Ex partner wants £25K, sort of

[littlegreenlight1]

Ok I dont have long before I need to go but I need to ask someone wtf I should do or say.

Basically, my ex (NOT my DC's father) came into some money a few years ago. 45k's worth and he insisted (he lived with us) that he wanted to pay that off my (our) house and make life so much easier as we would be mortgage free by the time we were 40 etc.
I was apprehensive at the time and asked him to sign a sort of pre nup - well we werent married but that kind of thing, my financial adviser strongly advised him to do so too as IF we were to split up he would have no claim on that at all.
Well.... the inevitable happened, he was a massive drinker and his problem escalated to a point I couldnt have him near me any more. He was destroying me and himself of course and I knew the only way to save him was to leave him - of course it was more complicated than that but together, we were a disaster (not always and not when we moved in together).
We split a year ago, he said he'd never take the money away from me as it was for the children he had been with for so many years (they are now 16, 14 and 8, he had been around for what would have been 6 years now). I KNEW one day, he would want that or at least some money and today was that day.
He wants £10K by september, then he wants me to take anotehr £15K (from my arse?!?!) and put £5k away each for the children to have when they are 25.
I have looked in to doing this months ago as I suspected this would happen and I can not afford to do so. Ive also recently taken on a lower paid job.
To give him what he wants, would almost double my mortgage payments, which is what I earn in a month.

I dont know what to do. Of course I want to give him his money, Im not a nasty person, but by god I remember at the time, sitting at this very bloody table calling him an idiot. He said it didnt matter, because if we ever split, he would still want me to have it. Argh, his voice in my head - I knew this day would come as soon as we split.

I dont even know what Im asking. Please dont think I am a money grabber, if I had it or could access it I would, but I looked in to taking just 15K last year and like I say, it doubled my mortgage payments as my mortgage is low now. If he had signed something at the time apparently they could have just set me back to how I was before he put the money in.

Its such a mess. Im mad with him for not listening to me, Im mad with him for lying to me, of course I knew hed want it back but he insisted etc...

My lift is here, I have to go - I guess its a "what would you do?" kind of q.............

I think to give him some of the money back would be the right thing to do. Ten grand on a mortgage isn't going to make a big difference over 11 years.

I don't understand your issue. In your OP you said that to add it to the mortgage will increase your payments... But now you say it only ever decreased the term, not the payments.
So you just increase the term again.
Only thing I would say is that you need to compare your interest rate before you accepted the money, and whether extending the mortgage will change that.
I think as it was a gift, you have a moral right to be compensated for any loss of a good rate.

And of course if you plan to keep the remaining £35K, get that in writing as a gift.
Given how controlling he is, I'd re-mortgage to give the lot back.

I can't for the life of me fathom how you, right now, taking out a 45k mortgage to repay him wouldn't put you back in the position you were in previously.

In fact, you'd still be better off as you have saved the interest you would have been paying on that 45k had he not paid it off.

He gave it as a gift, no strings attached,in perpetuity etc. You don't get gifts back. Fuck him

Yes, of course, in an ideal world you don't give gifts back, but who wants to be in hock to a controlling ex?

Just remortgage/lengthen the term of the mortgage and give him the whole lot back. Is defo what I would do.

When I looked in to it last year, they told me it would not put me back in the old position. I will have to find out again, but at that time, I was told it would just increase the payments, the figures were quite disturbing.... doesnt add up though does it, will get a second opinion.
Perhaps its cos I wasnt in a position to remortgage then but will be soon?

Who does he think he is, telling you to extend your mortgage so he can put money in accounts for your children. That is controlling and a bit creepy. I'd rather tell him to keep the money.

I would be really tempted to extend the mortgage and give him it all back - you don't want to be beholden to a man like this. However if you choose not to then you shouldn't feel guilty.

You will need to extend the term of your mortgage as well as increase it to get back to your original position. You may also have to pay a bit extra in interest. Maybe you could get the IFA to tot up how much extra interest you will have to pay over the remaining term and deduct it from the 45k, then pay back the remainder.

I think you should deduct the cost of renting a room in your house for the time he was there, plus any costs of utilities and meals provided, and deduct it from the 45k and return the rest to him.

I don't see why you should benefit from someone else's inheritance left to a third party, no matter what they might have said in the heat of passion. As much as he might have said things, equally his side of the story might be that you influenced him into giving you his inheritance and now he has nothing to show for it. It really doesn't paint you in a good light. I can't see how you would get a resolution other than going to court and sifting through the evidence.

You are able to remortgage, and you say that although it would double your mortgage payments, your mortgage is pretty low anyway.

Morally, why do you think you are entitled to keep man's inheritance after a short relationship not resulting in children, just because of some verbal promises made at the beginning of the relationship?

I dont think for one second Im entitled to it!!!
I think hes an idiot for the promises he made which he should never ever have done but that was him all over, all mouth and promises. I really cant describe what kind of man he was.
Absolutely - we have no children between us, I dont think I should keep the money at all and I will certainly now Ive had even longer to think it through, see if it is possible to just get myself back to where I was before. I dont understand what they said last year so I can only see that it was because as I said before, that I couldnt remortgage then (fixed term that is nearing the end).
Yes, thats my decision, I dont want any part of him in my life, he is very very bad for me and I want no connection to him whatsoever. I want to move on and if he chooses to keep money aside for my children, that is up to him.
Thank you all for your advice.

That sounds very sensible OP, though it must be sickening to think you're £45000 worse off than you thought you were.

Still, cheap at half the price if it gets rid if him for good.

A different issue, but why does he still see your kids? He's controlling, calculating and scary. And an alcoholic.
Who might be playing games trying to secure their affection or esteem via £5K gifts.
Doesn't sound like the kind of person to be good to have around them?

I absolutely would not be following orders to give them money. Either keep the lot or give back the full amount less rent for his time with you less any detriment (mortgage fees, higher interest rate...) but whatever you don't don't let him decide... And if you give him money back, don't accept it back as a gift for the kids because you can't trust him not to change his mind.

Btw, if you would now have a higher interest rate than you did before you met him, over the full term of a mortgage that could easily put you in detriment of THOUSANDS.
So even if you choose to give it back, once you balance that out, it could be nothing to give him!

Be very exact on your numbers!

You need to speak to a lawyer, not a financial adviser.

A couple of things - was your ex named on the mortgage or the deeds at all?

Do you have any evidence (emails, letters) that he refused to take financial and legal advice when giving you the money?

Frankly, if he insisted on giving the money and refused to protect himself in anyway, then that's his loss and if I were you, I wouldn't be giving back anything to him.

He still sees the kids because they adore him.
I know that without understanding the situation you may think Im an idiot, but I know him inside and out, I know how he feels about people that play mind games with kids etc, I know he wouldnt hurt them and he would never drink around them. He helps my dd with her GCSE maths revision once a week (in my house) and takes the boys for dinner once every so often. He was never anything but perfect with them, its me and him that didnt work.
I will be very very exact with my numbers, Ill just see if I can be exactly the same as before him.
sigh if only life was perfect and we always made the right decisions. I really thought by my age Id know what to do.

I take it the house & mortgage have always remained in your name? Did he contribute anything other than the 45k while he was living with you? 5 yrs' rent & bills would eat a sizeable chunk. Agree with other posters, don't do anything until you've had professional advice and make sure you insist on a written legal agreement to reflect the situation if you do hand over any money, to protect yourself against any future claims.

I don't quite understand how you would have paid the mortgage if he hadn't have paid a chunk off?

But as you say you shortened the term rather than reducing the payments are they doing the calculation based on paying off the extra money within the current shortened term? If so i can see that that would increase the payments a lot, so can you now extend the term again, and keep the payments down?

I think you need more financial advice on how you can add the extra on to your mortage without doubling the payments, or how to construct some other solution.

Would he accept a monthly payment over a longer twem which was a sort of 'rent' to him on a proportion of the house that he contributed to? I would of course not couch it in terms of 'rent' in writing because you don't want him to have an actual claim on the house or suggest that he has ownership of any of it.

My mortgage was fine, long but fine. He paid a chunk off, reduced the term, payments stayed the same.
He refused to sign to say if we split he would be entitled to it/some back.
When I asked last year about giving it back, they said my payments would become unmanageable. I wasnt in a position to remortgage then, but I will be soon.
So my intention is to get that money minus anything Im entitled to from the time he lived here and not put any away for the children. If he wants them to have it, they have bank accounts he can put it in.
Then he is out of my life as far as is possible in the royston vasey type town we live.
Thanks for your help.

Agree totally with legal advice.
Being back in your previous position depends do much on what that position was - e.g. Interest rates.
As an example, say your original mortgage was £90K at 2%. Over 20 years you'd pay back £110.
Now assume you need a £90K mortgage today over the same period but at 4%. Total repayment is over £132K.
So losing your old deal would cost you potentially £22K.

It's my personal opinion but I think morally you should pay back what he gave you, less benefit he had, less detriment you have. I don't see it as truly a gift, because I don't think you did. BUT - not a legal opinion, a personal one.

But... I have a feeling that because interest rates have gone up, the net amount would be bobbins!

If you know him so well, you will know which is the better line to take - a flat no, or show him The figures.

But please be very careful not to lose out.

Asking for £10k back, and putting £15k into trust for the kids sounds quite reasonable to me actually.

Whatever you do, make sure you get legal advice and make any payment in full and final settlement of all future claims.

You can't ask for money back when you've given it as a non-returnable, no strings attached gift. The recipient will have based their plans on having it. You don't need to bend over backwards to pay him back. He was a nasty controlling man and he scares you? Even less need to pay him back.

I think it sounds like this request back is less about finances and more about him controlling you. Getting you to dance to his tune. The 15 k in trust funds shows that clearly.

It likely that OP's ex will have a claim on the property here. That's why she needs legal advice.

Amateurish the reason I don't think it's reasonable of him is that he has form for making a gift and asking for it back.

I disagree (though I know it's not my business!) with letting him put money into your kids accounts if he wants to.
Even if they do adore him.
You have described him as calculating and controlling, and you know he goes back on his word, with regards to money.