I am jealous (borderline obsessed) with his first wife

[WiseFiver]

Well, his only wife (first tickbox).

DP and I met 18 months ago. We are made for each other: I have waited my life for a relationship like this and he feels the same (as much as I can ever be 100% sure I know someone else's feelings). We're definitely together - no issues with commitment on either side - and generally get on really, really well. We've both been married before and have a vague plan to get married this year. Our kids are all very happily mixed up and - well, I can't believe I'm finally so happy.

So will someone PLEASE help me lose my obsession with his first wife? They were together for 15 years and it fucking kills me. It's not like they had the perfect marriage: they certainly gave it a good go, but it was (apparently - as far as I could ever know) always pretty difficult and finally floundered in 2010. They'd both been considering leaving for a few years: she finally made the break when she met someone else, which was difficult for everyone. To be honest, it's pretty much how my marriage ended and I have a lot of sympathy for the situation.

There are a few differences, though. They had loads of sex (WHY did he tell me this???). I stopped sleeping with my ex-husband (because he was an abusive bastard), so I have a fear of what I see as some all-powerful sexual connection between them. I suppose the fact that it went on for 15 years it's difficult for me (my marriage ended at 7.5 years). They also had quite an exciting life abroad ... even though he tells me the relationship was difficult, I somehow imagine them on some amazing 15 year fucking holiday in the sun.

This was all over well before he met me. She went mad when he met me and has tried to get him back (he has refused - it's come up a couple of times). He's not in much contact with her and it's mainly practical (and borderline hostile). Truly, I don't have much reason to get my knickers in a twist, but I make myself sick by thinking about her/them.

Does anyone have any help for me? I fear I'm going to mess it all up by being so hung up on the past. Sometimes, when he touches me, all I can think is, "Is this how he touched her?". I despise myself.

You really shouldn't be ashamed. That's surely going to erode your confidence further, isn't it?

Can you get irritated with yourself instead? I often have a little internal dialogue going. I chide myself gently like an older sibling might, in a kind but frank manner.

You really do deserve to be happy and loved. I think you're very hard on yourself.

At the end of the day, she tried to get him back and he didn't want her. He wanted you.

Did no-one read this part in the op;

"She went mad when he met me and has tried to get him back"

I'd feel a bit guarded if my partner's Ex did this to us.

I think you might be my Jiminy Cricket, Tinsel. I think I'll imagine your irritated voice

Hemlet!!! YES!

Thank you. That did seriously mess me up. They were 3 years post-split and she went ballistic that he had a serious girlfriend. She exercised a lot of control for a long time.

I would be a little suspicious of his motives telling you they had regular sex. That has made you feel like you have to be "super sexual" was that the intention perhaps?

It was a flippant comment on our second date, which I believe he has come to regret deeply!

But it has - unwitting or not - introduced a seam of control.

But couples do have sex, that is quite normal. It doesn't mean they liked each other ;)
I think getting some help with your feelings of inadequacy is a good idea. You don't have to put up with it.

Do you think it's partly that you were happy for your relationship to end but you can't help thinking he'd have been happy to carry on as they were before if she'd not had the affair, whereas even though your exH left you, you were glad the relationship ended?

do you think it could be you are jealous that he has happy memories you aren't part of?

If the relationship was scratchy and she felt insecure in his affection for her (and wanting him back when he met someone else, despite having left for an OM herself originally does rather imply that, at least to me), then it could have been a very dilute form of hysterical bonding, perhaps. That can happen in mismatched relationships IME, because all the conflict can make things very dramatic and a lot of sex can ensue. Doesn't mean it is a happy, healthy or even interesting dynamic.

It's an odd thing, but people in the very worst relationships I know sometimes mention that the sex is really good, as a sort of jokey excuse for staying in something so fundamentally unhealthy. And I think it's sincere. Like I say, I've come to the conclusion that it's a milder version of hysterical bonding, and not something I could ever envy. That sort of compulsive sex is very different from that you have in a sustained, enduring, happy relationship after years together, IME. The latter being more satisfying and more enriching.

