Having the talk

[lavenderhoney]

I'm planning to tell my dh its all over and I want a divorce. He isn't going to be very happy about it. I've asked in the past and he has stormed off, refused and told me I'm crazy. He has no problem discussing our problems with or infront of dc age 7 and 4:( he is not a nice man and he is going to be very nasty indeed, I think.

I left almost 3 months ago ( we did live overseas, he is still there and will be for the future , and he is not from the UK) and now is the time. I should have done it before but for various reasons the solicitor said to wait ( financial). I have to talk to her this week and get things moving but I obviously have to tell dh what's coming.


I need some advice on how to handle it, what to say, and what to do with his reactions. And what to expect. I'm bricking it, frankly:(

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

Without pandering to him I agree it is best to avoid conflict.

That said - I don't know how provocative this would be but since he chided you for not sending PILs photos you could do so and attach an explanatory "It gives me great sadness to inform you. .." just to dissuade him from any illusion you are playing at this. However there's a gap between Actively Stirring and Quietly But Firmly Remaining Resolute.

[Meerka]

lavender it isn't your job to calm him down any more. He has to calm down or not on his own. You just state your limits - no personal abuse, no ranting, no dissing you to the children- and then if he breaks them, ignore him. If it gets too bad, contact through the solicitor.

It's clear you're a very caring person who wanted it to work but he's thoroughly turned you off him. He sounds like a little boy who's still desperately impressed he's got a dick at all and expects it to be treated as a little god.

[lavenderhoney]

Fluffy, I'm terrible at difficult conversations which is one of the reasons I get the dc to practise having them:) I'd rather talk about anything else! And as for difficult situations - just thinking about it makes my heart beat faster and not in a good way.

The pattern of my unhappy parents was fester, shout your piece and storm off, not talk for a few days, gradually thaw out, be happy, issues come up, fester - and so on. I think he thinks we are just on this (not) merry go round of marital disagreement. I'm afraid I have no intention of living my life like this anymore.

I think he will hope I will back down without further discussion. I'm going to continue with my plans, and start to tie up loose ends.

Also, he has posted a photo on fb of a night out where he had invited the ow and I was sat in between them, at the end of the summer. Either he is monumentally stupid and thinks its a nice pic of us together (!) or I don't know, frankly. Why would he do that? Madness.

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

That photo .

Trying to bluff you were complicit or it was all above board?

[lavenderhoney]

Donkeys, I have no idea. Its a group shot of couples, at a dinner my dh gave, and she came alone. I hadn't met her before but knew go her iyswim, he was collaborating with her ( work).

A few weeks later I was at the funeral of my dm and she was the one he took to the party. He has always denied anything but he would, wouldn't he? I just think its odd, posting a pic of that when it caused so much trouble. Its hardly going to make me feel kindly towards him!

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

It seemed like an odd thing to post, as if he is trying to get a rise out of you, but you know how his mind works not me.

Out of nosiness lavender looking back, when would you say you two were last happy, when was life uncomplicated?

[lavenderhoney]

Donkeys, truly, it was before we left for the ME :( so about 5 years ago.

He got into the expat lifestyle as part of his job and I had another baby and concentrated on the dc. I wanted to bf and look after my own babies, not hand them to a maid. I suppose I just didn't notice the slide. Well I did, but thought it would get better. It didn't.

[DonkeysDontRideBicycles]

Treading water for so long must have been a strain even before the bereavement. Just don't let him twist it somehow into you regretting having DC2.

[Granville72]

I would cut all contact with him via email, Skype, phone, whatever. Only let him converse with the children. Do not let him draw you in to more arguments and petty tit for tat.

DO NOT for gods sake, let him buy a house for you to live in. It's just another way of him controlling you and you will never be free and independent of him. You need him to be a supportive father for your children, and that is it.

Keep all the correspondence he sends you, and between the both of you for your solicitor. It will give good grounds that he is harassing you and help the divorce proceedings.

Do not let him draw you in. Ignore him, and if you must talk to him and he starts ranting then hang up and don't answer the emails.

[hamptoncourt]

Block him on facebook.

[lavenderhoney]

I can't block him. I feel so sorry for him. besides, I've heard it all before.

I wish he would stop, tbh, and accept it and think what to do next. He is making all sorts of family plans to try to make me waver and try again. It would be ok for a month or so then he would start his crap all over again. I just can't be bothered with it. It makes me so sad.

[hamptoncourt]

Why not? I don't understand.

[Meerka]

um ... not to be rude, lavender but why are you feeling sorry for an unpleasant, tantrumming man-child who has treated you badly?

