Is it me? huge row over a fucking steak

[Blueberrybanana]

I've name changed for this.

Dh and I are trying to stick to a tight budget for our food etc at the moment. We've got ourselves into a bit of a (manageable) rut with debt and we've worked out a budget and need to stick to it. Our budget isn't tiny - it's over £100 for the week.

Today we went to the supermarket together as we passing and we had about £5 left of our budget to spend. Dh stopped in front of the steak bit and normally we would think nothing of bunging a couple in the basket.

Without thinking - and more because I was feeling it would be nice and feeling sad we couldn't afford them - I said to him "oh I don't think we can get those today" and he basically went off on one saying he hadn't even said anything and apparently I talked to him like a child!

I really don't think I did :( I was just stating a fact. He says he hadn't even said anything and I jumped on him. I know he didn't say anything but he stopped and looked at them and we would normally get them so I assumed he was going to suggest we get them.

The whole way home we argued with each other. He is saying that I am condescending and treat him like a child and so on.

I came home and cried in the kitchen. I feel like he is bullying me because if I say the wrong thing he just leaps at me (verbally) and has a go at me and it goes on for days even if I say sorry (which I did)..was I in the wrong?

He stormed off out of the house to work taking off his wedding ring like he always does in an argument and i'm just feeling so shit about everything.

Help.

GREAT advice from RODGETTE.

You know what? We can all say things that rub our partners up the wrong way. They can overreact a bit because they are annoyed. But this situation is very very different.

What you said wasn't abusive. It may well have been a bit condescending in tone but you explained what you meant in a non-abusive way and apologised (for not actually saying anything wrong at all). But to be honest it sounds to me like you could have said anything and he would have behaved like that. His first reaction was over the top which strikes me that you actually hit the nail on the head with your assumption. But to continue this argument all the way home and then storm out and now probably continue to sulk for days with the expectation that you will run around and grovel to him is just fucking horrible. It goes way past an unreasonable one-off reaction to something you said.

I refer you to AnyFucker's post of Sat 31May 20:56. This is systematic behaviour that is repeated. It will not change. He will not change. The question is can you put up with this shit for the rest of your life. And your children (if you have any)? I know what it's like to live with a sulking father. It's not pleasant. Everyone ends up walking on eggshells.

I'm sorry you are going through this .

Let's say you actually did something wrong (which you didn't), given that you apologised, your husband had a CHOICE, ie to accept the apology or not. He chose not to - in fact from the sounds of it every time he CHOOSES to force you to give apology after apology until you are scared to ever 'wrong' him again. He gets off on the power of it.

Now, there's a slim slim slim chance he doesn't 100% realise what he's doing. So next time just apologise once, and then get on with things as normal.

If he takes his wedding ring off just say 'I wish you wouldn't do that.' but don't comment further.

Part of me thinks it would be amusing to take yours off too but could just escalate things.

He's got to stop thinking he has this power over you to humiliate you whenever he wants.

Thank you very much for all your replies.

I don't know how on earth I got into such a mess to be honest. I have been married before and that ended when he left me for someone else and he completely vanished. When I met dh sometime later he seemed to be on the same wave as me.. a lot of my problems with previous husband were about money in that he never wanted to share it etc and the one thing dh and I do have going for us is that we both share all our money, we have equal spending money and a joint account and I can spend whatever I like without having to answer to him and vice versa. The only thing we do watch is the food because we both like to eat a lot (despite neither of us being overweight) and we love good food. So we need to cut back and that's causing tensions.

I'm not stingy with the food. He can have whatever he likes as long as we don't go over the budget. Same here for me. He wanted to come to the supermarket with me. I didn't force him to come. We had been out somewhere else and needed some sugar on the way home and I'd actually suggested we both get a small treat each as we had £5 spare. Then all the steak business came into it.

Fair enough I may have said it wrong. Maybe I didn't need to say anything. But regardless of that I didn't deserve him to go on at me.

The arguments are not always about food. It can be anything. Usually completely random nonsense that I didn't even realise would piss him off. Often about my mum - she is rather toxic I admit and I have distanced her from us as much as I can and I can see why I need to but I cannot cut her out completely and dh absolutely hates her and we argue about it a lot. Sometimes I feel like telling him to fuck off just so I can deal with things how I feel is best without him having a go at me all the time.

I never tell him I'm dependent on him. If anything we are as much as each other. When we brought our house I put a huge amount of equity into it due to having a previous very high paying job so we have a small mortgage and this is one of the reasons I am determined not to work when we are in this situation because in a way I would be buying my house twice. In a way by working he is paying for his share of the property (I did not have a mortgage before).