I do think counselling sounds an idea, because it sounds like you are in part scared he will end up valuing you as he did her - not much. And that's either an unknowing indictment of him at some level, which you might want to explore, or aftershocks of being in such a terrible relationship before yourself... so you don't think you are worth what you have now.

OP a lot of it has to do with your own confidence rather than this woman.

Did you ever receive counselling over the abuse you went through? I understand completely the reluctance but when you go and face your demons down it is actually really brilliant in the long run. I admit to being fucking terrified first couple of sessions but it gets better.

If you were sure of yourself and by extension dp then you wouldn't have such an issue. She might become a minor irritant but nothing more than that in time.

Have you spoken to him about this? Been open in return about how uncomfortable you feel about her?

I highly recommend you go down the counselling route. It will empower you like nothing else. And I am so sorry to have read that you had to go through abuse. All the best of luck

I agree with other posters that this is mainly about your own insecurities than about the ex, and I think counselling is a sensible suggestion. You are idealising their relationship. If it had been that great they would still be together.

I don't think regular sex tells you anything, people can have a lot of sex in relationships that aren't working as it's the only thing that does work. Sex can be good in tempestuous relationships when the relationship itself is unsustainable. It can also be a sign of a slightly superficial relationship that's about physical attraction, appearance, lifestyle, good times, rather than anything deeper. So, yes I think it's a complete red herring.

However, one thing struck me and that's your P's treatment of his ex. You said:

'DP was a bit of a shit to his ex. Not abusive or unfaithful, but not terribly loving. Found her quite tiresome. I think he liked the regular sex and the lifestyle, but didn't particular cherish her (the opposite). Of course, she sounds like a draining, difficult cow to me, but ... well, we all know that there are two sides.'

It could just be that they were badly suited, she was tiresome and he wasn't very sympathetic. But I don't think it's unreasonable to fear being treated in a 'not terribly loving' way by your partner, or that he may become a 'bit of a shit' if something were to go wrong with the relationship.

I wonder if this is the cause of the fixation with the ex. You're trying to figure out ways to make sure this doesn't happen to you; trying to replicate what did work. Perhaps rather than actually fearing the ex you fear ending up being treated like her.

OP, have you read 'Rebecca'?

Hi OP,
Just coming at this from a different angle, maybe question your DP's motivation for telling you all these things about his past relationship. Is he trying to make you jealous.
Telling you about his sex life was especially crass. I'm not particularly jealous (good friends with DH long term ex girlf), but I would probably seethe at this.
Then again it could be just some issues with jealousy on your part, which I would urge some counselling just to make things easier for you. You may find as time goes on, and you are more secure, these feelings fade. Much hugs, and best of luck.

Yes, there is a lot to consider there. Thank you - DP is here and I'm pushed for privacy to reply. I very much appreciate your replies.

There is at any time on Mumsnet a crop of threads and posts from women obsessing about an ex of their partners; either she won't conveniently die, won't stop contacting her ex or allegedly has shortcomings that the current partner's still frothing about years later and bigging herself up for being 'better'.

Sitting in the middle of these sagas is a usually a manipulative man who knows exactly what buttons to press in a competitive woman who deep down believes that she must up her game in order to keep said manipulative man.

Those exes aren't the problem. If they are still spectres in a current relationship, it's only because a manipulative bloke allows it and/or an insecure competitive woman sees men as prizes to be hung on to at all costs (usually aided an abetted by a bloke stoking that sort of competition).

I don't reckon this bloke does regret telling you about the sex with his ex, OP. I'm sure that was an entirely deliberate information drop, designed to press your competitive buttons so that you'd spend your life putting him at the centre of the universe and trying to out-sex the ex. He knows you see sex as a currency (as well as hopefully something you enjoy yourself) and that you'll take pride in trying to outshine another woman. He's judged your character and personality very well, it seems. Shame you don't seem to see him quite so clearly though...

