I'm still so very angry, but I'm supposed to be grateful. Should I be?

[NeedToMovePassedThis]

The background is that I fell in stupid-teen love at the age of 17 with a 21 year old. He proposed, I said yes, then (very accidentally) got pregnant. I had never wanted dcs. Not ever. And had always thought I would have an abortion in these circumstances. But I found I couldn't. That I loved my dc. My fiancé encouraged me to keep the baby. I still lived at home (halfway through my straight-A-Student A levels).

I told my dm and ddad and they were shocked, upset and encouraged me to have an abortion. I stuck by my decision. A week after finding out my fiancé dumped me (charmer that he was, that's a whole other thread), told me he doubted the baby was his, and that was the last I ever saw of him.

My parents let me stay at home. Which I am grateful for. I paid them rent. They said very firmly that they would look after me, but not the baby. Which is fair enough.

I left my A levels, dm and ddad said I couldn't live there if I wasn't studying or had a job. I applied for work. Went through a few humiliating interviews as the visibly pregnant teen (unsurprisingly didn't get the jobs), and then found a free secretarial course to do, so did that until the week before ds was born.

Dm and ddad made it clear they were ashamed of me. They made lots of snide comments, told me how many of their friends had told them to kick me out, would say things like, "so and so looked at me funny today, that was because of you".

I knew they found it hard so didn't say anything.

I couldn't cope with the smell of smoke, but ddad insisted that if I opened the chimney up all the heat went out, so he'd close it down to have smoke billowing into the room. So I couldn't sit with them. My room had no heating, so I'd try to stay warm in bed.

When I was 8 and a half months pregnant we went to a party as a family. Me and my younger brother wanted to leave early (about 1am) as we were exhausted. It was only a 20 minute walk home, but it was too far for me with SPD. Ddad said he'd drive us back. He was hammered. I couldn't argue, but said I would drive us there and he could drive back. He wouldn't give me the keys.

He then drive me and dbro home. He sped, he turned corners sharply whilst laughing, he kept slamming on the brakes because I was screaming for him to stop. I was terrified. I got out of the car and he sped off. I just burst into to tears and said to dbro that he would never drive another heavily pregnant woman like that :(

Then ds was born and he was my whole world. I'd never had someone to love like that, I'd never felt loved. It was hard. I was alone. All my friends had just gone off to uni. I did all the nights alone. Ds wouldn't breast feed and I desperately wanted him to. Dm went on and on about how important it was (he had no sucking reflex at all), I expressed for as long as I could but he never ever latched on. At 3 months a bfing counsellor came out and just said "you have no milk, he has no urge, you know this, why am I here?" Then she clicked and said, "ah, you want me to tell your mother, don't you?" And she did. Because dm didn't believe I couldn't.

I did all the night feeds. All of them. They would hold him so I could have a bath if they were in.

I was also a teenager who definitely didn't help around the house as much as I should have. Looking back I think they expected me to be cooking and cleaning straight away, and I didn't do much. I helped where I could. But there was so much, and they never asked me to do anything. But as an adult, with distance, it's clear I wasn't meeting expectations.

I became very lonely and depressed. There were no groups for teen parents, and I couldn't bring myself to go to baby groups. I knew what people thought of me. They thought what my parents thought. That I was scum.

I had one aim. Go back to college, finish a levels, get to uni. Then they will be proud. So I did. When ds was a few months old I got him into a nursery and went to college. College were brilliant and I could even bring ds if I couldn't afford the childcare. dm looked after him one day a week.

I paid rent with the benefits I received. My parents told me how proud they were of my older sister for not going on benefits when she was between jobs.

I got good a levels. I got into a Russell group uni, and ds and I moved 300 miles away.

Now here's the thing. Whilst I was there my aunt complimented my dm on how well she was raising ds in front of me . Dm took the compliment. I always get comments about how amazing and supportive my parents were. And how lucky I was. And it brings out this enormous anger. They were horrible! They made me feel like shit. I was so ashamed of who I was. I spent the first 9 months of ds's life waking up crying because I wished I'd died in the night. I told dm I thought I needed ADs. She didn't believe in ADs :( so I never went to the gp. She booked me a homeopathy appointment, gave me a load of scare stories about ADs and that was it.

