while and that was great. Could this take the pressure off you.

My dc are now 15 and 11. Life is so much easier. I have more time for myself. I work part time and have forged a really great social life. I go to the gym daily and am out for lunch/breakfast whilst the dc are at school.

My dh could get a more local job. But this would mean a big reduction in income. What he does is quite specialist. You also get used to the higher income.

I do speak to dh 4/5 times a day on the phone. He rings and texts the dc. A few years ago he was travelling home and was involved in a serious head on car accident. Very high speed. He was hit by a drunk driver. I received a call from the police whilst I was at work asking me to go to the hospital immediately as it was a possible fatal accident. Nothing prepares you for news like that. I thought I was going to pass out I was so shocked. My heart just dropped. My dh was very lucky. He recovered. But now when I'm fed up when he is away I think of that time and I feel blessed.

Although every Friday night when I'm at work and he's travelling that same route home I worry until I receive a text that he is home safely.

My only advice is, try and make your life easier by having some help. Whether it's a cleaner or some childcare so you can have some time for you to recharge your batteries. Plan fun activities when he is home so you have things to look forward to.

I think deXavia's post is very very good - she has a different way of looking at the situation apart from "you have to get a new job DH".

The question is what can you also do to improve your situation? What positive suggestions can you come up with (seeing as you are the one that's unhappy) apart from "you have to change your job"

It seems like you want your DH to make a massive change / upheaval to his life to make things better but you seem reluctant to make any changes at all.

Worth a ponder I think

Good luck OP

Surely engineering skills are in demand and he has other job options? Whatever one career adviser says he could at least test the waters with some agencies or applications. But sounds like he is happy with the status quo and basically wants you to suck it up.

I wouldn't move to be closer to his work unless there are other big advantages, eg amazing schools/affordable housing, 7pm is an ok time to get home for London and he would still be away loads.

You giving up work could be a big deal, for one thing you would be financially dependent. if he was around more would you still want to give work up, or is it just made untenable by his travel / job? (Unfair if so).

You say he "helps", (when he's there), but does he do his fair share of childcare and domestics?

Definitely get a cleaner! Au pair could also be good, especially when smaller Dc is bigger, depending on what you decide about housing.

Impact on his mental health to give it up? What about OP's mental (and physical) health?

i also think deXavia has very wise advice. see if you can approach it from another angle, other than he has to give up his very much loved job.

also, i think in order for you to progress you both have to be brutally honest. get him to open up about what he loves about his job. try and have a more truthful discussion about it, rather than being aggressive about how much you hate his job.

and yes, life gets so so much easier when kids are in school / pre school. you won't know yourself. imo babies are a huge stress on EVERYTHING.

good luck.

OP - I find it quite stressful reading your posts to be honest. That's not a criticism, it's just stressful to see someone putting up with so much bullshit.

CAREER ADVISOR - Were you actually THERE when the career advisor allegedly said this? Because I have a relative who works as a career advisor, and this just ISN'T the type of thing they say. Which makes me strongly believe that your husband is lying through his teeth. A career advisor simply wouldn't say something like that.

Don't move house to be closer to your husband's work. You need to keep working, so that you aren't financially independent on this man. Sorry, but it's true. You need to keep your options open in case you decide you can't deal with this anymore. Also, I rather suspect that if you became a STAHM, you might find that he starts travelling even more, as he will have a full time babysitter.

I'm angry on your behalf that your husband is treating you like this. Doing a job that requires lots of travel - okay for a short period of time. Okay whilst you establish yourself. NOT OKAY to be doing for years on end, ESPECIALLY when you know that your wife is struggling.

To be honest, I think this situation depends on you. You sound way less angry than I would be in your situation, so maybe this is just something that frustrates you every now and then, but in reality isn't that big of a deal to you. In which case your husband is never going to change jobs, because he has no motivation to. I've travelled quite a lot with previous jobs. Don't think for a second that he isn't having a good time while away. Yes the meetings can be tough, but you stay in nice hotels, you have drinks with colleagues, nice dinner's (usually paid for by the hosts or your company), and it's generally great. If it wasn't fun, he wouldn't still be doing it would he.

If you really aren't THAT bothered by his selfishness, then you just have to accept this is how it is, and the situation will stay the same until the day that HE decides he can't be arsed with it. Until then you will be burdened with the realities of childcare, running the home and picking up the slack.

However, if this is something that GENUINELY bothers you, then you need to lay your cards on the table, and actually stick to what you say.

