Agressive parenting (originally posted in children's behaviour).

[SW8workingmum]

Hi, I am in a bit of a corner. 2 lovely children but the oldest boy is in trouble at school and interacts in a domineering way with his peers. I work full time so am not there for pick up and homework, have a nice aupair. His father loves them however he has no patience and shouts at them all the time. My son is always picking fights with his younger sister - normal stuff, but is it? The weekend before last his father reacted to this aggression by shouting that he would smash his face in if he carried on. To be honest this is extreme but I was absolutely horrified. How can a child grow up with the right messages with parenting like this? This morning he was telling my son that he was stupid for not trying harder with his spelling. (by the way he is not very nice to me either). I don't know how to handle it to be frank. Husband not an evil person but very needy and difficult. Feeling very ground down by it.

Well it sounds like your husband need to be called on his appalling attitude. How can a child learn to act appropriately when he sees his father behaving this way?

It would be worth seeking out parenting courses/family therapy or other external supports for both your husband and son, and also all of you as a family. There is probably a very negative dynamic at work within the home, and all of you need help to change this.

You need to get help urgently - your husband cannot be allowed to continue his abusive behaviour. If he will not do this willingly, then you as a mother owe it to your children to drive the changes.

I have read your other thread and the replies on that too.

I would agree with the overall consensus on there as well; your H is a bully and your son is mimicking the behaviour towards others that he is being shown by his Dad. Its extremely damaging for children to be any part of this and the way forward from this is to actually separate.

What your mother has commented is completely unhelpful at the least as well as totally irrelevant (her comments say an awful lot about her); she does not have to live day to day with the fallout from your H.

I doubt very much that your H knows what love is let alone love the children. Well you would like to think that he loves them but he truly does not. He sees them like you; mere possessions to use as he sees fit.

What if anything did you say to your H when he came out with the "smash his face in" comment to your son?. How did you react or did you do/say nothing?.

You cannot act like a deer caught in the headlights here; you are going to have to act to get this man out of yours and your children's day to day lives. Seek legal advice as to your options from a Solicitor asap.

Think too you've probably been waiting long enough now for him to supposedly improve; you do not have to make your bed and then lie in it as your mother is seemingly suggesting. Your children are getting the emotional fallout from their Dad's anger. Also you write this man is (unsurprisingly) not very nice to you either and is both needy and difficult. This is more than enough to grind any person down (that's what he wants; for everyone else to be as unhappy as he is).

He is dragging you and his children down with him. Living with the Dominator is no picnic for you or for them either. These men DO NOT ever change and he is well beyond going to any AM class; its too deeply rooted within them.

What sort of childhood do you want them to have?. Your son is already in trouble at school and that may well be due to his Dad's behaviour towards him at home too. His sister is also being affected by all this at home too.

Hi, OP, I was on your other thread and I really do feel for you.

One of things that struck me was where you indicated that because you feel pressured into not contemplating divorce by your family (your mother, I think it is), you feel there is little you can do. (Apologies if I've got that wrong.)

Well there is plenty you can do. You can put your husband on a warning to stop his aggression. You can get help via the school for your DCs; and see a solicitor and a counsellor (alone) for you. There is always the legal separation route.

So sorry you are having to go through this awful stuff

I haven't seen your other thread (but will look at it in a bit). This type of behaviour (along with a progression into physical abuse) is why I separated from my stbxh. And yes, he treats the DCs like they are possessions, that he can drop when something more interesting comes along or when he just can't be bothered, and then just pick up when he wants to show people what a good "dad" he is.

I also will point out that my dad used to call us stupid and things like that, and I am almost 50 and it still upsets me to hear someone call a child stupid. I can still feel how horrible it made me feel, and that (along with physical abuse) really messed with my head and affected me in many different ways. It is not a nice way to grow up.

Dear All, thanks for comments. Re recent outburst from my husband, well I was so horrified by it that I screeched at him there and then for saying it. Afterwards he admitted that he was ashamed about it. Every time I tell him to stop being so bad tempered and angry he says that I am the one that's bad tempered! He always throws it back at me. I am no victim believe me but sometimes I really do doubt myself. I do occasionally lose it but I am at my wits-end and when my son attacks my daughter I can't bear it. Nothing seems to sink in with son. But he is loving and sweet much of the time I just can't bear the thought of him growing up troubled and complicated. My daughter is a ray of sunshine and great fun - husband is much more indulgent of her.