I find these competitions between women depressing and always feel sorry when those women are so easily manipulated by this type of man, but just can't see it. All their focus is on the wrong person in these dramas, every time.

Hi there Wise, I'm in a very similar position!

Been with my very lovely dp for 2 years, he has a 7 year old ds with his ex.
He told me in the beginning that they had a very adventurous sex life, swinging etc. Makes me feel uncomfortable even though it was many years ago.

She treated him like shit, numerous affairs etc.

I hate her so much, have stalked her on FB, even the mention of her name sends me into meltdown and causes an argument???

They have little contact, only for contact purposes, she's with another man.

I'm starting CBT next month because I can't go on like this! My dp is an amazing man and treats me and my dc so so well and this hatred of his ex is causing a huge problem for us.

sorry I've got no advice. Just wanted to share to try and reassure that I'm going through similar!

Leaven, whilst I agree with your post, I worked with my dp for 10 years before we got together and there had been a few rumours about his swinging life so hence why he told me.

to put the record straight I suppose?
If I hadn't have worked with him I don't think for one minute he would have told me.

He has always reassured me that he would never ask me to participate in any thing like that as he loves me too much and has too much respect for me.

our sex life is very good, very passionate but probably completely different to before. It's just something I've got to accept as his past or we can't continue with our relationship!

I think unless you have an ego the size of a small country, most people can feel a stab of jealousy when an ex is referred to in favourable terms - at least until they feel confident in their relationship themselves, anyway. That's what you need to work on I think - feeling confident in what you have now, rather than questioning what he had then which you have no control over anyway as it's in the past.

How you do that I don't know. You may need counselling - it certainly can't hurt IMO. What you can try to do though is a simple, seemingly childish thing of telling yourself every morning, in front of a mirror, that DP chose you, that you are a worthy, desirable person who is happy and has a great future. It's surprising how much this kind of exercise can help.

Also, if analysing it is just tying you up in knots, when you feel yourself plagued by anxiety and insecurity, rather than exploring those feelings (which simply keeps them in your mind) deliberately and in great detail force yourself to think about something positive about your relationship with him - or plan - again in detail - something special to do together (and then do it). The more positive thoughts and good memories you create, the less you'll worry about the competition from the past. Eventually, you can hope that when your brain starts to feel a little insecure, this process will happen automatically and actually have the effect of making you feel good about things.

Good luck.

Brilliant advice Dahlen, usefull practical stuff that I will definitely try, thank you.

But I don't think having a manipulative partner is the only cause of jealousy like this.

Of course there are people who feel pathological or irrational jealousy without anyone else's intervention.

As there are manipulative people who attempt to engender or stoke jealousy in others but get nowhere with people who are emotionally healthy and who only ever feel insecurity or jealousy when there is just cause.

But there are also unfortunately some fatal combinations when an insecure, competitive person hooks up with a manipulative character who attempts to trade on those character traits for his own ends. Which is what I think has happened here.

Jealousy is a perfectly normal and reasonable emotion when someone threatens our security and that threat is real. But what the OP and some other posters are describing is not normal or healthy- at all.

There's also an element of boasting at the start of a new relationship in order to sound interesting. His comment could be as simple as th that without reading too much into it.

X told me about his cocaine-fuelled evening with a girl who also fancied the pants off him and came onto him that evening and I thought he was a drug crazed sex addict and told him so on several occasions afterwards as I didn't want to be with someone who took drugs. In reality that was a one off experience, he is painfully shy, had been accused of being boring by other girls and was trying to make himself sound more exciting to me.

It can backfire badly as OP has indicated above!

I suffered jealousy too, didn't help that my now DH went into way too much sexual detail about ex's. (I think it's because I am easy to talk to, it's happened with other guys too). anyhow it ate away at me, i questioned everything in my head, it destroyed relationships with at least two ex's. So I got counselling, private counsellor, at a time and place convienient to me, about 5 sessions, worked a great.

I am married and happy, I doubt we would be without that counselling, I am a much happier person.