If I asked him to leave I know all hell would break loose and he would be an absolute nightmare to live with. I'm actually scared he would take the dc and disappear. I cannot claim housing benefit while my name is on this house. I feel truly stuck. Despite my health problems I am going to try to work part time when ds starts nursery but that is some way off yet as we do not qualify for childcare help so have to wait till he is 3 and we have no family help.

I have told dh that I am very angry with him (I wouldn't have before speaking on here but I now realise I need to stand up for myself more). I said removing his ring was passive aggressive and nasty.

He then did his usual "leave me then... If I'm so horrible just leave me".

I walked off and let him stew for a bit. He then texted me from downstairs (this was last night) and said he was sorry but I make him so angry sometimes and he doesn't mean any significance by removing the ring he just thinks why would someone like me want to he with someone like him so he's giving me the option of out ! What the fuck!

I told him he makes me feel like I have to watch what I say all the time and if I so much as put a foot wrong he is on me like a ton of bricks. He said I always try to make everything about him.

Then he said he was sorry.

I'm exhausted and fed up. I really am. It's just like this all the time and I feel like we go round in circles.

He's at work today all day so I have time to myself (with dc) and it's nice to have some peace. Surely I shouldn't feel like that?!

No, you shouldn't. But...

....When we brought our house I put a huge amount of equity into it due to having a previous very high paying job so we have a small mortgage and this is one of the reasons I am determined not to work when we are in this situation because in a way I would be buying my house twice. In a way by working he is paying for his share of the property (I did not have a mortgage before). ....... (My italics.)

That's pretty revealing, Blueberry. 'My house' and 'his share' ? It sounds like you don't trust him at all and while that is no excuse for his foul treatment of you it may go some way towards explaining his attitude. What baggage have you brought to this relationship from the previous one?

I understand what you're saying but to be honest it's just the recent arguing that is making me feel that way. If anything i feel like I've been hugely trusting because the house is in both our names equally because i wanted to share everything with him as i feel you should in a marriage. None of this yours and mine thing. But as things have gone on and we are arguing more I find I am very angry and feel I have fewer options because of my own generosity if that makes sense.

I've always been fiercely independent. Until now really... or am I still. I don't know really.

You say you want to share everything but that's not how it sounds. Sounds like you resent him coming along and bringing a mortgage into your life? You expect this to be solely his responsibility? It sounds like the teamwork aspect is an issue on both sides with underlying issues. If the mortgage is small I don't understand why you feel trapped, unless you are determined to hold on to the lions share of the equity?

I have been in a volatile but essentially happy relationship for over a decade, and some of what you have said sounds familiar- except I would not put up with being ignored or treated like that for a few days.

We do blow up over silly things, sometimes serious things, I am as likely to do it as him, and it usually relates to other stress in our lives, mainly work and money.

My husband might do exactly that if I felt I was interfering in the supermarket, equally I'm likely to snap at him if I feel he's telling me what to do.

I think this type of relationship can be fun and passionate, and you do say elsewhere you get on very well, but you need to learn how to argue constructively and how to end these blow-ups quickly, not let them drag on for days. I found Gottman's work on different types of relationships very helpful as he says not everyone has the same 'type' and each have their disadvantages or advantages- for example, a more placid friendship type might be much calmer but less passionate, a volatile one can become too volatile and the love/respect lost and so on.

In this situation, I would have looked at my behaviour, and if I felt it was out of order (hard to tell from what you've said, his certainly was) I would apologise- ONCE. I would then go about my business, don't cry, don't fuss, if he wants to turn it into WW3, call him on it. Say 'I've apologised about that, let's move on' and don't indulge or take any notice of what others have said is toddler behaviour. He will soon realise that it's pointless ignoring you/taking off his wedding ring if you don't react to it. Step out of the vicious circle. Definitely say nothing about the ring, if he asks you about it say 'that's your choice' and leave it at that. Hopefully you will learn to move to saying sorry/not letting things escalate much quicker.

If you don't think he is capable of change or you think he would escalate his bad behaviour, that's more serious and I would be thinking through your exits. It does sound quite bad that you are already treading on eggshells around him- I would stop that immediately and see what happens, you can't live like that forever and better find out the measure of the man and deal with it- the egg-shell treading sounds awful.

I don't think you and he are a desperate case, or at least not as yet. I think you need to find yourself and find your voice again and stop apologizing to him. I think he is trampling all over your opinions and feelings because he can. Now it has gotten in a rut and you two go through the same motions again and again. You need to chnage the dynamic in your relationship. You can't change him but you can change yourself. I suggest you think out how you are going to tackle these situations in future and you carry out your plan. If you change your responses, his behaviour may well change too.