I've always suffered from anxiety. I tried to kill myself when I was 11. Walked out into a lake and lay in it face down. But then pictured my dm finding me, and couldn't make her sad. So went home. No one noticed I was soaked. No one spoke to me.

But now I am in a good place. After the clichéd first abusive marriage that I escaped after 15 years, I now have a wonderful, kind dh. I have 3 beautiful dcs. I have a wonderful lifestyle. My parents are brilliant with the gcs. Although it cut me deeply when dbro and his wife moved in with them for 6 months when their ds2 was born, and I found out they helped with night feeds, they lived there rent free (despite earning 80k+) and no one made any comments about how dsil wasn't really parenting her dcs.

So how do I get rid of this anger? Am I right to be angry? Do I have that right? They didn't throw me out. Everyone says how amazing they are. No one ever compliments me on my parenting. They'll tell me how lucky I am to have such easy, nice dcs ( because that just happened by accident and they're in no way normal children).

I feel like this is holding me back from enjoying my parents as they now are. I feel history has been rewritten. I was alone so much as a child. I was bullied physically and emotionally by my older sister (locked me in sheds tied up for hours, tried to drown me, beat me, loads and loads of nasty things). We now get on ok, but she is snide and cutting towards me a lot.

The couple of times I've tried to speak to family about it, dbro for example, they leap straight to how much I owe my parents. Although he did remember the drink driving and said that was out of order.

If I spoke to dm she would sob and say I think she's terrible and I would end up comforting her. The one time I tried to talk to them about dsis's bullying, dm just looked at ddad and said, "that always really upset you, ddad, didn't it?" And no one acknowledged my hurt at all. They just said it was normal sibling rivalry.

Sorry about the essay. But... Help. Please.

Help me move on.

Hands to hold are goodto o (see what I did there?)

Oh god the kicked animal analogy :( I found a diary entry of mine from when I was still with XH, it read, "why do I stay? You kick a dog this many times, even it would stop coming back"

Simile, dc1 gets all the attention. Dbro's dc1 gets most of all.

After she had criticised dc2 "energy" for the umpteenth time (not in his hearing), I said that I love all my dcs equally, but that dc2 was so constantly interesting that he could entertain me forever. She told me off for having favourites!

Oh yes, I see the irony. I said that it wasn't favouritism, it was seeing the best in all the dcs.

She does spend time with them all, and there is an age gap which means they have different needs. But I've always been conscious of the view that dc2 is "difficult" (he's not, he's normal, dc1 was rather angelic, dc2 is normal).

Dc2 is me. So very very like me. Even matches some of my mannerisms. Dc1 is very very similar to dbro.

I will never raise a dsis. Never. I will teach my dcs that empathy is the best value of all. And self worth and self belief too.

And I will pray XH doesn't tear that apart.

Gussy, not being entitled to those feelings resonates.

Mine told everyone how she came to get me and bring me home from that abusive relationship.

She came in 2008, for a 10 day holiday.

I came home over a year later, on my own.

If I ever mentioned DV, she talks about her friend who suffered from it. If I mentioned having a bad day (nothing any more graphic than that) i'd literally not hear a squeak from her in 2, often 3 WEEKS.

Good riddance. I'll never ever see any of them again, for any reason. Death included.

I would find it hard to let go of that anger, too. I think you need to realise what a strong person it's made you, though; not many people could have achieved what you have on your own - you should be incredibly proud of that.

Gussy?! Bloody hissy!! Sorry

Thank you spearmint :)

I suppose what I don't know is what other people are being told. That's not the family way. We don't talk about that sort of thing (apart from dsis), we show a front and an image, but we don't tell people. I can't imagine dm telling anyone about the dv.

After an occurrence long after we'd split, when XH turned up uninvited at my dparents' house when he knew we were there (I hid with the dcs and they never knew he was there), and they chatted to him nicely and got him a drink. After he'd left I told them I wasn't happy and they should have told him to leave. Dm said she couldn't do that, he was the dcs father and they had to have a cordial relationship with him.

I decided to tell dm that one of the reasons I couldn't cope with being around him was because he raped me (without violence). I'd just finished telling her when dsis came in. Dm said, "you should tell dsis too", I didn't want to but felt I was left with no choice. She said "oh dear that's terrible" but then added how he was just like all men really, thinking they own you, and somehow it got on to dm nodding in sympathy with dsis talking about her abusive relationship she'd had as a teen. I was left feeling deflated, betrayed and told I was overreacting. Again.