What do you think you will do next?

Sorry to hear of your situation OP. Unfortunately the poster up thread who said these men never change was spot on. My STBXH is completely unable to help my DCs with their homework without shouting at them and upsetting them. I have regularly lost my temper with him, after trying to reason with him calmly, and I might as well talk to the wall for all the good it does. He is also needy and difficult, sums him up perfectly in fact. His ability to deny deny deny and blame has often left me feeling like I am losing my mind. No question that the DCs will be happier out of this environment. good luck

My dad was like this, albeit all the time with no redeeming features. I hated him so did my brothers. We begged our mum to divorce him. She wouldn't. He threw one of my brother down the stairs when he was 16, couldn't stand us being individuals. I left home asap and only saw him once a year. My other brother developed severe mental illness exacerbated by my dad's behaviour. I am shut at relationships and so is my surviving brother. Both of us have very little confidence in spite of being high ability. I do find it hard not to blame my childhood although I know none of it was our fault.

So your H is an agressive bully, used to domineering others, being agressive and threatening to get his own way.

And you wonder why your son's in trouble for exactly the same thing.

Meanwhile your little girl, and you probably, are subjected to violence and anger every single day.

Your H is abusing your son. What he's doing to your little boy is terrorising him. he in turn is powerless and unsupported, so the only way he can get rid of what he's being force fed, is to dish it out to others.

Your H needs to leave your home. As soon as possible and for as long as possible.

He needs therapy and to understand that he won't come back until he can behave like a human being.

You have to protect your children from this man. He probably won't change, but if you shock him now, by insisting he leave, he might just turn it around. Anything less, I can assure you that he won't.

I'm so sorry. I wish it wasn't this cut and dried, but it really is.

If you remove that man from your home, I guarantee that your son will show signs of improvement within weeks.

Weeks.

You can stop this horrible situation, you can change the future for your children. You have that power and you are the only one who can do this.

Look my husband is not a 'bad' man, he really isn't. It's hard to describe but I would say that he is immature rather than psyco. He is always in a bad mood this I find intolerable, maybe someone else would bring the best out in him? He has no patience, he is never happy and the rest of his family are basket cases. He is professionally very successful but always bored, I remember thinking in the early days that he would try and goad me if there was nothing much going on simply to get a reaction - bit like you would a sibling, but he is not physically abusive - never.
He is lazy, he is quite happy to let me unpack the shopping and sort the children out while he sits there watching TV. But his worst trait above the unpleasantness is his selfishness. The almost funny thing is though that he thinks he isn't! I will never forgive him for never letting me have even an hours break from the children while we were on 'holiday' when they were small. He would go and have a sleep by the pool leaving me to sort them out - every day - every holiday. How can you ever respect someone that cares so little about the welfare of their spouse? It's been a constant battle and I want out but I saw how toxic he was was with his first divorce (you might say why did you marry him) but he was so lovely with his first child, it was why I married him, he was more fun in those days too. So there is a good side to him but 14 years of incompatibility has worn me down and I hate the way he treats our son.

Look my husband is not a 'bad' man, he really isn't. It's hard to describe but I would say that he is immature rather than psyco

It's irrelevant whether he's screaming abuse at your children because he's a psycho or because he "immature." The words are the same whether they're delivered by a cunt or a "silly man." The volume is the same, the tone is the same, and guess what? The effect is the same.

"Look my husband is not a 'bad' man, he really isn't. It's hard to describe but I would say that he is immature rather than psyco. He is always in a bad mood this I find intolerable, maybe someone else would bring the best out in him? He has no patience, he is never happy and the rest of his family are basket cases. He is professionally very successful but always bored, I remember thinking in the early days that he would try and goad me if there was nothing much going on simply to get a reaction - bit like you would a sibling, but he is not physically abusive - never".

