'Why doesn't she just leave?'... extreme example why not

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-27508752

The story of a 25yo woman in the US, abducted at 15 and recently rediscovered is in the news today. Thought it was a good example for anyone who is witness to an abusive relationship (or even in one) and who is baffled why the victim doesn't just up and leave. As with some previous similar cases, the woman in this instance wasn't locked and chained when found. Their 'prison' may have been physical initially but it became a psychological one of fear, isolation and misinformation. Common themes for victims of DV. Worth thinking abut.

Yummy - this thread is upsetting me too . I'm so sorry you've been through what you have, and that it continues to go on. I've been through similar and, although I've left physically, his abuse and control over me will continue until the day I die.

For Jan to think that makes me unworthy of having children has set off triggers for me, and I'm feeling worse now than I have done in years. I wish people would think before they post .

I agree that until you are in that position, it is best not to judge.

I was a victim of EA and slight DV in my early 20's. I was not scared of him. He made me feel utterly worthless in every possible way. I felt that I deserved it as I was a pathetic person who could not do anything right.

I was so ashamed that I tolerated it for so long. Only dh knows as I trust him not to use it against me - he never has. Could not bear for anyone else to view me differently.

My ex was handsome and appeared nice. 7 months into the relationship he;

Kicked me off of his bed on a regular basis

Slapped me with a towel

Ordered me to the spare room when I annoyed him

He laughed and smiled when I broke down in tears which was often

Said I looked dopey

Compared me to his friend's partners

Questioned why I did not drive a newer car (meanwhile he had not passed his test)

Gaslighted me

Manipulated me

I got out with my self esteem ripped to shreds. I would not wish what I experienced on anyone.

I agree that until you are in that position, it is best not to judge.

I was a victim of EA and slight DV in my early 20's. I was not scared of him. He made me feel utterly worthless in every possible way. I felt that I deserved it as I was a pathetic person who could not do anything right.

I was so ashamed that I tolerated it for so long. Only dh knows as I trust him not to use it against me - he never has. Could not bear for anyone else to view me differently.

My ex was handsome and appeared nice. 7 months into the relationship he;

Kicked me off of his bed on a regular basis

Slapped me with a towel

Ordered me to the spare room when I annoyed him

He laughed and smiled when I broke down in tears which was often

Said I looked dopey

Compared me to his friend's partners

Questioned why I did not drive a newer car (meanwhile he had not passed his test)

Gaslighted me

Manipulated me

I got out with my self esteem ripped to shreds. I would not wish what I experienced on anyone.

Jan - what makes you think that leaving puts an end to the abuse? My ex-h's abuse of me and our Dd escalated after I left him.

Surely the safety of your children is paramount so by leaving at least you are doing something to protect them.

Jock: please don't feel like that, I am commenting on one post made above which is an extreme example of DV - in this instance the children were removed from the mother because SHE was see as unfit, I agree with this.

Double post

Threads like this instantly transport me back to the worst times. They still play out in my mind like they where yesterday.

People viewing victims of DV as being weak is one of the reasons I never told my family about it. I didn't want to be perceived as being weak or pathetic for staying. How wrong it that!

CurtWild excellent post at the beginning of the thread."Erosion and dependence" is a great phrase. I often struggle explain it, I may now borrow that.

Jan I'm tempted to tell you just to fuck off to the far side of fuck. But instead what I will tell you is you just. Don't. Get. It.

Abuse doesn't just happen. It's built up, and even when the physical damage is huge, the psychological damage is worse. It happens slowly, until eventually it's bad, and you don't realize how bad, and you don't know how to get out. Sometimes they will threaten to take your children away, beat them, kill them or you, and it seems the only way to protect your children is to stay and be abused, because if you're taking it, at least they're not.

If only every victim of abuse had the support and resources available to leave as soon as it happened. If only.

I suggest you learn some empathy, thank the stars for how lucky you've been, and don't pass judgement on situations you have no scope to understand.

Jan, are you reading the replies ?

letter I've done a lot of soul searching since I left 3 months ago - and a lot of it was hard to face. But erosion and dependence were the two words that came back to me again and again.

Like you say, it doesn't start out bad, it's insidious, psychological damage, interspersed with charm and sweetness so we think perhaps we're imagining it, perhaps we're at fault. And then one day you realise how bad it is, for whatever catelyst, and you struggle to fathom how it got that bad. How a smart, confident, strong woman, is suddenly this exhausted, fearful, downtrodden creature.

I didn't want that mummy for my babies, they deserved the very best I could be. And so as cog said earlier, because I care more about my children than I do about myself, I left. And I'd rather stay alone forever than risk giving them any less than the best of me again.