You know the truth, they choose to deny it. You are the better person (and definitely the better Mum) without a doubt.

You now, needto, all I see here is someone justifying their behaviour. And I don't mean that in a nasty way, but you are SO used to doing it, to yourself, to them, to others, that it is all you know.

Do they turn up late for everything, or only stuff that concerns you?

The way you talk about your mums reaction when you locked the bathroom door - she has such a huge disregard for you & your personal space & somehow you see that as your problem. And it really isn't!!

MY sister deleted me from her fb & her daughter's (x2) because I told her she was being nasty to our niece (and she was). That was a few years ago & we haven't spoken since.

I know for a fact that she posts those sayings about family being all you need, forgive & forget your family etc. She is always making statuses saying how she is always there for family, how fmaily is more important than anything. Her friends think she is bloody wonderful..and while they are all agreeing with her & kissing her arse & sucking up to her, she is. But you dare tell her she is wrong (and again, she is, on many things...she is very ignorant of a lot of things) and that is it! You are enemy #1. And that is what I did. Very much like my mother in that respect, my sister. So now there are 2 people who I no longer have contact with & OMG, my life is SO much easier. I really think she did me a favour.

The fear thing, I get too. You act like you aren't scared because you think that they will admire you, need you. It helps you gain that approval you want. They don't normally 'see' you, yet you need to be their saviour.

When I was 15 we were burgled. We were all at home except my sister (staying at a friends). My mum went to pieces. My sister did too. Yet I stayed strong. I called the police!!! I called my sister to tell her to come home. I called my mum's friend (it later came out that they had been having an affair). I was strong for them, but inside I was crapping it that they would come back & take the rest of the our stuff.

I ended up on sleeping tablets (they didn't work, I fought them, dr refused to give me more, suggested counselling), almost had to see a therapist, but I cancelled it because mum refused to come with me & I didn't know what to expect. My school bag was stolen, but she refused to tell my school that I wasn't lying & I got into trouble for not doing work.

I am still scared now of being broken into again. Because I was never allowed to resolve my feelings surrounding it. She still lives in the house, although she says it haunts her everyday. I live thousands of miles away & I still have nightmares & leave my lights on & hate sleeping alone. I hate opening closed doors if we have been out & I cannot sleep behind a closed door if at home.

That is a typical way in which a narcissist makes it all about them. I was always wrong. She was always right, even when I was 15 & scared, she was more scared. In that position it was up to her to comfort me & then fall apart with my dad, not expect me to comfort her.

I'm sorry, op...really not trying to make this about me

In situations like these, we can't always see that the treatment we received was heinous. When we see how others react to our stories, or hear those of others it makes us realise how things we thought were normal, aren't.

Oh different :(. Shared stories very much appreciated. You poor thing. I am so very sorry you had to be so strong. And you are amazing. You really are. At 15 you got on with the important stuff and sorted it all out. I'm in awe.

For me, out of all of them, it's dm who is the most loving and supportive. Although I sympathise with the school thing.

They are late for everything except work and see the problem as being with the person who objects. I have such anxiety surrounding being late, that I remember not being able to breath in the car when mum dropped us off at school, after I'd begged her to add time to the drive to take into account morning traffic. She didn't. I was, of course, ridiculous for caring. We were once an hour late for a dental appointment and there was much polite outrage at the fact they cancelled the appointments.

Ddad is the one I fall out with most. Everyone's always said it's because we're so similar. Thinking about that, I think dsis started that one. We're not.

Dh still says he'll do whatever I need. I don't know what I need. Yes I will stop relying on them. I will make sure I never plan family meals with both dbro and dsis (oh god, that was a huge mistake, in my defence I actually only invited dbro and he suggested inviting dsis, but next time the answer is no), despite trying over and over, dh and I were pretty much blanked. That was a fun fortune to spend on a terrible time. Oh and they all went back to dsis's house afterwards. We weren't invited. Or rather it was timed so that I had just made some excuse to get away "oh we really must get back and let the dog out", and then dsis said, "that's a shame, dbro do you want to come back to mine?"

