This relationship cannot end in marriage, but what will the family think?

[SilverMoonPickup]

Been engaged for 2 months. Supposed to be getting married next July but all we do is argue. Deep down we're probably not suited to one another and I think as time goes on we're liking each other less and less - although this only comes out in an argument.

We had a massive argument on Saturday regarding taking each others phone off charge to charge up our own (seriously) and a host of other non-issues that screamed out "we're simply not getting on."

He's older than me and is a 'boss' at work and I think he likes to bring that role home with him (although he says this is not true and I imagine that he's controlling). I can't really have an opinion on anything without him saying "I've done all this before so I know what I'm talking about, you don't!". This stretches from the mortgage to the refurbishing of the bathroom to laying the laminate flooring last night - anything I say is met with "you forget I've done all this before!". I'll just shut up then and play the good little wife in the corner shall I?

God it's so frustrating. I dread the planning of anything because it's always met with sarcasm or a superior voice. I've restarted working full time since October and last week received another paycheck with a stupid amount of money taken off for tax, NI and pension. I had a little moan and he laughs and shouts "welcome to the world of work!" how patronising!! I have worked before you know! I'm entitled to a moan now and again, doesn't mean I don't understand how economics work. We're going to a festival in July, I was looking up various things to take and he's stood behind me saying "nope, that's no good. No, you don't want that. No, I can find something better than that, remember I've done this festival many times before, I know what I'm on about." Oh fuck off with it all then.

Holidays are the same.

My poor rabbit is stuck in a hutch outside on her own because everytime I look into buying her a big hutch and introducing another friend for her he says "no that hutch is crap, I could make a miles better one." well do it then!!!!

I needed new shoes for work, my feet are killing and I told him I was going to buy some work crocs. as recommended. He says "no they're so expensive! I can find you some cheaper, leave it with me!" - a month later - "I need those shoes?" "yep, I'm on it, leave it with me". 3 months later "you found those shoes yet?" "damn just got outbidded by 20p, leave it with me." just let me buy the fucking shoes???!!! 6 months later, my feet are a mess and I buy the shoes myself. A whole £15 more than he wanted to pay. £15 for 6 months of uncomfortable shoes.

Don't get me wrong, I have many faults too but I'm sure there are people out there we're both better suited to. I want to be with someone who views me as an equal, someone I can make joint decisions with and not worry about what subjects I bring up incase it causes an argument. I know we won't get married and if we do it will be to please everyone else. I also know we'll stay together for a couple of years because 50% of the time we're great together so I just feel like I'm in limbo. Part of me wants to hang on to it for a couple of more years because despite everything, I would miss him but another part of me wants to just leave and get out of it now. It's so stressful living here.

There's no point trying to 'fix things' with someone like this. He will just up the ante and become worse, as he has no interest in changing.

As to the 'next relationship' I'd say that any woman who has been in more than one relationship with men who don't value them needs to stop and think for a while about things like self-esteem and why they put up with being treated this way before starting another relationship. Unfortunately, arseholes tend to spot quite quickly that they have found a partner who will let them away with it, so you have to be clear that you don't deserve this kind of treatment, and that's not something that someone is going to give to you on a plate.

To add for the reason of me suggesting about the op trying to improve things with her current partner:

"Part of me wants to hang on to it for a couple of more years because despite everything, I would miss him"

He's so used to bossing you around and getting his own way that he doesn't even know that he's doing it anymore.

What is his relationship like with his parents? Do they pander to him and give him everything that he demands?

Personally, I think you need to really fight fire with fire here and put your foot down instead of giving in passively every time. Spell it out. Tell him that you simply are not going to marry someone who patronises you, treats you like a child and demands to be in control of every small detail. Maybe he has people at work that he can boss around and have the final say over, but he's not going to try that with you if you are going to be his wife. If he wants a pushover and a yes-woman, then he needs to jog on.

God, reading this I'm actually pissed off on your behalf! How dare he drown out your voice and opinions all of the time, the bloody arrogant know all. Sorry, I know he is your fiancé, but really this not currently what you might call a partnership- it's all about him.

It's all very well encouraging her to stand up to him but doing so will simply make him go apeshit. She's having a hard enough time standing up to him as it is without bringing down more bullying, fury, aggression on her head. He won't change, he does not want to be in an equal relationship, he chose her because he can control her, there's nothing the OP can do to fix the situation but leave.

I think that is a bit over the top, twinklestein. There are no signs that he would go 'apeshit' or is displaying signs of 'fury' from what the OP has posted, unless I missed something. She has only talked of sarcasm and him using a superior voice. The OP said she wants to make equal decisions with him. You really think that she can't say that she is not prepared to stay engaged to him while he carries on overruling her views? So she should just totally give up on the relationship and walk away without actually telling him why?

People online are very quick to use the word ABUSE very often, when there isn't any. You simply don't get on.

I think that you would be wise to end the relationship as you aren't happy xx

If you can't see that this is an abusive relationship RedRoom and you think it's fixable I can't help you.

Take this sentence:

I just wouldn't because of the shit storm it would create but he doesn't physically stop me from doing so

He controls the OP by creating a 'shit storm' when he cannot control her every move. That was with regard to buying her own pair of shoes. How do you think he'll react if she stands up to him and tells him what's what?

Standing up to an emotionally abusive man is dangerous, you simply cannot predict how it will pan out.

ok, 'but what will the family think'

it doesn't matter at the end of the day, do you really want to be posting on here about your depressed life for the next 40 yrs?

Abuse or no abuse is irrelevant. He makes you unhappy, he makes your ds unhappy, you're not tied to him (yet). Walk away.

