Is this email abusive/ am I abusive?

[mayapapaya]

I am a regular poster but have changed my name for this. I am at a very difficult place in my marriage for many reasons. Some of the reasons are to do with job and family stress, and are beyond my control at the moment. The primary reason is that my husband thinks I am emotionally abusive.

The latest dispute is about whether this mail below is abusive. A bit of context. He had to unexpectedly travel for work and missed a v important event in DD's life. This is not the first time this has happened. I sent him this email because she was upset, and that got me upset:

"Can you pl arrange things with your boss so that you can DEFINITELY be here for the next event? FIX THIS. I'm sick of this."

I apologised for this "shouty" email later, but he says this is part of a longstanding pattern of abuse, which I can't recognise. I don't see that this email is all that terrible, though I recognise I should not have sent it because there is not much he can do abt the demands of the job at the moment.

I am the first to admit that I have a short temper. I have gone to counselling to try and fix it. I think I have now got my outbursts down to say three or four times a year. I try very hard, but sometimes the stress from other parts of our life spills over. My husband says I should find other ways of coping and not take it out on him. I agree. I find this easier said than done though. When I say I get angry, there is no namecalling/ no fighting in front of the children/no physical abuse. Just me losing my temper like above/sometimes speaking in a nasty tone, and so on.

My idea of marriage is that if one person occasionally blows up, the other person should forgive them if they apologise. I'd do the same with him. However, he is the type of person who stays mostly calm and then has a big blowup once a year or so. I should also mention that he hates confrontation in most areas of his life. He likes pleasant interactions everywhere; but this is something I find unviable in family life.

He is now so furious that he wants to cancel our family holiday because he does not want to go anywhere with me. He has also said really hurtful things, such as "You have been the cause of most of my unhappiness in the past few years." I really don't know what to do now. I have apologised, but he won't accept an apology. Please help.

[eddielizzard]

so he has to travel for work. happens a lot. but that's the nature of his job and sounds like it's beyond his control. i'm sure he's also unhappy at missing things.

i'm afraid that if i were in your dh's shoes and you were reacting like that to me on a regular basis, about something i had no control over, then i wouldn't be very happy.

i think you need to have a good long think about what you can both change to make things better. like no more last minute work travel things - is that actually doable? - different job? but it's really not nice being on the receiving end of someone's temper on a regular basis.

[Lweji]

Yes, powder, you may be surprised at sone point that he gets fed up with it and suddenly leaves, with you having no clue that he was unhappy.

[UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea]

All I will say is that on the rare occasion DH loses his temper and shouts it takes me days to get over it. It affects me physically, I find it unbelievably unpleasant.

Don't know why, I'm not a particularly delicate flower, but shouting and rag-losing is horrible for me.

[differentnameforthis]

However, on important occasions he's been very clear to those above him that he's either booking holiday for those days, or must be local and finish in time.

Some employees don't have that flexibility though.

[AgentProvocateur]

That was a horrible email. I'm sure he didn't choose to be away and miss the event, and was probably feeling guilty already without you sending him that.

DH and I both travel for work, and short of putting in for a days annual leave, we can't guarantee to be at home for
Important events.

[differentnameforthis]

If he ever called me on it I would have to seriously think about the relationship.

So you are allowed to be aggressive towards him, but if he dared to say you weren't being fair/nice, you would "have to seriously think about the relationship"

Controlling much!!

[Offred]

Agree it is hard to say without more information. It could be that your anger is EA or his attempt to silence your feelings is EA. I agree you seem to both be focusing on who is to blame rather than fixing it.

I don't think just losing your temper is abusive as such, it is what you do when you lose your temper - name calling, aggression etc perhaps also how often you lose it and how mad you get.

To be honest from this limited information it sounds like you are just incompatible.

He sounds pathologically afraid of confrontation, which I agree is unreasonable in life nevermind family.

I may be doing a bit of projection here but my husband is also very afraid of confrontation. I don't have a temper though, I struggle to express anger at all even when I should but I do generally try to resolve tension which he tries to avoid.

So his avoidant personality was a constant source of tension in the relationship! Vicious circle! He would tell me things about work/friends which were blatantly untrue and designed to help him avoid being assertive in some way.

We've now split up and a lot of the things which he just couldn't do (which would allow me to work and get out of being a SAHM) are now completely possible. I feel really mad that I just accepted his story that they were impossible and struggled on being really unhappy only to find his work haven't batted an eyelid at him doing them now. I can therefore really understand how conflict avoidance can really drive you up the wall.

Have you been to couples counselling? I suspect from what you say he needs to get more assertive and less avoidant as well as you learning to better control your temper.

Apart from that I think if he is being emotionally abused I would advise him to leave. He hasn't done that and that could be because he feels trapped, as many victims do. Alternatively he could be trying to abuse and control you by calling you abusive. It is tough to judge based on such a small amount of info. If there is abuse on either side though, splitting is the right thing.