[cjel]

Lavender even though you have heard it all before it will still be affecting you. It has been part of your life for too long. You can feel sorry for him without having to soak up his crap. I still love my H to bits and worry about him but I now do it without having hardly any contact its so much calmer and the only way to recover and reclaim your life. It seems impossible but it really is the best way. Let your dcs speak to him and everything else through solicitors or else its just like picking a scab

[lavenderhoney]

I don't love him and worry about him, though. I feel sorry for him because I'm indifferent now. I've heard it all before and been through the cycle of it, and I'm not going to again.
That sounds very harsh, but when I think of all the times I was left sobbing in various situations and posting on mn under a nc, getting scared off by posters who were horrified and not posting for a bit, then nc and doing it again - validation I suppose, and being isolated.
I mean, I had lots of friends in the ME but everyone seemed so happy or wasn't but didn't want to do anything about it ( money, status etc) I knew once I actually said outloud I was unhappy, I would have admitted to myself properly and make plans to try to leave. Because I couldn't sit and moan about how shit my life was whilst living a lie publicly, if that makes sense?

I don't want to create conflict as we have the dc and its best to be amicable whilst I try to steer him towards divorce instead of the Disney fantasy he has in his head of us from now on. So I am trying to help us find a way to that place as easily as possible without being very blunt and direct. I have no desire for that. I can see he wants me to be though:)

[Granville72]

I think whatever you choose to do to try and keep it amicable and pleasant will fall flatly on it's head. He's not going to allow that to happen, he's already proving to you that is not going to happen.

Keep it pleasant for the children's sake and only converse with issues to do with them.

Divorce is going to cause conflict............period. It seldom doesn't cause conflict but you need two people to be reasonable for that and he is far from reasonable.

I think your only option is to just get on with it and serve the papers. Stop feeling sorry for him, he's the one that's brought this on himself, not you.

He will try to manipulate you and control you for as long as he wants. Remember, it's all what HE wants, for him, not you, your marriage or the children.

[Meerka]

I can see what you're saying lavender. Just ... take care of yourself and draw all the support you can from friends, solicitor and mumsnet :)

[lavenderhoney]

It won't get better anyway. He is already ranting at me for putting him through all this stress. I am selfish as I know he is busy at work, apparently. He can't sleep for not knowing if I will change my mind. I keep telling him but he comes back with more emails wanting to stay together. I can just imagine if I gave in how I would have to pay somehow.

And - this really annoys me- he calls when its bedtime for the dc and leaves me pissed off messages as I don't pick up.

I imagined how I would feel if he just turned up and the overwhelming feeling was horror and exhaustion at having to deal with him.

He won't believe me when I say its over.

[DustBunnyFarmer]

I think telling him to correspond via your solicitor for the time being would probably help to reinforce your intent if he's not listening. You sound like you are trying to do right by everyone because you are a fundamentally decent person. However, being so kind towards him is taking a terrible toll on you. This is going to be a marathon, not a sprint. I think you need to take a step back to preserve your energy and sanity. Sounds like arms length contact would help him too.

[lavenderhoney]

Dust bunny, he doesn't know I have one yet. He's still not accepting its over. When he does and is calm, I can introduce the divorce. I'm good to go though. Everything is ready to file.

[DustBunnyFarmer]

He may never be calm. Its in his interests to keep badgering you to reconcile if it keeps you on the back foot. He may even be making his own plans/consulting a lawyer. Just don't hold out for "a good moment" that may never come.

[lavenderhoney]

That's a theory I've had presented to me re him consulting a lawyer, however he doesn't have the marriage cert so I don't know if he can.
I hope not. I'm screwed if he does. I'm going to do it next week. He will freak out anyway as I've lost my temper a bit and been a little blunt.

Might as well get on. I wonder if he might want to accept separation but not divorce. I don't want to marry again and it would save his face a bit. He is very very angry and he is clearly not going to tell his family I'm even in the UK. It makes no difference to me anyway, as long as we aren't living together or I am expected to have sex with him.

[DustBunnyFarmer]

You've been separated since Christmas. Why delay the inevitable? You need to be financially separate as well as physically & emotionally. Why would you risk staying financially hitched to him - if he leaves his well paid job to move back to the UK, he could quickly accrue debts etc. Stop putting others first and do what's right for YOU. (I mean this kindly - I've put others' needs ahead of mine in the past.)

[lavenderhoney]

I know:( its hard to do this.

When I look at advice its all about how you feel wronged, heartbroken, moving on, there's almost nothing for someone like me. How to keep the process going when you don't want to get back together and how to manage the other person. Its all the other way round and I totally underestimated how hard it would be ( not because of love). Because they won't see.

I spoke to the school. They were great. He's never called them- always left it to me to inform. Its strange, he doesn't ask anything about their education and progress. Or if they like their teacher, what's her name etc.

[DustBunnyFarmer]

Yes, another thing about a prompt divorce is clarity for your children. He could spin an extended separation as offering the chance you'll get back together.