Making excuses like calling him "immature" does not wash; he is a grown man and makes choices. You;ve already called him selfish, needy and difficult so why have you stayed to date?. Has your mother unduly influenced you given her own biased views on divorce?.

He makes a conscious choice to abuse his current family unit. Your children get the backwash of his behaviours, they have no say and no choice. You can remain in denial if you want to but that poor choice will not help either you or your children, particularly your son.

If you find him in a bad mood all the time and thus intolerable do you seriously want your own self to keep on experiencing the same misery and for them to expect the same?. This man has been abusive from the very beginning - they do not have to hit you to hurt you. Why on earth did you marry this man at all?. His first divorce should have had you running fast in the opposite direction but you cannot now compound this mistake further now by staying with him.

Am not really surprised either to see that the rest of his family are as you so call them "basket cases"; the rotten apple you have in your H did not fall far from that overall rotten family tree. That was a huge red flag as well.

well, not much you have said about him suggests that there's much good about him, I'm afraid.

What you are seeing with your son is a taste of things to come - he is mimicking his father's aggressive and bullying behaviour. Your daughter is his victim. You are your H's victim, and in time could become your son's. Both children will normalize this behaviour and so the circle goes on.

Is that what you want for your children?

Sorry Op I haven't read your other thread. Do you have a link? You don't say how old your DS is or why he's in trouble with school?

Son is 7. He does behave better when it's just us, however he thinks his Dad is so great though, he will go to him in the mornings, perhaps it's to do with gaining approval?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/behaviour_development/2108104-Aggressive-parenting

Just because she is a ray of sunshine now, your DD is still going to look back at being targeted by her big brother and wish her parents had done something about it.

"Basket cases" or not your H isn't the first to grow up with a challenging or downright dysfunctional family. Goading loved ones isn't big or clever.

OP, things are only going to get worse unless you get away from this man. He is already ruining your doses life, making him think aggression is normal and seeking approval from a vicious bully. Do you want DS to be like his father ?

You owe it to your children to give them a secure and loving home. And you do not deserve to be subjected to his selfish, lazy and violent ways either.

I am sorry to be so harsh but this man is toxic and he is ruining your life and your DCs. Please , make a new start without him.

So, now you realise that your h is a deeply unpleasant man who is making you all miserable. His negative behaviour now manifests in your son.

What are you going to do about it? You need to take charge and protect your children.

Your DM can hold forth on divorce all she likes, does she not know the extent to which your H's behaviour is affecting her DGCs? The sort of "accepting and putting up with" long-suffering attitude to bullying spouses is maybe something her mother's generation adopted. "He's a good worker, he provides, he has no vices?" No just a nasty tongue and a quick temper.

If the school has picked up on DS's antagonism towards his peers do you feel it is time to tackle this? The root of this lies at home.

The thing I find so strange is that he has such good loyal friends and that he has had them for so long. Not really any woman though. I always thought that he was perhaps a bit daunted by them.

Daunted by women I mean - not by the friends.

He probably treats his friends well as he respects them. He doesn't respect you or your children though. I know it's daunting, truly I do, but you need to get him out of the family home. Your mothers opinion is irrelevant. You are a grown woman. You do not need your mothers approval, you need to protect your children.

If you asked him to leave what would he do? How are your finances?

How many friends would your H have if he treated them the way he treats your son? You? Your daughter?

You are now enabling your H to completely fuck up the life of your ds and your dd.

If you're not prepared to protect them, give them up, please? They'd have a better chance with another parent than the one they have with a parent that allows this horrific behaviour to continue when they know it's doing damage.

You are the only one who can stop history repeating itself here.

He's so successful, then he can rent somewhere else for 6m to give you all a breather, get your ds back as he should be; not growing up emulating his angry, brooding, intimidating father.

Do it now, before SS end up being alerted to the real reason he's behaving as he is in school.

Scroll ahead 10 years when your son is 17 and your DH cannot intimidate him so easily. Do you want to imagine what your son's behaviour will be?

Then scroll ahead 20 years. You have lived your life with an aggressive bully. That is not normal. You could have a relationship with a man who smiles every time he sees
You, tells you he loves you every day, and cares about you and wants you to be happy. (This is not I unusual).