[laughingeyes2013]

Your email wasn't emotional abuse in itself, but I bet your husband heard you 'shouting' with your block capitals in exactly the same way you'd shout at him if he was there in front of you.

Shouting is a form of violence. People have reported they can 'feel' punched in the face when they're shouted at. So if your husband feels shouted at in your email because he is interpreting it based on how he knows your normally say those words, I can see how he'd make the accusation. But to someone like me who doesn't hear you shout, I perceive it to be an angry message rather than abusive.

So perhaps the question is whether showing your anger is a form of abuse? I'd say no, but only if it's done properly. Trying to suppress your anger isn't healthy either, so he shouldn't expect that of you.

Some peace-loving personality types use denial and suppression to stop themselves reacting angrily, but I'm not suggesting you try to model yourself on that behaviour.

It does sound like he's being slightly passive aggressive which is another form of reacting to his anger towards you! Having said that, there are some people I wouldn't want to go on holiday with because they're shouty drama queens, and holidays, which while being lovely to have, are listed in the top 10 of life's stressful events which makes shouty people even more shouty.

And for what it's worth, your apologies may mean nothing anymore. I've notice that sometimes people think they can do and say what they want so long as they apologise afterwards.

But you're missing the fact you've caused damage and you chip away at a person each time, until eventually, maybe months, maybe years down the road, feelings have been switched right off from you. It's not always repairable, so while forgiveness is important, it shouldn't be assumed and treated like a get out of jail free card.

It sounds like you both blame each other for being miserable. You blame him for not trying to get time off work and he blames you for telling him off all the time. I agree that it this happens a lot then couple counselling may be the only way forward.

[CarryOnDancing]

Taking the opinion of anyone other than your DH on whether you are abusive is just trying to prove him wrong. If those are his feelings, they are valid and need to be investigated together.

It could be that you just clash as people as you have such different opinions on how a relationship should be.
I do however agree with your DH that a relationship shouldn't be based on one person telling the other off, especially when they have no control over something. Even if they do, you talk about it, not make demands. Ask yourself really seriously why you sent him that message and what you wanted to gain from it? Taking that one incident only it does sound emotionally manipulative (I'm not sure about abusive without more info).
You caused a confrontation and rift on an issue that couldn't be changed.

I find it interesting that you would be hurt about his need to work and see it as him somehow choosing between you and your child. Could it be that you are feeling overwhelmed and are frustrated that DH can't be available to help?
It sounds to me like you need to hold your DH closer rather than pushing him away by using texts or emails rather than communicating in person.

[JohnFarleysRuskin]

I would be furious to receive that from dh.

I would never dream of sending something like that especially if it was work commitments that ke

[JohnFarleysRuskin]

Kep

[JohnFarleysRuskin]

Aah kept him away.

Sorry :(

[MorrisZapp]

My understanding of abuse is that it's in the eye of the beholder. If your actions make somebody feel abused, then you have a problem.

That email was horrible. If my DP had sent me that I'd have been very upset. But that's me, and my feelings.

Maybe you should attend counselling together to sort this out.

[Offred]

Can I just say, I know I mentioned counselling but I wanted to clarify that when I said if there is abuse then splitting up is the right thing I meant don't go to counselling if there is abuse on either side, it won't work and may make things worse.

[LoonvanBoon]

I don't think the email is abusive. It sounds cross, frustrated & a bit bossy.

If I sent that to DH he would either tell me he didn't like the tone of the email & to stop "shouting" at him; or, if he knew he had let our child down & felt bad about it, he'd probably acknowledge that a fair point had been made & promise to sort the issue.

I really don't know about the relationship as a whole - impossible to tell from this. Most people I know do get a bit cross & snappy from time to time: it's never occurred to me that this could be seen per se as a pattern of abuse.

It sounds possible that your DH may have a very black & white view that the first person to raise their voice is always "in the wrong" & could be using this against you to justify his refusal to engage with issues & problems.

On the other hand, if he finds all confrontation unbearable & impossible to cope with, this may be a fundamental incompatibility & I'm not sure what you can do. What he said to you about you causing most of his unhappiness is very hurtful, but he could be genuinely trying to express how he feels.

I don't think personally I could live with someone whose terror of disagreement was so very strong, & I wouldn't want to feel like a scapegoat for every marital problem just because I'd got a bit cross a few times.

[scallopsrgreat]

I think that he is prepared to cancel a family holiday which would disproportionally affect and upset his children, is telling in this exchange.

[diddl]

"My idea of marriage is that if one person occasionally blows up, the other person should forgive them if they apologise."

How long should that go on for??

Especially if the "blowing up" is over things that the other person can't control?

[WhoNickedMyName]

Your email is absolutely horrible. You sent this to him while he was at work?

Your husband is telling you he's been unhappy for a few years. I think you should listen.

These 'blow ups' that you have four times a year... Are they just aimed at your husband? Are you able to control yourself and your anger with other family, friends and colleagues?