Twinklestein No, sorry, I've looked at that quote in the context in which silvermoonpickup wrote it, and I still don't feel that it shows that her relationship is abusive. Having arguments because one partner thinks he knows it all and insists that they do things his way to save piddly amounts of money is not always 'abuse'. Sometimes, it just means the partner is an irritating bossy boots. Perhaps you have read the term 'shit storm' and interpreted it as the OP saying she is fearful of his rage, but I certainly didn't and the OP makes it totally, perfectly clear that she isn't. She says she could leave and get shoes at any time, but he'd huff because he thinks his way is the best. I do not equate that with abuse, even if you do. I see no signs that he is abusive to the degree that she needs to show fear of him and that there is no help or way out. Instead, I think she needs to point out that his 'my way or the highway' views make him an intolerable arse.

OP: do you feel that his behaviour is frightening or intimidating? Am I giving him too much benefit of the doubt?

Well, what is clear from the OP is that there is no room in the relationship for her to grow. Ultimately this will be frustrating for both of them.

Redroom,I read it the same as Twinklestein. I think shit-storm means what it says. It may mean different things depending on who is suffering the 'shit-storm', but even so it isn't good. No-one in any relationship should be too scared to say something because of the shit-storm. In a decent, normal relationship people talk about problems.
It is abusive, you may of course think differently, that's your choice.
It affects the OP in a negative way, so it's abusive.

She's so unafraid of his 'shitstorm' that she does not buy herself a new pair of shoes for 6 months. If she can easily buy a new pair for herself, why didn't she?

Abuse is not determined by how frightened someone is of their partner - indeed I have encountered women in horribly physically abusive relationships who claimed not to be scared of their partner even though they events proved that they should have been. Emotional abuse is about power, control, bullying, intimidation, manipulation.

He will not change, he cannot be reasoned with, and if she challenges him he will simply create more 'shitstorms'. He is not interested in hearing what she has to say, he is not interested in having an equal relationship, this is the kind of relationship he wants.

There are plenty of books on emotional abuse available.

Alright, so let's agree that it is abusive because this is going to go on in circles unless one of us is able to see things from another perspective. Labelling the relationship as such still doesn't help the OP work out what to do next. The suggestion that she walks out of an abusive engagement without telling him why she is ending it, or letting him know that his behaviour is the reason, doesn't seem particularly helpful either. A man who is abusive and controlling isn't going to stand for that.

Alright, so let's agree that it is abusive because this is going to go on in circles unless one of us is able to see things from another perspective. Labelling the relationship as such still doesn't help the OP work out what to do next. The suggestion that she walks out of an abusive engagement without telling him why she is ending it, or letting him know that his behaviour is the reason, doesn't seem particularly helpful either. A man who is abusive and controlling isn't going to stand for that.

Alright, so let's agree that it is abusive because this is going to go on in circles unless one of us is able to see things from another perspective. Labelling the relationship as such still doesn't help the OP work out what to do next. The suggestion that she walks out of an abusive engagement without telling him why she is ending it, or letting him know that his behaviour is the reason, doesn't seem particularly helpful either. A man who is abusive and controlling isn't going to stand for that.

Woah- I only pressed post once!

I'm with all those who say stop trying to work out who's right and who's wrong. He might be right 100% of the time and you'd still be in a shit relationship, having a shit time and more to the point, subjecting your children to the shit time as well. Tell him you're tired of all the arguments and go and be wrong on your own for a while.

I disagree that labelling the relationship abusive still doesn't help the OP work out what to do. If the relationship is abusive then the only thing the OP can do is end it. Now.

And there is no point in trying to change him and trying to explain what went wrong - he simply won't accept it. She will always and in every situation be the one who is wrong, controlling and selfish. Deep, deep down he knows that he is describing himself but he is projecting the attributes onto her because he is so psychologically weak that he can't handle the truth. If he could acknowledge that and get some therapy there might be a chance of changing him but it isn't going to happen and it isn't the OP's job to fix a man who she increasingly seems to dislike. With good reason too.

have you not noticed he doesn't actually like you?

he probably quite enjoys fucking you and that's about it.

the main thing I have noticed about relationships is that on balance they get worse. the first week is better than the first year is better than the fifth year.

there are exceptions but that's why so many marriages end in divorce. others would except there's not enough money.

I wouldn't bin him. I'd marry him then bin him. and take the fucking money. at least that way you'll have something to show for the time spent with him.

Well, that sounds like me, except I did not have MN and I stayed another 2.5 years after I first tried to break off the engagement. We got married, we are getting divorced. Getting out and keeping him away needed all my savings in legal fees, and apocalypto, get married and then bin him and get the money is REALLY bad advice. If he won't buy the OP a pair of crocs, he will make sure all his assets are tied up in a way she can't get a penny. Besides, the longer she is with him, the more he will erode her sense of self and the more damage he will do.

My advice is run for the hills and certainly don't get married.

@ daffoldildays

I assume that suggestion wasn't serious..!!

anyway it is much harder than you might think to hide money.

but yeah, having read the thread, he doesn't deserve to be with anyone.

But it is very easy to invest it in such a way that it will cost the other party more money than they have to try to claim their rightful share, Elizabeth. Let us say it wasn't hidden, so much as obviously spent in front of my nose; whilst my legal concerns were getting the harrassment to stop.

But yes, maybe I am missing the obvious joke, having nothing but legal fees to show for my marriage.

Don't marry him. I did. Nearly three years later I'm sitting with the front door locked, a 2yo and 6mo old asleep upstairs, having told him not to come home tonight. I don't know what will happen if he does come back.

Loopdaloo presumably he will find the doors locked and either fuck off somewhere else or else go apeshit mental and get himself nicked. At the first sign of twattery, summon plod.