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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DH suggested I put this to you lot. What do you think?

422 replies

AntideluvianCat · 25/07/2014 11:43

I'm going to try to keep this as neutral as possible, as it seems DH and I both completely believe we're in the right, despite our opposing views. Also going to try not to drip feed.

We've been together two years, married just over a year. We both have DDs from previous relationships. Mine (12) lives with us and goes to see her dad overnight at the weekend; his (13) stays two nights a week. My DD has some SEN, and coupled with the hormonal chaos of being 12, can be quite hard work. I also work 25 hours a week in a job that I love, but that can also be stressful and a bit overwhelming (social work).

A couple of months ago, DH told me that if I won't dress up for sex - ie. stockings, suspenders, thong, basque, whatever - he can't see any point in our relationship continuing. I was absolutely flabberghasted. It was like being kicked in the head. He did apologise, and we patched things up a bit, but he keeps coming back to the same thing every time we have words. He says that it would make him feel wanted and appreciated, that he is constantly giving to me, and that I give nothing back.

Thing is, I DO want and appreciate him. I love him. I'm so glad we found each other, at this relatively late stage in life (I'm 40, he's 50). But I find the weekdays hard, when DD is playing up and I'm exhausted from work and the constant bloody grind of housework and organising everything. As consequence, sex tends to happen at the weekends. I'd say we probably have sex a couple of times at the weekend, and sometimes, but not always, once during the week.

The funny thing is, that at the weekends when I'm relaxed and can focus on us rather than everybody else, I do dress up for him, and am happy to do so. I really enjoy it, and love the effect it has on him. This morning, during yet another argument about this, I reminded him of this, but he said it doesn't count because I'm only doing it under duress. I'm not doing it under duress, but it seems I can't win. He is insistant that I should - on say, a Tuesday evening, when I've been at work, then come home and have been running around doing domestic chores and coping with / helping / monitoring / disciplining DD til 9.30pm, I should pop on some saucy underwear and adopt the sex kitten persona. But I don't want anyone to make anymore demands on mme. It's all I can do to crawl into bed and read for half an hour.

In the interests of balance, I should add that DH has more money than me and props me up a bit financially, which I'm incredibly grateful for and regularly tell him so. He does most of the washing up, hoovers the house once a week, cleans the bathrooms, does any gardening, and helps me with DD a lot. I have quite high standards domestically (but not ridiculous - I only clean once a week and change beds every 7 - 10 days), and am very tidy. Being tidy helps me feel on top of things, and I make no apology for it. DH says that he likes my standards, but doesn't really help to maintain them. I feel that I tidy up after him a lot.

An example: He eats a lot of biscuits. I have asked him to use a plate for these, as otherwise I have to clear up his crumbs. He refuses; thinks I'm being ridiculous. I got a telling off a couple of weeks ago for asking his DD to eat off a plate too. I've tried to explain to him that this little thing could actually help with the sex thing - I wouldn't feel so resentful having to clear up after him all the time. But it is just dismissed. He actually said to me this morning (and I quote) " we should have high standards domestically, and high standards in the bedroom" Shock

Your goign to tell me to LTB aren't you? Sad

OP posts:
NickiFury · 25/07/2014 12:37

One of my ex's was obsessed with stockings and suspenders and it went from the occasional thing to every single time. He would request "stockings and suspenders" in this little baby voice that immediately killed any desire for him stone dead!

I therefore find this quite repellant in any man. Also think it's quite an old fashioned thing. The younger men I know don't get it all.

Anyway, point being, he sounds utterly grim and I personally could not find him attractive.

Hope you're reading this you horrible bully.

NoSquirrels · 25/07/2014 12:37

Also, just wanted to say, all the financial and household duties he does are perfectly irrelevant to the discussion. (Also the crumbs on the plate, to be honest, but I think you are focusing on this because it's easier than looking at the awful selfish sex demands.)

You are married. When you chose (mutually) to get married, what's mine is yours and what's yours is mine. So it is not relevant who earns the most, or how often he hoovers. He should hoover, and contribute fairly to the married household. So what if he earns more? Why do (either of you) care about this?

Ketchuphidestheburntbits · 25/07/2014 12:39

The fact that he doesn't listen to your point of view is a much bigger problem than the fact you don't want to dress up for him. You are a person with feelings in this relationship but he is treating you more like a household appliance.

Get rid of him and let him watch all the porn he wants.

Ask him how he would feel if a nasty, grubby man was treating his DD like this.

rootypig · 25/07/2014 12:40

Agree with Bruins, you are reflecting the messages he's giving you in worrying ways.

OP you are a woman who is raising a child, does tough and worthwhile work outside the home, and runs the home. Don't let him make you feel inadequate. Don't let him teach you you should be grateful.

HanselandGretel · 25/07/2014 12:41

Why does he want you to put it to MN'ers?? He's already got his fixed and rigid views about what constitutes a good sex life, i.e.' the little woman should play sexy porn star hooker else I'm being short changed, after all I'm giving her a nice life'.

I'd be so turned off I'd close shop for good.

CeliaFate · 25/07/2014 12:45

You know what? Kindness, good manners and a caring nature turn me on. Someone being a sulky child who demands their own way and won't even consider listening to my needs makes my fanny shrivel up. There. Does he understand that?

Castlemilk · 25/07/2014 12:45

I'm sure he does 'look after' you.

For men like this, it takes the place of respect and an equal relationship. He treats you like a dependant or a child, and has no concept of you as a separate and equal person.

He won't change or reform, OP. Men like this are not only kind of second-rate as grown up partners, they're also not very clever or mentally versatile, or any good at emotional maturity.