Dsis also told ds recently when he opened up about his biological dad who he has never met and who never paid a penny that, "you mustn't be too hard on him. He was only
21 when it happened. That's really young and so you can't blame him". Young?! I was 17, alone and penniless! What about me?!

Actually I really do need to stop him going to hers. Or at least make sure he knows not to listen to her.

OP as far as your parents and siblings are concerned, you are on the rl side of Alice's looking glass, the strange reality they believe exists is not yours.

You will bring up your DCs differently.

Hissy in future when I see your name pop up on a MN thread I'll think of this quote:
just because you're surrounded by wankers doesn't make you one!

Epic.

Dear God Need, now your dsis is programming your DS to know that 'to be honest, what more should he expect?

Yes you do need to cease contact, they will destroy him as they tried to do to you.

You didn't have anyone to fight your corner. He's lucky, he has you, you know what they are capable of.

detach, detach, detach.

Donkeys, I just hope I'm in the right side of the glass.

Hissy, I was very unhappy with that comment. It was in response to her dh saying, "I don't know how any man can abandon their dc like that" in sympathy with ds.

I just need to establish the boundaries I want.

The thing that jumps out at me from all your posts need is that you say you were different. You were more intellectual etc. I have a feeling your family were trying to bring you down a peg or two. They may have refused to help with your baby thinking you'd fail and they would have to rescue you but you didn't you step up and looked after him even though you were a child yourself so they found fault with your heroic tenacity with breast feeding and your lack of housework (?!?). You denied them the chance to save the situation and they resent that.
I worry about how they would handle your dc going to them if they were abused or bullied. I'd be anxious about the kinds of advice they would offer.
If it was me id NC. Fuck em basically. I'd be angry but I realise the fault is with them and they are not going to admit it and do the work to make it a functional relationship. Life's too short to be angry for this long. You've won by having your beautiful mentally healthy family. But that's me only you can decide what's best for you.

Oh God, I hope I haven't been too arrogant. They did as well as me at uni. I'm just annoyed I never got the help structuring a path suited to me, and that my own wishes were so rubbished.

Not even close to arrogant!!

Need - just read your epic thread, including spiders. Hissy's right - you rock!

Your parents sound like familiar church members. Always jovial, straight laced and fab but once the facade crumbles, the truth comes out. They might be adored fab GP's, but they were shit parents to you and that's the crux of this. Your DB doesn't want to rock the boat, so wants to leave the past behind. Your sis is the golden child, and will always be seen as the better one. And your parents don't want to be reminded of their failings, so they ignore under their banality and superimpose their guilt, failings and faults on you.

You're the one seen as the difficult and angry one. They portray you as one because they perceive that you, in your mind are addressing them for their faults. You've mentioned a couple of things from your childhood, which they either hate or are embarrassed by as you are the mirror they see themselves in by the way they treated you. Who the hell doesn't ask their 11yo why they're dripping wet? Your parents would rather things weren't mentioned so that they don't see where they fail. But until they and your sister do address this, you'll be hurt by it all. But I don't think they will. Your mother was worried about your therapy incase it address your childhood. They entertained your EA XH as its all about appearances. And don't even get me started on the way your mother and sister downplayed rape However they don't appear outwardly to see where they are going wrong. Maybe it is time to go LC - yes your children may be upset but it might be best to let things go low for a while to see how you are. Because from what you've written, its always someone's else's fault (not DS1's dad's fault, he was only 21), but it seems like the blame will always be shifted in your direction.

Thank goodness for your inner strength, your sheer will power & chutzpah and a super supportive DH

My family were definitely trying to clip my wings. My DM left school at 15, and all my dad ever did was point out my errors and how I could have done things better.

the only exception to this was with languages. not one single member of my family ever managed any kind of smattering of anything other than english. I however find languages and am fluent in 2, passable in 1 more and if you hold a gun to my head could be forced to remember a couple more. For some reason they allow themselves to be proud of me for that. They show me off.

Mind you, my dad used to call me, knowing my abusive ex hated some of the languages I speak with colleagues/contacts of his to get them to talk to me in that language. it caused unholy rows. last time he did that, I spoke in English and he never did it again.