[HowGoodIsThat]

I have a bad temper and my anger can spiral very quickly - exacerbated by the time of the month hormones.

DH is very conflict-averse and has said that I can be offensively rude when in a rage. I have also seen how the DDs can flinch when I get shouty.

A few years ago, DH plucked up the courage to call me out about my anger management - or lack thereof. It was a real shock to me. Since then, I have worked very hard at getting it under control. I have tried taking vitamins and supplements to see if there is any impact on the hormonal ups and downs (not sure tbh), take more exercise which seems to help and done a lot of hard thinking about why I get angry and how to avoid my triggers (tiredness, over-committing myself, perfectionism.)

For a while, when things got tough DH held my anger as a bit of a gun to my head until I called him on that. I am not going to change overnight and I suspect that my default emotion will always anger. BUT as long as I am actively combating it, then he is more tolerant and robust on the odd times when I lose the plot.

I am now at the stage where (usually) the worst I get is moderately shouty and I have done a lot of work with the kids to help them be resilient and not quashed (I hope! DD1 told me the other day that I was getting shouty and that I needed a run!)

The upshot of all this rambling is - are you abusive? Perhaps. These things are often cumulative. Your 3 or 4 outbursts a year may feel reasonable to you but not to him if he is on the receiving end of them. It sounds like you need to talk and get to the bottom of his statement about unhappiness. You also need to debrief on your angry moments too - DH didn't comprehend that my anger is often an expression of hurt or anxiety.

If it is too much for him, you need to do more. But he can't just sit back, dump the blame on you and expect you to sort it all out whilst holding you hostage with threats of unhappiness should you slip up or have a shouty moment. You can't live like that either.

[Roussette]

I have no idea how your marriage works but it isn't easy just to "fix" things with a boss so he isn't sent on work trips at the wrong time. Sometimes it just can't be helped, he has a job/career and can't help not being there. Of course I realise it's frustrating but the email you sent was a little unfair. You are almost making him choose between his job and his family.

[MrsCosmopilite]

Hard to know without being more aware of the overall situation but the email is quite terse, borderline rude. I'd be upset to receive it BUT I can totally appreciate that frustration would make you feel like this.

I also get that work is important but since when did jobs become people's main reason to live? I think it is unfair of his boss to put upon him when it is detrimental to family life. Is it not possible in the workplace to tell one's senior that it is not convenient to go on a trip at a certain time? I know that in the past I have declined to go on business trips owing to personal circumstances.

If your anger/outbursts are akin to the email - but verbal and shouty, then I don't think that is a particular problem. There are always going to be times when someone snaps, but the frequency and magnitude of the snapping are important. As is the entire rest of the time. If 99% of the time, everyone gets along, things get done, then this is not a major problem. You've said yourself he gets annoyed and has occasional outbursts, so it's reasonably even.

The issue I see here is your H saying that you have been the cause of unhappiness over the years. That's far more hurtful than 5 minutes shouting/a snotty email. This is what you need to address, not 'blowing up'. It's what causes the blowing up that needs to be resolved.

[mayapapaya]

Thanks everyone for your very thoughtful and considered responses. I am sorry to post and run; was busy today.

Anyway, I think this whole email thing is misleading as it's clearly not just about one email, it's about a pattern of behaviour/last straw. So let's leave the email out of it and his work out of it, as I have already said that in this climate, often work commitments leave you no choice. Once I calmed down, I realised that. Yes, I should have counted to 20 before sending that mail. This is something I struggle with everyday. The poster who called it aggressive rather than abusive behaviour may have it right.

That said, I really think I have reduced my snapping/ crossness. This term, used by the poster above, is exactly right as I don't usually blow up. ( The email was a bit over the top, even for me). But I am snappy and cross, sometimes. I am trying as hard as I can to cut down on this. It's a long, hard road. I am an anxious person and he is a calm person.

However, if I am snappy/cross, I wish he would call me on it right away, something like " Hey, keep your hair on." or " I don't like your tone" rather than let it fester and become something bigger. This email was sent two weeks ago and he has only brought it up now. If I ask him to do this, he's so angry wt my aggressive behaviour that he is in no mood to make a concession.

As for his terror of confrontation, I may have exaggerated. If I had probably disagreed with him politely, he would have been fine with it. I have discussed problems with him before; the key is to remain calm which I often find hard.

I also don't think I deserve to be punished by not being spoken to for days or having the holiday cancelled though. It seems like so pointless to be so angry when life is so short. Maybe this is where the fundamental disagreement is.

[diddl]

"It seems like so pointless to be so angry when life is so short."

So apply that to yourself as well!

[mayapapaya]

Fair enough, diddl. But do you find it easy to change patterns of behaviour? I struggle with it. The last fight we had was in August. Haven't fought since then and I think I have done better. Of course, he might disagree. But its quite hard to remember things I said months ago because he won't call me out on it at the time for the sake of peace.