And, 'an avid user of porn' - what a nasty mental image. Bleurgh.

Move on and out. This isn't a man who can make even the most vaguely intelligent woman happy for very long, and I predict a frustrating and grim future for you if you stay.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 25/07/2014 12:46

A caring person likes to look after people and there's nothing wrong with that. A controlling person likes to care for someone by managing their life, choosing what car they drive, how they have their hair cut, picking out their clothes and positioning them like a doll. That's not an equal partnership.

emotionsecho · 25/07/2014 12:47

Spot on Bruins.

Sounds like he has bought into all that claptrap about wife being a lady in the drawing room and a whore in the bedroom, no hope of changing that knobbish attitude I'm afraid.

magoria · 25/07/2014 12:47

Mr Anti

A woman will not feel sexy and in the mood after running around clearing up messes you and your child make because you cannot be bothered to make a simple adjustment such as using a plate.

Either clear up after yourself and your child or shock horror use a plate.

Give a little and you will get in return.

Selfish gits take until the giver becomes resentful and stops.

PS Mrs Anti treating your child and expecting the same as from hers is spot on.

Gain some respect for your wife and all she does and teach your child to be respectful too. Mrs Anti is not your employee or servant.

JackieBrambles · 25/07/2014 12:48

Urgh. I had an ex who liked me to dress up. He was an avid porn user too, and a high earner who thought that this fact meant I should be grateful and do what he wanted.

This post makes me shiver and brings back horrible memories of what he said/did to me.

Sorry OP, he's horrible :(

mindyourown1 · 25/07/2014 12:55

He treats you like he has bought you and you are his slave - sorry but I am going to join the LTB chorus too. Porn use is bad enough frankly.

Fmlgirl · 25/07/2014 13:02

He sounds rank.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler · 25/07/2014 13:04

'he said it doesn't count because I'm only doing it under duress. He is insistent that I should, on say, a Tuesday evening...'

And he can't spot the problem with this logic? It's never occurred to him that you are under duress because, ermm, he is putting you under duress?

This. Completely.

Allalonenow · 25/07/2014 13:22

He sounds like a domineering controlling bully.

You are not in an equal partnership, as your comments about him propping your finances up and him taking you on holiday show, not to mention that he completely disregards your simple requests such as using a plate.

You have only been married a year but already are unhappy in the relationship. I think if you stay with him, these problems will get worse. What will he be demanding from you when old age causes him erectile problems? You can be sure that you will be blamed for any failure on his part.

What sort of signals are you giving your daughter about relationships? At present you are teaching her that being subservient is a good role for women.

Did you know about his porn use before you married him?

You sound like a kind caring woman Anti but I think you are in for an unhappy life with this man, because he won't change.

PS Don't bother going to therapy with him, abusers and therapy don't mix.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 25/07/2014 13:23

He obviously has a low opinion of women so I hardly think he will take on board any of the comments. He sees you as an object not as a person.

Do yourself a favour and LTB.

Imagine how simple life would be without his twattery.

Quitelikely · 25/07/2014 13:40

I wouldn't leave my husband if he dropped biscuit crumbs. I wouldn't leave him if we had different sex drives (we do) I say no and he accepts it like he would if I didn't want to wear sexy undies. I would make the effort for him though.

Your man can't up your sex drive by nagging you!

Unfortunately he has been savaged on here, called all sorts, if you had matching sex drives then I suppose he wouldn't be all the things people have described him as on here. Funny old world ain't it?

CogitoErgoSometimes · 25/07/2014 13:43

"if you had matching sex drives then I suppose he wouldn't be all the things people have described him as on here."

It's not a 'sex-drive mismatch' to be threatened with the end of a relationship for not wearing suspenders....Hmm It's bullying

NorthEasterlyGale · 25/07/2014 13:44

Good grief, what an entitled, self-centred, porn obsessed, misogynistic cockwomble your DH is.

Seriously, tell him not to let the door hit his arse on the way out.

He gets to keep the porn habit, the frilly drawers obsession and his bedroom 'standards' while you get freedom, time and space to be you and the ability to have people use plates for biscuits.

Get rid.

HolgerDanske · 25/07/2014 13:48

You have missed the point quite spectacularly, Quitelikely.

Preciousbane · 25/07/2014 13:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AntideluvianCat · 25/07/2014 14:05

No, No QuiteLikely - I like sex, I want sex, just not when I'm knackered and not when I'm being bullied and hectored into doing it a certain way all the time!

Yes, I did know about his porn use before we got married.

Also, I think I'm possibly coming across as a bit more passive than I actually am. I'm confident and assertive, and I generally won't do things that I don't want to do. For example: DH doesn't like the way I do laundry (I tend to overuse the tumble drier, so shoot me Blush ) therefore, I just do mine and DD's washing, my way, and leave him to do his own. On the other hand, I bake bread for him, because I enjoy it and he appreciates it, so win-win. I don't see myself as subservient, and nor does he.

Thanks for all your replies. It's thought provoking stuff.

OP posts:
AntideluvianCat · 25/07/2014 14:10

Also, I was a happily single parent for 9 years. I know what it's like to be totally independent and run the show. Being married brings a new set of challenges, but on balance, I prefer it.

I just want him to stop harrassing me and appreciate what he has.

OP posts:
BeCool · 25/07/2014 14:15

Has your H RTT yet? Is he going to post/engage with MN'ers on the matters you have raised?

AntideluvianCat · 25/07/2014 14:17

No, I haven't told him about it yet.

I don't think him being ripped to shreds on here would help me very much, tbh! Grin

OP posts: