What were your *red flag* moments

[louby44]

My exP was a very subtle bully and over the nearly 6 years I knew him these things now jump out...

it was very full on* very quickly, he would buy me presents, flowers and he'd moved in 8 months after we'd met (too soon now I know) but I was flattered

he had no* friends, I was never introduced to anyone - our social life consisted of family and my friends, he did rediscover some via FB afterwards but I have always found that odd

• he would moan if I didn't text him when I was out with friends

• he would moan that I didn't say 'I love you' to him all the time

he was obsessed with football, it was on all* the time, 2/3 matches every Sunday, on in the week at least 3 nights, if we had visitors he would ignore them because of the football

• he was obsessed with how things were done, tins turned round the correct way, quilt put on and shaken in a certain way

• he would have angry outbursts, throw his lap top down, shout, get annoyed with people who walked in front of him, drivers in cars - completely over the top behaviour, very bizarre

• he was horrible to my DC (and his own DD sometimes) negative, cruel, emotionally withdrawn. He was physically abusive to his own daughter last year! major shock to me!

• very jealous of my amicable relationship with my exH

• he would ignore me for days

I'm sure there were more.....these are the things I have to keep reminding myself about...

• Estranged from virtually everyone in her family - had cut out relatives one after the other after some apparent row.

• No long-term friends. Again, she'd fallen out with 99% of her friends and had no childhood or university friends still.

• Endless stories of her abusive childhood. This may or may not have been true, I don't know, but it was all she talked about.

• Inability to sleep without getting high on weed. Inability to get through the day without endless cigarettes and valium. Waking up in the middle of the night to go and have a cigarette.

• Massive problems at work. Constantly phoning me up saying she was being bullied, or she'd fallen out with her colleagues, or was going to raise a grievance and that no-one but her did their jobs properly. Yet she'd leave work early, smoke weed whilst on duty (nurse!!!!) and yet apparently was the only one who did her job correctly?

• Very intense very quickly. However - I should perhaps add that this may not be a red flag, since it was a lesbian relationship, and most of my lesbian relationships have been pretty intense quite quickly, but haven't necessarily been disastrous.

Thank God I figured out that this was not the kind of stuff I needed on a daily basis and ended it. She went totally batshit - screaming abuse at me in the street, ripping up my book I'd lent her and throwing it at the doorstep when I wouldn't let her in, abusive emails and texts. Scary.

• Very charming, very full on. Got the gift of the gab when it came to talking to women.

• No friends, although he always thought he was popular.

• Extremely bad temper that only I saw. Very different behind closed doors. Shouty and very aggressive. Seemed to feel a sense of power by reducing me to a wreck of tears.

• Also road rage. I used to get very stressed with him in the car.

• Problems getting on with colleagues at work. Always someone else's fault.

• Critical. Demanding. Very petulant.

• Withheld affection/intimacy - always made me feel I had to 'behave' in order to have it.

• After his eruptions I would get the silent treatment for days on end.

• Always threatening to leave during an argument - even a month after we'd got married I got a 'I'm getting a divorce' as he slammed the door. Again.

• No empathy.

• Parents treated him like a god.

• He had cheated in his 2 other significant relationships.

• He was happier when I was vulnerable, appeared to resent any strengths I had.

I am another case of 'if only I'd had Mumsnet',....

I didn't matter. That was it, full stop. Him, him, him. His wants, his needs, his expectations, his desires, his rules, his talk, his life. His beliefs about events were the true things that had happened. His narrative. Any even slight resistance or disagreement I may have thought I had got away with would result in mega punishment days, weeks later. Sulking, rages, dumpings, silences.
Batshit mad behaviour.
Lies.
I'm still not quite over it/him

TrickyTreeLou. I think we married the same man!

I would love your opinions on my stbxh.
He fell for me really quickly and when I said I didn't think it would work as we were too different, he told me it was too late, that I was in his heart and he'd never get me out now etc etc. I was a lonely single mum and was so flattered that I fell for him too. He has now left me and two weeks later fallen in love with another woman within two weeks.
During our six years he continued to be super romantic and loving and affectionate and I adored him... But, occasionally at first and increasingly towards the end, he was vile tempered and would shout at me endlessly until I was reduced to a crying wreck. He had no sympathy for my tears at all and by the end I would burst into tears almost automatically at the slightest criticism. He never admitted to being wrong and any attempt at discussion were baffling as he didn't seem to understand anything I said and communication was hopeless. No logic at all, just incredible defensiveness. By then I could do and say nothing right. He also pushed me around the house physically, clenched his fist under my face, shouted in my face and attacked two of my adult sons. But most of the time he was quiet and sweet. He had no friends. He had been abandoned by his mother at 12 but he had occaisional holidays with her and saw her a couple of times a year until she moved back to this area when he was grown up. She is horrible and selfish and self centred and know it all, yet she can do no wrong in his eyes. He is her little prince and he adores her and will not admit that she has harmed him in any way psychologically. He doesn't speak to his father who was an aggressive bully apparently. His mother doesn't speak to his brother and vice versa. If I ever criticised the mother, he went berserk defending her and even left me for three months last year because if it.
Apparently his step mother sexually abused him.
He completely abandoned his younger daughter 13 when he met me, saying she was ungrateful and made no effort with him. He seemed to have an slightly worrying relationship with his older daughter 17 who was very, (how do I put this nicely? Well her role model was Jordan and she wanted to be a glamour model). He described how proud he was walking down the street with her on his arm felling her large breasts pressed against his arm and glaring at men who were eyeing her up. (Lots do due to large boobs, size 8 body, false eyelashes, high heels etc). He dropped her for a while when I was priority, but later reconnected when she had a teenage pregnancy.
He had no hobbies and his world revolved around me and our mutual adoration club. He did not like any of my friends and we usually went out alone or he was sulky and quiet.
I always felt that I was living a lie and that something wasn't right. Even down to the fact that he wanted me to make him a silver wedding ring. (I make jewellery). I kept explaining that it was too soft and wouldn't last, but he didn't seem to see it as relevant. Hmm...do you think he knew something then?
He was really attentive and loving in bed and our sex life was beautiful, with me being treated as the most special beautiful woman in the world right up until the end.
He left me after disagreeing with me in the pub over the band and telling me to fuck off and get the fucking car. He was in an absolute rage and said if I didn't admit I was wrong he was going to leave. I was crying and crying from the shock of his rage and he packed and went and never came back. He had actually left to go back to his mother about six times before so I thought this was just another tantrum. But he was with the OW two weeks later and now says he's in love. He lied about her for two months until I found out due to his mobile phone bill which showed he'd texted her 700 times in the first month! It's now been three months.
When he came back briefly (to get closure before I knew about OW, he lied about her three times and told me he might 'fight his way through the forests and come back for me one day' but that I shouldn't wait as it wasn't fair to ask that of me.
So what do you all think? Does he fit the description or is it all my fault as he says? He says that I made him into an angry man whom he doesn't like so he had to leave. I hate him but still love him and am desperately broken and unhappy. I have no self esteem and no confidence left.

PS I'm so sorry this is so long

Gosh so many, probably triple what I've written here :-(
Very full on very quickly

Lots of gifts (ugg boots, jackets) and then buying me things that I didn't actually really want / need, but getting upset if I said I didn't really want them. Then saying he had given me 'X' so actually i owed him 'Y'. Buying very expensive bikes for me even though I didn't really cycle...

No friends, never met any friends or family (although he met mine)

No photos at all!!

No online presence (with a back story of being in the SAS so he could be 'found') Got very angry if I mentioned things we had done or put up any photos of anything identifying to him.

Made up past (slowly discovered) Said was in the SAS (not true) said competed for national rugby and athletics (not true) said went to private school and Cambridge (not true) Bought lots of military items / players kit / commonwealth games memorabilia from Ebay

Also said parents were dead / very ill (said one thing to some people, found to have said the other to others!) said he had had cancer (testicular so often withheld sex) said x wife had had cancer (and was currently going through treatment so that's why they occasionally emailed / phoned) said I was the first person they had been with since the divorce (I wasn't, was one of many) said first relationship his girlfriend was pregnant and died in a car crash (not true)

Secretive with phone / ipad. Secret phone calls.

Post in wifes name coming to the house 'years' after they 'split up'

Made things up (eg my son left a glass on a table, said because he hadn't cleared it away his dog had knocked it off and cut his paw) - it hadn't

Always texted / phoned within 20 minutes of me leaving the house saying why was I 'down' was I 'cross with him', i 'didn't seem myself this weekend' when nothing was an issue before.

Always felt like I was on an emotional rollercoaster.

Another dh with no friends -apparently now its my fault.
if i met him now would def be a red flag but just ignore it and tell him he has a choice to go out i'm not his keeper ;)

My ex husband hit me before we were married. I don't remember the cause of the argument but we were in the car, he hit me and told me to get out. I didn't. He got out of the car to come and drag me out, I locked all the doors and he had to walk three miles home and come for his car later.

He said he loved me when I'd known him three weeks and we'd probably been out six times. I had no idea that was a red flag but looking back...

Miranda did he actually say that about 'feeling her large breasts pressed against his arm'? I mean, there is SO much wrong with his behaviour, but that actually sounds like something the police should be getting involved in tbh

After I dumped him he stalked me until I went out with him.
Refused to kiss me if I are meat(sanctimonious vegan idiot)
His way was right.
Used to pour himself drinks and made himself food and never offered me any
Isolated me from family
Called me a bitch when I got better exam results than him.
I could go on...

Why oh why did I stay with him?

"It is said that if a man tells you he is in the SAS, he most certainly isn't"

When on about the third night we spent together, he pissed in my bed because he was so drunk. WHAT WAS I THINKING? I MARRIED him. What a moron. And the lies. And the unreliability. And the lies. And the... god, I was such a fool.

I am not kicking myself, he did that. red flag: he kicked his car when he was cross.

red flag: he dropped our arrangements to meet in my city in favour of doing a favour for his sister... who could have made it another weekend but did not want to give up seeing her friends.

• If I got upset or tried to discuss anything it was: "Fine, everything I do is shit," or threatening to harm himself.

• We could only watch things he liked on TV.

• Encouraged me to fall out with friends and invented things they'd apparently said.

• Moved into my house without asking me first (oh how I wish I was joking).

• Went through my phone bills.

• Repeatedly asked me to promise not to leave.

• Guilt tripped me if I wanted to spend time away from him.

There's a lot more. Thank goodness he's ancient history. Am so glad DH is nothing like him.

Oh and he blamed everything on the fact his parents got divorced.

In the early stages, it can be easy to overlook red flags.

Say you're both on two decent incomes, no kids, not living together yet, it's easy for someone to put on an act doing the whole 'wooing' thing.

One way I've learned to get bad ones to 'show their hand' earlier is to slow down the romantic fantasy by 'switching the dream environment' a bit.

So suggest an activity where its not just 'doing something nice that HE likes'.

Express something authentic about a genuine situation where you're unhappy, or where YOU found something inconvenient or made you upset.

That ALWAYS seems to trigger the "bad ones" into a very 'Real Him' reaction.

They actually get really disproportionately angry at the idea that you're not just going to operate as a cog in giving him a perfect life?

They want to create a life where THEIR thoughts and feelings and moods dominate.

So they really, really hate it if their new girlfriend acts as anything other than a permanently smiling, Madonna like oasis of calm and support.

Eg: me: "there's hassle on the train, I got some really rude comments from some yobs "

Abusers reaction formerly Mr Polite, but now along the lines of

"you are NOT upset! you SHOULD not be upset. You should HANDLE it yourself. You should deal with it. what about MY feelings? I wanted a NICE night out/date. you're too OVEREMOTIONAL. I solve PROBLEMS, because I'm a MAN. why are you being NEEDY and a PRINCESS and RUINING everything? you're just like ALL THE OTHER WOMEN. I had a RIGHT to a NICE NIGHT OUT and now you've RUINED it."

Subtext: your emotional 'job' is to dance round my every little whim and make ME feel good. And if you have an authentic emotion of your own, my plan is fucked. Why aren't YOU looking after ME?

red flag: he dropped our arrangements to meet in my city in favour of doing a favour for his sister... who could have made it another weekend but did not want to give up seeing her friends.

Susan That's something I've seen, too, the really shitty passive aggressive scheduling.

I think it's to play people off against each other WHILST looking reasonable?

Long distance: I'd explained I had a crisis with my abusive parents. We'd arranged to meet on a Thursday in a city 'in between us'. Transport booked, day off.

He texted at 10.45pm Wednesday night to say "my friend's mum has died, I have to stay with him."

My response was very much; "oh dear, take care, hope you're well, hope your friend is well. sorry to hear that."

BUT. Next time we met, he seemed upset that I wasn't making more of a drama out of it? (of course I just asked 'is your friend Ok?)

He actually WANTED me to start complaining or begging for his attention.

He also wanted to send me the message that I needed to 'compete' or 'win his favour'. And also to make it so I couldn't complain without sounding like the bitch from hell. Manipulative as fuck.

Oh, and whenever he texted, he'd say something like "haven't heard from YOU in ages." even if he'd not replied to my last text. It was like gaslighting me into thinking I wasn't doing enough to stay in touch and I had to call and text him constantly, whilst he decided whether or not he wanted to reply to me.

The abusive ones seemed overly keen to get me into a social situation with 'other people' SO they could isolate me or cause drama or hassle in my day-to-day life and use others to tighten their grip and gaslight me?

'look at me, I'm the perfect boyfriend....'

Or they'd try and convince me that I 'should make up' with my abusive family.

Or they'd 'have views' on me sharing a flat with a friend, and try and cause drama where I lived, so my basic peaceful home environment was fucked.

It disturbed them that I had "independent points of view" to talk to that weren't them or couldn't be manipulated by them, who might say something bad about them.

They tended not to mind - say - younger, vulnerable types, or people in bad relationships themselves, or frenemies. More drama for them to feed off.

But Single, older, strong minded male and female friends with my interests at heart were a BIG threat to them.

Alaswad -yes he actually said that. When I challenged him about it a year or so ago, he denied saying it and said I was 'twisted' making something like that up. At the time, I just thought he hadn't a clue what was an appropriate thing to say. I am sure there was no abuse, but he did have her in a pedestal as a princess, until I came along and then he replaced her with me and now I've been replaced with OW. Actually his step father said something similar in front of me once about how one of thier nieces who was staying who was about 16 had 'even bigger breasts than A (my H's aforementioned daughter)so I guess in their family it's allowed! I did express my disgust at that time and was pilloried for being a snob and a prude.

Blamed his exes for the failures of their relationship:

Controlling
Spent to much
Wasnt allowed female friends

Turned on the water works whenever called on his shitty behaviour.

Called me paranoid when I suspected his cheated.

So glad we are over and have been for 5 years.

Tightwads.

Always insisted on coming out with me and my friends and then spoiling the whole night. I stopped going out with them.

When we had children I was only allowed out until 9 so that he could go out

Going away for a months holiday by himself every year

Never buying birthday/Christmas presents for the Dcs

Expecting all 6 of us to live off £40 a week

Going to the pub every night

Buying himself takeaways when there was no food for me and Dcs

Swearing, shouting and spitting at me

I left 4 months ago

Miranda I don't really know what you can do about that, but I would be questioning your assumption that there's no abuse going on tbh I mean at the very least there's clearly an inappropriate blurring of boundaries, and the fact that he later denied it shows that he knows it was wrong of him to say, but that doesn't seem to be stopping him. I don't know if you can go to the police about something like that when you have no concrete evidence, but maybe you could speak to social services? I'm pretty sure you can call them anonymously, and you don't have to prove anything, you can just say you have your suspicions and they'll investigate it.

Maybe someone else with more experience of similar can suggest another course of action?

I can relate to all if these... what pisses me iff though is that even though I recognise these red flags I have no faith in my ability to see normal behaviour.

its like I am so used to the crap that I can't appreciate the giod stuff.

I recently met new guy who is quite shy and cautious. but I am questioning if he likes me because there are no grand gestures or declarations of love after a week etc. .. so I am ashamed to say it seems a bit boring

how do you put all this crap aside and just enjoy it for what it is?

That's the other thing. .. all the gas lighting etc leaves me over analysing every detail in life so now again I find myself over analysing new guy.
why can't I just accept he is a genuine nice guy who doesn't want to rush in and just relax and enjoy it?

Didn't want sex with me.

Ignored me when with his family.

Was jealous of my best friend - she had "too much influence" apparently. Too right she did - she kept telling me he was a user.

Only wanted a relationship on his terms. ie wanted us to get married (and live in my house as was renting).

And the biggest red flag of all - he said my beloved dog was making my bedroom carpert smell. Well, that was it - in the end, that's all it took for me to see him for the tosser he was.

Now my lovely dog can make the carpet smell all he likes