Prime Minister and Royal family aside, I can't think of a single job the requires this much travel across the board. Fuck it, I've worked with sodding SAILORS who gave up sailing and started working as ship inspectors, or legislation writers, or at the IMO (international maritime organisation based in London). I've known people work a few years in humanitarian response or disaster recovery, then move into stable jobs in the foreign office, in charities, or in regional offices of UNESCO. I've known friggin' PILOTS who have moved into positions at big airlines.

There are always, always other options.

So if you have genuinely had enough, you need to tell him that you are fed up of picking up the slack, and you aren't prepared to spend your life in an uneven partnership. Either he speaks to work and drastically reduces his travel, he finds another position which doesn't involve so much travel, or you separate. Tell him he has six months, and if you can't see that he is making an effort to change, then it's over.

If after 6 months nothing has changed, separate. If after six months he is clearly making an effort but not quite there, tell him you will give him another six months. If after a year it's still the same, be true to your word and separate.

Let HIM realise that children bring responsibilities and he can't just fuck off for weeks and weeks during the year and abandon his family.

Thanks for all these - has given me loads to think about, good advice and opinions vary wildly it seems.

DeXavia - in answer to your questions re the financial aspect I think that's one of the problems. Whilst he is on a good wage actually it's not enough where we live to cushion the lifestyle - not enough to afford a house and actually as have 2 DCs now (2 lots of childcare) we probably could not afford the same mortgage if we were to reapply. If we were to move out of the South East however we could conceivably be mortgage free. Out of interest what do people think would be an adequate salary to sustain this sort of lifestyle considering we live in London? Would be interesting to see how it compares....

Long term there are no promotion opportunities for DH in current role which is why they continue with the pay rises I think, they are very clever. He works in a very exciting, fast paced environment (would completely out me if I said exactly what) and it's also quite niche but yes of course it's not too late to switch course. He is the kind of person who gets completely absorbed in things and i think that's part of the problem. I didn't go with him to the careers advisor but from what he says (and obviously this is what DH took from it!) there are three options - stay where he is and negotiate change for the better, branch out within the same sector by networking or career change competely to different sector, also by networking. He seemed to think the jobs were there but at this stage paper applications and agency enquiries won't have a high success rate.

Re changing my way of thinking - yes I have tried to do this, to think more positively and to accept the status quo but this part of me always struggles with another part which is thinking we should be settled into a house by now ready for DC1 to go to a nice school and we can start putting down some proper roots and really start to enjoy life together as a family. This thinking probably comes from my own upbringing (interestingly DH didn't have this stability and hated moving as a child but even this doesn't make him want to avoid the same thing for DCs)

Kaykayblue - your post really resonated with me because it does sum up how I feel a lot of the time really. I'm probably sounding a lot more understanding than I am in real life as I want to give a balanced view. I have considered giving him an ultimatum but separation would be the ultimate failure for me and he is a brilliant DH and Dad is so many ways. I don't know how I would cope financially if we were to split and I would be almost completely on my own then so it wouldn't actually solve anything. You are right though that if I do decide this is unsustainable a time limit will have to be set.

Sorry epic post, just trying to work it through....

I think you're asking too much. He likes his job, that is not too common as far as I know! A lot of people don't like their job but have to go to work and for whatever reason finding another can be tricky.

Is there any way that you could use childcare to soften the blow on you when he is away?

He wants to stay in his job he has demonstrated that. You just don't like him going away, there are forces wives, offshore wives and single mothers who all do it alone for longer periods of time than what you do.

Sorry I think you should take one for the team on this matter. Let it go, it's burning your emotional energy.

OP I don' think we are saying "just accept it". We are saying "what can YOU do to change things, rather than seethe and rage against the situation"

OP has already done a lot to deal with the situation, she has gone part time, remained in a flat in London rather than moving out somewhere bigger/near schools, which she'd prefer, supported her H's job for years and years by covering everything at home AND working.

He hasn't made many changes, has he?

It is not necessarily London or miles out, there is always SE commuterville.

Some seem to think she should do more. That seems like swallowing the shit sandwich to me.

I'm struggling to ignore the stereotype of people living it large on trips abroad - mainly as on Monday I set off for 12 days around 4 countries including 3 x 5 hour over night flights (ie no sleep) and straight into work. See part of my changes was that I re built my career and we manage our travel accordingly. Doesn't mean the travel is great - just means my job is.

So back to OP - start with what you want - is it just a different job for him, but everything remains the same? Or is it something else - and then the question comes if you had everything else would his job be less of an issue?