I suppose I am frightened of being left worse off than when I came into this - as this is what happened to me with my first husband and also my first long term partner before that. I feel like I'm too trusting and end up losing financial security having to pay people off. I realise that makes me sound like an absolute arse but the reality of it is when I first moved in with my first long term partner I had 3 times the equity I have now. That would have provided me with a lot of security in the financial sense long term especially given the health conditions I now have.

So yes I suppose I do feel, given the current arguments and so on, quite frightened about the prospect of let again losing another wedge of my financial security should this go belly up. I feel I have only myself to blame for being so naive in many ways.

I think dh has a really nasty temper and he seems to have a red mist descend and not now how to stop it. The first real row we had was when I was 8 months pregnant and he was annoyed I wanted to go out with dd when he didn't really fancy it so I went to go out without him and got in the car with dd and he stood there shouting at me in front of dd while holding open the car door. Dd was 8. I don't think I have ever really forgiven him for that but I was in a vulnerable place being heavily pregnant, no other family help and booked in for a c section so I had to bury it and get on with him and it's continued being bad on and off since really. We just don't argue in front of the children. But there is an atmosphere when we do.

Thank you for all your comments and advice. I've cross posted with some. I will take them all on board and try out the suggestions. Thank you very much.

Ds is waking up from his nap now so I'll come back to this later.

It sounds worse than the steak incident. If you think it is unsustainable, I would get some legal advice about where you would stand if you split just in case. It won't hurt to do so.

The first real row we had was when I was 8 months pregnant

He is a bully, and an abuser.

You need to get rid.

Also- to me a row is where you both get a bit heated and end up arguing over something, both trying to get your point across.

Him shouting at you in front of your dd and when you are pregnant is not a row, it's scary.

OP - he doesn't blow up because you said x or y, he does it because he's an angry bully. The anger is inside and gets triggered by minor external events, which he justifies to himself as worthy of his ire. Posters on here always recommend 'Why does he do that' by Lundy Bancroft.

I think you have been immensely trusting, personally I would never effectively give someone half a house, if I had put most of the equity into it. As others have suggested, I would get legal advice on where you stand. Then you know when your options are.

The fact that you are afraid of 'all hell breaking loose' and that he might try and take the children is telling.

Agree with twinkle its not about what you say but who he is. You could stop talking and I bet he would find something to kick off about.

He sounds awful. That last thing you said about him standing over you, at 8 mths pregnant and in front of your DD, and shouting...that is so sad.

Yes it is sad. And I know it was wrong of him to do that. Hence I can't forgive him for that. It was scary. I can't even totally remember the ins and outs of it. I just remember him really shouting at me and then slamming the door and him going in the house and shouting again. He used to bang the door frames so hard the paint would shatter / flake off. I drove off with dd that day and we tried to have a nice time regardless. He hasn't been like that in front of the dc again but once was bad enough.

I need to remember it's not what I'm saying. I get so involved in him saying it's me I start to think it is. I was bullied badly at school, so badly I changed schools and I feel like that again. Constantly on edge and anxious.

A solicitor is a good idea. Not sure how I could keep it secret though. He opens all our post including things addressed to me. He doesn't see it as being controlling, just thinks because we are married we do everything together therefore no need not to.

I am still angry with him. I need to let it go though as tomorrow he's agreed to look after ds all day so dd and I can have a day together in the city. Our first day out together for about a year. Means a lot to me and I don't want to have an atmosphere for her before we go. Or come back to more stress. He's very good with ds and i'm finding ds very difficult (typical toddler stuff ) so it will be nice to have a break.

I feel like I can't even look at dh now though. I think this has just broken me.

Just tell the solicitor not to send anything to your home address. Simples. My solicitor was very discrete as default.

He opens your mail - WTAF. Who actually does that???

The Lundy Bancroft book opened my eyes to what was happening to me. It is a fantastic book. It saved me. Maybe you could read it and see if it resonates with you.

By the way protecting yourself financially is totally understandable. Why shouldn't you.

That confusion you feel is part of the abuse. The book gives great examples of this.
It was so comforting for me to see that it wasn't me at all. Its CRAZYMAKING when they say it's you.

Sending you lots of love xxxx

blueberry this is no way to live, and a terrible atmosphere to bring up your children. You are being abused.
Get out.
Call women's Aid, they have lots of practical help to help you leave and ease the process.

I'd also suggest you call Womens Aid 0808 2000 247. You seem very fearful and with good reason, but that's not how a healthy relationship is conducted. Calls to WA do not show up on phone bills if that would be a concern. They can listen to your story, confirm that it is an abusive relationship, and recommend a solicitor who has experience in cases where domestic abuse is a factor.