LettertoHerms: I really don't care what you think of me but whether you like it or not I have my opinion and it's based on ONE example of severe DV where the mother was allowing her b/f to beat her black and blue in front of her children, he then went on to rip out her 5 year old's testicles - in this instance I do believe the mother failed to protect her children and obviously so did the authorities and that is why the children were removed and not allowed to stay with her.

No, allowing the abuser to look after them unaided is not protecting them.

I am passing judgement on one post if you bothered to even read.

I have plenty empathy, especially for the poor children who have no fucken choice but to suffer it.

As for leaving as soon as it happened, this woman was being battered for a year before he turned on her child, the children were removed from her care because she was seen as an unfit mother - good.

If you can't understand why I agree with this then I suggest you learn that children are innocent.

When I was in an abusive relationship I was so dependant on him and thought I was so 'in love' with him that I never would have left. He threw me out and I begged him to have me back. They fuck you up.
It was only months later that I realised how dysfunctional and abusive that relationship was and I thank every day that he did chuck me out.

Surely the safety of your children is paramount so by leaving at least you are doing something to protect them

No, Jan, you're still not getting this are you? After I left my ex-h, he broke into my flat in the middle of the night and raped me at knifepoint while my 2yo Dd begged him not to kill me. This happened not once, but six times. My Dd went to four different primary schools as we moved around trying to hide from him. He found us every time, and the violence got worse every time - much, much worse than what I endured whilst I was living with him and under his control. My now grown up Dd vividly remembers me, her mother, being brutally raped over and over again - in our home, where we were supposed to be safe .

So, Jan, just stop with this naive drivel you're spouting about something you know nothing about. It's horrifically distressing for those of us who have lived this.

I think you're confusing two things Jan45. One is the kind of oppressive, fear/power-based dynamic where perfectly good people are trapped in a cycle of abuse, believe there is no way out, and fail to protect their children as a result. Another is where neglect and abuse is the result of both parents enabling each other and not caring for the children in the slightest. I'm thinking of people like Karen Matthews. Yes, the children deserve to be saved in both instances but it is less easy to blame the first parent.

Jesus, Jock :(

You really don't understand jan, victim blaming is not the way forward.

Surely the safety of your children is paramount so by leaving at least you are doing something to protect them

Please read my last post.

Jock: all I can say is I am sorry you and your child suffered such horrific violence, I am not commenting in general on DV or what you yourself have suffered, I am commenting on one post re a woman in the USA, her children were taken from her, yours were not because you were not seen as a threat to them, she was.

If my agreeing with what happened in this one situation makes you think I am sprouting naïve drivel then I don't actually think you are understanding my point.

Don't worry, I've had enough of my comments being construed and made out to mean I don't give a fuck about women who are abused, all rubbish, of course I do, I'm a woman too you know and yes of course I've had DV in my life and that of my sister and some of my friends so I'm not actually devoid of any feelings or sympathy.

Anyway, I won't post anymore as it's not fair that my point is being used as a means to beat me up about what other folk have gone through.

No, Jan, what you said was that any woman who allowed herself to be beaten black and blue in front of her child, and then have the perpetrator turn on the child, wasn't worthy of having children. That would include me, then.

jock and jock's DD How horrific for you both.

So at what point should the woman break up what she perceives as a happy home, take the father away from the kids? There's normally a slow escalation and such manipulation that the first argument, first hit, first controlling action is explained away. Then suddenly months/ years later it's an awful lot worse and you've no money no support network.

Of course you should pick up your kids and run as far as you can but it's not that simple.

Of course you should pick up your kids and run as far as you can but it's not that simple.

^this^

^^ Exactly. LTB is easy to say but not as easy to do. Some of us manage it, many more want to but don't know how. Not because they're stupid, but because the sheer schematics of it on top of an already exhausted body and mind are just too much to formulate. You read it over and over on here. Women asking how to leave. Women feeling like monsters for breaking up the family. Women living in fear and even more afraid of what will happen if they leave.

Jan45, do you wonder why nobody here seems to understand your point?
Either you are explaining it very badly or it's wrong.

jan45 might technically be correct that the woman did have responsibility towards the kids and should have got out. Despite the fact that, you know, .. it was the man hitting the poor little boy for the first time. And she took him to A and E.

But my god, I hope no one ever goes to her for help if they are in need.

Black and white judgementalism isnt going to help anyone actually going through it or who's been through it.

A bit of pragmatic understanding and help'd be a shit load more useful to people who've been through it or are going thru it now or who have to live with the appalling memories.

So sorry for the appalling experience of the people on this thread.

Unfortunately with all the cutbacks in social welfare it is going to be increasingly harder for women to leave their abusive husbands. Apart from the emotional problem of taking such a decision, there are practicalities of where are you and your children going to live and how you are going to feed them that can sometimes be insurmountable.

"why doesn't he just stop?" is a better q