I absolutely do not believe you should accept the status quo or that his mental health is more important than yours. But that maybe the answer lies in a mid point and that by switching the discussion from "change jobs" to "what can we do short term? where do we want to be in 5 years time?" you'll get a better answer or at least an answer that isn't an ultimatum (although if he really is an arse in every other regard then maybe that's where it goes in the end)

For example is the move to the SE the one that brings him closer to this job but further from others? But if you still want it for lots of other reasons go for it. With the kind of job he seems to be doing he can still look for other roles, maybe still with travel but where he works from home too?

QuiteLikely - I find your post bizarre.

The OP said that her husband wasn't doing this work when they were first together. She didn't go into this relationship with her eyes wide open.

She has been "taking one for the team" for YEARS. When is it her husband's turn to take one for the sodding team? It's great he likes his job. I'm sure it's not the only job in the entire universe that he would enjoy.

And yes, there are people who put up with their partners being away for a lot longer. That has zero relevance to the OP.

Wives with partners in the forces are - the vast vast vast majority of the time, fully aware of that before they get married and have children. And even then, they are free to separate if it becomes too much for them. I know a woman whose husband is away with work for two months, and then back home for two months. They've done that for YEARS. And she has openly admitted to me that she prefers it when he is away. He wanted more kids, and she refused on the basis that she would be the one looking after them.

Basically - what works for some people doesn't work for others, and there's zero shame in that.

OP - Yea, it must be pretty easy to be a great dad when you get to fuck off for multiple weeks during the year and get a complete break from family life.

It's not like he is doing it to get away from his family though!

Anyhow it doesn't matter that's his job, OP has the problem. Leaving him will not solve anything. Compromise is better and worth it for the sake of the family.

So, essentially, your DH has a great job that he loves, and he gets to jet around the world while his two lovely children are taken care of by the best caretaker possible - their mother. All he has to do to sustain this existence is to keep making empty promises so that you won't complain too much.

And you get, no help, no work, no house, no free time, no allowances for the fact that you're ill, no partner much of the time and no consideration of your wishes whatsoever.

And people are telling you you're too negative??

Jesus Christ.

He is totally taking the piss out of you. He is using you to get the life he wants while you just suck it up all the time. He may be a "nice guy" but he's definitely not a good partner.

What does 'jetting around the world' have to do with anything? That's his job and as has already been pointed out, travel is not that glamorous.

And how very dare he actually have the nerve to enjoy his job - would we all feel better if he didn't?

OP - I really don't think it's reasonable to ask him to change jobs but as you are currently the main caregiver I do think you should be having a lot more say on where you live. You should also be getting more help for yourself (finances willing)

You said that you would like him to work in a job where you could spend more time together as a family and yes, I agree that would be lovely. However for many, many families, this is simply not possible

I don't think his job is actually the problem here.

I think that his lack of support or understanding is one factor.

I also think that you might be feeling resentful of the fact that you are left at home alone and I wonder if his changing jobs would make any difference to that.

You need to sit down with him and set out very clearly what you expect and need

He hasn't tried to get a different job, despite saying that he would try.

If he'd tried for six months and wasn't getting anywhere, I'm sure OP would feel differently!

If one person in the marriage is unhappy, it's not a happy marriage.

OP has little chance of going back to her current job as it's shift work and she has no help covering shifts.

To say she's "no better off" splitting up is bollocks - she could move with the kids to a cheaper location/near relatives and change her dynamic significantly. Not saying she should, but really?!

Money needs to be earned and kids need to be cared for.

OP and DH both earn money. Family have previously done childcare. This is no longer an option. So a new set of options need to be generated.

I think some of your biggest problems are nothing to do with DHs' job.

Living in London clearly isn't a long term solution for you. You want a house, you can't afford a house. So eventually you will have to move. You will have to make new friends. Lots of us have made exactly this choice.

Your children are at a great age for moving location. You can be settled before you have to apply for school places.

There are lots of options for where to live though. Not just next door to DHs work. You could move to anywhere that would still get him home by 7. You could choose that location to be where you have more work options, where he could commute to other jobs if he chose to change one day.

Again that's a completely normal choice that many of us make.

We live in the commuter belt round London. We moved here from London. It has good transport links, good schools and I have a lovely house for money that would only get us a poky 2-bed flat in London.

You have lots of options. Look wider.

6 month old and 3 year old. Are you currently desperately sleep deprived?