My mother is I believe jealous of me. I think she grew jealous of the relationship I had with my dad initially, i looked like him. We were close. My sis looked like her and ended up her favourite. It shouldn't have come as any shock that my sis and dm cohorted together to hurt me when they knew I was least able to shake it off. dm supported dsis, or more accurately refused to tackle sis over her shockingly awful treatment of me. I knew she wasn't even listening to a word I said.

My sister is clearly venom spitting jealous and resentful of me, despite the fact that she reached higher climbs than I did. I have only ever shown her love and care. Seemingly, the nicer I am to her, the more she hates me. I had no idea until she revealed her hidden treachery. It was so hideous I ended up winded tbh.

the way I encourage my son is a world away from the way my family treated me. I know I'm not a genius, but I'm no dunce either. I said to my DS though that I want him to succeed and I'll be delighted if he makes me look stupid by comparison. Go! i said, FLY! I want to see how high you can fly, i want to see you soar! I'll be proud of you no matter what, I want you to be happy and doing things you love.

Not at all like my dad who told me that he had his 'Never mind you can always retake the test' speech all ready on the day of my driving test. I passed of course 1st time.

Sorry if that's how it sounded. No not arrogant at all! You sound very humble and self reflecting. But some people don't like to see people do better than them. I knew a girl who was exceptionally bright and her whole family took the mick out of her 'oooh check out miss snooty pants, know everything do you?' - that kinda of thing. It was partly because she hung around with the bright kids at school and a different accent and partly just because they didn't like that she was smart. She never behaved in a snooty way at all. Your treatment reminds me of her. And maybe you would have done even better at uni if you had bean encouraged as much as you should have been.

Don't worry knights :) just worried I'd sounded full of myself (I'm really not).

Hissy, I want my dcs to be whatever they want, be it a poverty stricken artist or a high court judge!

CSI, what a very lovely post. You may have nailed it.

I know tthis thread is a couple of days old, but just want to say I recognise a few situations with my dad. After I had ds1 I understood how wrong he was losing his temper with me and my siblings, hitting us, etc . Don't want to go into details. I got very angry with him. I told him. He never fully understood why what he did was serious. He won't understand. He's not emotionally mature to understand. Then I understood he did the best he could out of his own problems (probably from his own childhoods). And really, the moment I figured it out I stopped being angry and I think I forgave him (or got really close to it).

It took a few years. I suggest you dont rush it. Be angry with them for a while. Maybe a few years. They were horrible for over 30 years, you need time to get over it. Give yourself time, and accept that all feelings are valid. Everything you're feeling now is ok.

Thank you dodo. Ddad was shipped off all over as a child. So I think he struggles with emotions and attachments.

I could cope so much better if I was acknowledged as the parent of my dc1.

I know I've said it, but I lived a long way away from them with little support for 15 years. During that time it was always, "you're so lucky to have such easy dcs". No, I wasn't. They were normal. I worked hard. They are nice because I am firm but fair. They feel loved. They are safe. (Although XH is a whole other matter).

I was at something last week where someone gushed at dsis about what a maternal person she is. She has one small dc. I have 3.

I do make a rod for my own back by being the duck. It's all calm above surface, but I paddle constantly beneath the water. A few new friends at uni wouldn't believe I was a parent as I wasn't "frazzled". I was relaxed both with and without him.

Your family works hard on making a good impression to strangers, while you're busy doing the best to your DC.

It makes no sense to expect the same level of admiration from strangers that your parents or your DSis get. You're not working as hard in presenting a facade. You would never be able to have a career, to leave an abusive relationship, and to raise 3 DC (one while you were a teenager!) if you were focusing on what strangers think of you.

"Dm did need reassuring when I started therapy that it wasn't talking about my terrible childhood. I think she knows I think I had one"

She was shit scared you were going to ruin her image. she couldn't give a SHIT about the fact that you had a terrible childhood, she only cares that she's got away with it.

her Uber-Grandparenting I view as hostile toward you too. she is undermining you, to your own DC so that she can make him think that she is a better parent than you are to him. She WAS a vile bitch you to you, she still is. even her niceness to your DC is designed to hurt you. your sister is a bitch to you too and your Dad lets it all happen.

get these hideous people OUT of your lives as soon as possible and focus on repairing the damage they have caused.