contact with children after domestic abuse

[turbonerd]

Hoping for some practical advice here. We have 3 children, have lived apart since he got arrested last winter. Since Sept last year the children and I moved to my homecountry in Scandinavia. Now he wants to move here. He has visited and we have spent time together so that he could be with the children. Despite me telling him in no uncertain terms that this was for the Benefit of the children, no reconciliation possible, in fact I have a new partner etc, he still hinted to us getting back together. I Said no, and it looks like he has understood. Should I welcome him moving close to be with the children? The two oldest miss him desperately.

I cannot even begin to comprehend it.

well that's cos you don't understand the situation at hand CarryOn.

be kind. be nice. be supportive. Please

Hissy I did not mean to upset or offend, I do apologise if I have. The reason for the bluntness is because I think you can often lose perspective of how screwed up a situation is, and I think sometimes seeing how wrong something is from an outside point of view can kind of jolt you back to your senses.

For example sometimes an OP will say "I'm not sure if this is abuse or not" and hundreds of posters will respond "Are you kidding??? Of course it is" and the overwhelming reaction sometimes makes OP think, shit, this obviously isn't normal.

I think it's not acceptable in any shape or form to let any abuser near your kids, in my opinion, it's your job to keep them safe and I wouldn't allow him access.

Having said that I've not been there and it's not my place to say how you make decisions like this. Sorry again if I offended

I know how incredible it all seems, and looking back on what happened to me I'd be guilty of even thinking it about myself tbh!

MANY is the time i slapped my head after he left that I thought WTF were you thinking?

it's understandable you think that way tbh, and I'm glad you have no experience of it. this is the way it SHOULD be! :) NO woman should be abused, no man, no child, no pet even.

I do understand how weird it must seem. And it does from the outside, which is why it can help to hear or read reactions that go WHAT? so that the insanity of the situation hits home.
It can be very hard too, because I always had to question myself to an extreme degree. That is better now, for many things I trust my own judgement again. Things to do with ex often gets blurry though. Hence I'm here, airing my thoughts to get a reality check.

I can completely see how someone like that squashes out every ounce of your self-reliance and self-belief, and ability to judge behaviour and situations correctly.

I think it's a remarkable achievement that you got away from him and got the kids away from him. Somewhere inside you there is a steely core of determination and a very clear sense of what's right and what's wrong: you've shown that because you decided to leave, and then left. Keep on believing in yourself.

"long interrogations that he filmed, and some sexual abuse thrown in for good measure" this, coupled with his endless threatening monologues sounds like some kind of refined torture/brainwashing technique. It sounds like it because it probably was.

Turbonerd: this man is your enemy. He is also the enemy of your children and their mental well-being.

East to say but hard to do, I know, but I'd move house and cut off all and any possible avenue for contact with this dangerous madman.

Remarkable Achievement

that's dead right, it really is!

2 women a week are killed in the UK by their partners. Strangulation is a KEY indicator of serious threat to life.

never under estimate what you have already achieved turbonerd you might not see it as amazing, but it really is. one day you might understand what a great thing you've managed to do.

I gave the DVD's to the police because he had filmed the raping too, as sex videos for us (It makes me feel a bit sick to type this) not my thing, but he was very busy filming things.
I knew he deleted what did not go according to plan, ie I was wincing and saying it hurt, tth

oh love. you poor poor thing! :(

Or things like that.
Anyway, they looked through it and were rather apalled and wanted to charge for grievous bodily harm, as itwent on over such a period of time. I was quite ground down after that, which gave a springboard for further abuse and escalation since my handling of daily life went Even further to pots. Domestic disaster when it came to tidying and work and general organisation of me and the kids.
Surprisingly much better now...
But the police psychiatrist that interviewed me Said I was remarkably resilient. That was an Odd thing, but I clung into that a lot.

Meant to add thank you for good advice and taking time to listen Hissy, Talking and all of you. I will come back and re-read to keep a Level head.
About my youngest and asd, it is very possible that living this stunted her development. She is blossoming now though and has become a happy trusting girl. She does not have much language, but has become interested in contact with people and now clearly wants to comnunicate. The change in her is very positive.

ASD is not as far as I know caused by witnessing abuse. Don't beat yourself with that stick.

concernedabouttheboy's post was great.

Do listen to what's been said here. And turbonerd, take it slow with the new man becuase I don't think you're even 20% free of the headfuck your ex did on you.

The new man might be a lovely, honest, decent bloke. But you, just you, will need time to recover and think clearly again. To have a sense of perspective about what's normal. The new man might be part of that recovery, but do give yourself time and take it slow. Lots of time.

Good god, what you've been through.

Sorry, not much time right now, but just to echo what others have said - you have done something amazing in getting away from this man, and I totally support you in staying away from him, and protecting your DC from him at all costs.

Re your DS - state the obvious as much as possible. Make sure he knows that none of this is his fault (so obvious you might not think of saying it, but children often blame themselves for their parents' relationship break down, even where there hasn't been abuse, and in this situation it's so very loaded), make sure he knows that he can count on you unconditionally. The things that you might think go without saying, can still do with being said.

Will come back when I have more time. Wishing you awareness of your strength - you do have so much! So glad this thread is being a support to you.

Please get professional help here.
Your son needs an understanding therapist not contact with his dad.

You need to cut contact as far as is possible. Don't even discuss ex s plans for your ex s future. It us not your problem.

You have done well but you need a good psychologist to untangle everything and to talk thru your belief that the kids miss their dad .
They have witnessed horrific behaviour.
They need protecting.

He strangled you whilst you were standing at the top of the stairs holding your baby.

That is the thing to remember.

That means that he is not bothered if he hurts or even kills the children in order to hurt you.

Please keep tat in mind when making decisions.

There has been a lot for the children over the years, and the upheaval of moving country takes time to get used to aswell. I do try to state the obvious as often as I can, like Talking says. Good to be reminded, especially lately it got busy with work and studies, and the boys seem to feel a bit left behind then. Just remembering to take those extra few minutes just for them makes such a difference.
It will be slow with the new relationship. I was'nt Looking for one but there he came along as a friend to start with. He has children too and we want to wait and see how it goes before saying anything. And I want to sort out if I actually want to head towards ever living with someone again. It is a lot to do as a single mum, but I enjoy not having to answer to anyone. No one drunk in the shed, no one pestering, no one yelling, and I can go shopping with a fucking shopping list so I don't get told off fir forgetting anything. I know that living with a nice, kind, normal person life is not like that, but it's good to be on my own and see I can actually do it.

You're right ... nice, normal people enhance life, not blight it.

Best of luck turbo to you and you children.

turbo I'm sorry I didn't mean to add another worry to your pile by mentioning the trauma/asd-type symptom idea. I was hoping the opposite. I have had a similar experience (DV in front of DC) and my youngest is currently being investigated for asd but the GP (who has a particular interest in trauma) thinks his difficulties are trauma-related rather than asd, and the paed won't diagnose either way at the moment. I'd obviously prefer neither option, but I think trauma is more treatable and at least I want to be getting the right treatment.

Turbo you've been through so so much, and achieved so much: you brought your DC to safety, you're establishing yourself back into another country, and addressing serious concerns about your DC. You really have a lot to be proud of.

Don't worth, Goldfish. I am also thinking that perhaps it is trauma and not asd. She has been for months of assessments and the psychologi spesialists have not come back with a conclusion since the last meetings in July.
Since pregnancy this crap was ramped up, and she was very scared of her father. She cried a lot every time he took her out in the pram or I had to leave for work ( a few hours here and there). She saw him come towards us with a hoover handle. I thought he was going to smash my head in, but he strangled instead. After he came to her cot and she shrank away to the far end.
Sorry about the length of my posts, I am thinking through it all whilst writing, and remembering.
Can I ask you how long since the dad was removed from your family, Goldfish?

Hi turbo

With everything you write, it's becoming increasingly clear that your ex is a real danger to you and your DC, and you have to protect yourself and them from him.

The damage he will do to them (and to you) by continuing to be in their lives on this footing must surely be far worse than any damage that his absence from their lives would cause.

He is still abusing you in the way he manipulates you and rewrites the past. He is still abusing them too. I really think that you now have to go down the road of absolutely NO further direct contact with him. If he wants to see the DC, let him go through the legal system, let him contact you through a solicitor. He shouldn't be able to dump his poison on you any more.

Start building your case why he shouldn't be allowed unsupervised access at all, not on Skype or via email either. He is an abuser and he will use that opportunity to mess with their heads as much as he's messed with yours. The fact you have at least some of this stuff logged with the police should surely be of some help here. Is that the police here in the UK, may I ask? I honestly have no idea of the legalities of the situation across borders but you say you're in contact with all the agencies over there so I guess you do have a lot of information.

Were/are you married? Have you started divorce proceedings if so? And are you bringing charges against him? Sorry, don't mean to interrogate you, just trying to get an idea of where you are with all this.

Interesting that your DD's issues could well be related to the trauma, rather than ASD. Yet another reason to keep him well away. And with your older DC (both DS's?) I do think there's an element of Stockholm syndrome in their missing him. Abused children almost always love the abusive parent despite the abuse. It doesn't make it a healthy relationship for them. You started the thread motivated by wanting to do right by them and not deprive them of their relationship with him, but their safety trumps that, surely.

You say you've protected them from a lot of what he did: I think now is the time to start gently telling them the truth, in an age appropriate way. They obviously know some of what he did, given they witnessed the strangling. Yo need to let them know very clearly that what he did was wrong and unacceptable and that you weren't to blame for any of it, any more than they were. Very important that you assign total responsibility for his abuse to him - especially as he conducted such a campaign of making everything your fault, some of that warped abuser's perspective may have filtered through to them and you need to correct it. You know how it's messed with your own head.

Good that your middle DC is accessing some counselling, and sounds like your DD will get support too. What about your DC1? And - what about you? You say you've read the books and the Feeedom Programme, do you mean you've actually participated in it? Whatever the case, I really think you need some longer term support to help you process what has happened to you and to move on healthily. It sounds like you're still only just waking to how bad it really was, and there's a way to go yet. Agree that your new relationship needs to go really, really slowly.

Like mumoftwo said upthread, the fact that he strangled you while you were standing at the top of the stairs holding your baby shows such an utter disregard for your and your DC's safety that you cannot show him any trust at all. And the level of abuse he waged against you - filming the diatribes and the rapes - that's just... Words fail me.

Sorry I'm going on so much! I know that when you're living something on the inside it's very different to hearing about it from the outside. I don't mean to lecture you, just feel very concerned that he still has such access to the DC and though them to you, and that he is using this opportunity to manipulate and abuse you all further.

And once again, you did a really amazing thing in getting yourself and your DC away from him in the first place, after all the years of being worn down like that. You are very strong.

I find that this thread plus the support of my family is helping to wake up.
He wasn't violent much. It was a lot of posturing and wagging the finger the last 3-4 years, then banging fist on stuff, then chucking stuff about, then the last year he started with the strangling. After the first time I actually decided to have a chat with him about how strangling someone is really not the done thing. I was all civilised and rational about that little chat. I think his response was along the lines of that Yes, it was wrong, but if I had not done/Said whatever he would not have had to do it. Later he said "you make me want to strangle you" at least a few times. I remember thinking, but you can not say something like that and mean it. Turns out he did mean it. Always from behind, mind you. The oldest did not see it, they heard it as they were just around the corner upstairs.
So not often physically violent as such, but quite menacing I think.
He's a pacifist, and has artistic ambitions; writes scripts, songs and makes sculptures in his spare time.
Well, so is fucking Polanski come to think of it. And other dickheads of the highest order.
I think as I type so sorry if it is rambling.
He has to sentences, common and sexual assault, which he did not go in prison for as they were first offence. But he initially pleaded not guilty and wanted to take it to the county court. (I think it is called)

DC1 is much more introvert, but is doing generally well. He did not want to talk about it, but we have on several occasions anyway. He listens when me and DC2 talks and does not seem to have taken the guilt onboar. He connects his dad with watching films.
I have self medicated with books. No time for Groups and not sure I want to speak to a councellor or psychologist, because it depends so much on who the person is.

Good that you're waking up, turbo. It can't be an easy process.

I see where you're coming from but actually I would question the "wasn't violent much" idea. You've heard the saying I guess that the only acceptable level of violence in a relationship is none? So he's already gone way beyond that.

And definitely the only acceptable level of strangling in a relationship is absolutely none, ever. And yet he repeatedly did this to you, and "always from behind"... You only need to do that once to kill someone, if the intent is there or if you're out of control. That's not not very violent! That is extreme.

So I would say that physically yes, he was very violent... And emotionally/psychologically and sexually he was extremely violent, too. I think it's important for you to see that it's all violence, turbo. And very menacing. Sorry, I know it must be very hard to get your head around all this. But you need to see him for who he is, to help you stay safe now.

And I totally get your analogy with Polasnki. The arty, "pacifist" types are just as liable to be abusive bastards as anyone else, despite the veneer of "sensitivity" they paint themselves with. Maybe just better disguised sometimes. I'll join you in a rant about those kind of dickheads any time!

Good that you prosecuted anyway, well done for that, must have taken some guts. Shame he didn't get sent down.

Lastly: I can understand your reluctance to see a counsellor because you don't know who you'll get and you're right actually, seeing a bad counsellor/therapist can make things worse. BUT seeing a good one can be life-changing, and I do think it could help you a lot to untangle where you are now and how you got there, not least so you can know yourself better and be more aware of red flags in the future, and it could also help you support your DC even more.

There is something you can get from that interaction with another human being who believes you and knows which questions to ask you and what to reflect back to you that you will never get from a book. So I would say don't rule it out, but make sure you research and interview thoroughly and only work with someone you feel really safe with, and obviously someone who won't minimise the abuse. You can choose who you see if you're paying, if that's financially viable.

But having said all that, if it's not what you want to do, it's not what you want to do, and I won't labour the point any more!

It's very weird, waking up more and more. I could understand it intellectually last year; Yes it is wrong to do all these things.
But to get it emotionally has taken, and is taking, such a long time. He always Said I over-reacted to everything, that I over-exaggerated, that I was over-sensitive. The list goes on. It is hard to shake that, it was years and years of it. I was lazy, pathetic, weak and one more thing which I have forgotten, hurray!
I can see it in others, it is difficult to see it in oneself. So this thread is invaluable.
I had two or Three instances of crapola councelling "help". But also some very good, especially Rasa in the north of uk was fantastic, and a helpline in the south of uk. I am considering ut though.