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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

A Toxic Family Christmas? Step this way...

115 replies

Hissy · 19/12/2013 17:36

“Christmas waves a magic wand over this world, and behold, everything is softer and more beautiful. ” ? Norman Vincent Peale

So sadly this is not the case for many. Christmas can be a particularly horrid time.

If this sounds familiar, and you need somewhere to come feel at home, sit, vent and ask WTF is going on, please post here or join the rest of us over at the luxuriously appointed and elegantly decorated Stately Homes Thread

OP posts:
Lottapianos · 25/12/2013 16:24

Jesus Crispy, how awful. Hope you're OK.

I'm spending Xmas with ILs, which is fine. Texted (toxic) parents 2 days ago to let them know we had arrived safely, they both replied, all fine. Now its Xmas day and not a word. I'm buggered if I'm going to contact them. They expect me to do 100% of the work in the relationship and I have had enough. They keep expecting me to atone for the terrible crime of moving away and living my own life. Well no more. This will be the year where I really truly accept that I will never have the relationship that I would like with them and get on with making myself happy

hearthwitch · 25/12/2013 16:59

hope your ok crispy. first xmas nc with the mother. happy nice and relaxed thank the gods. still time though Wine

CrispyHedgehogHoHoHoFucker · 26/12/2013 14:33

Hope you all had tolerable days if they weren't fantastic xxx

It actually went pretty well.. no dramas. I think dd was knocked off balance because I still gave her her presents, she gave me a hug, said thank you then said I shouldn't go out of my way to wind her up so much, so I left all the food in the kitchen and left her to decorate the table etc and stayed in the living room with ds's gf and the couple of friends who came who hadn't been able to get flights home so were spending it with us.

The meal etc passed peacefully then dd was going out to a party so was stuck in front of a mirror getting ready. When I was leaving she said she wanted to come and collect a dress from my house, but she never actually came.

Much better than I expected thankfully.

Today I stayed in bed til 1pm, had smoked salmon on rye bread for breakfast and a lovely peaceful day.. phone is on silent and it's bliss :o

spanky2 · 26/12/2013 14:54

Thank goodness crispy . I was a bit worried how it might go.

HissymasJumper · 27/12/2013 10:40

Crispy, is she going to put right what she damaged?

CrispyHedgehogHoHoHoFucker · 29/12/2013 20:38

Don't be daft Hissy - after all it was my fault for winding her up!

Today's been fabulous. Got up this morning to find my car has been broken into, sat nav etc stolen.

Just nipped out to the shop to get milk and bread and my bank account is empty when it shouldn't be.

Aaaarrggghhhh Angry Sad

HissymasJumper · 29/12/2013 22:34

Call the police on her ffs woman! Enough is enough!

How the fuck did she empty your account?

CrispyHedgeHogmanay · 30/12/2013 14:23

I don't think it was her that emptied my account, apparently my card has been used in Singapore???!!! The bank are sorting it.

I did report the car to the police, no idea whether it was her or not, just waiting for the management office to be open so that cctv can be viewed.

She's taken most of her things from my house now and got a job! She also said she's going to see about sorting out her housing situation this week. She will be a high priority due to fleeing dv and the police have resources to help from what I understand. Fingers crossed she's finally going to realise that she can't treat people like shit and get away with it indefinitely.

HissymasJumper · 30/12/2013 15:37

Phew! You ought to get the money back then! At least there's that going for your situation.

MichaelaS · 30/12/2013 16:08

Hello, can I join you all please? Not really use where to begin but our Christmas blew up somewhat. Was going to name change (they know I use mn) but I doubt they'll actually look and I'm not sure what exactly I'm afraid of by just telling the facts.

My DH and I have 2 kids who are the only GC on both sides. My parents are obsessed with them, completely loopy for them. I'm glad they have such a positive relationship but have been struggling for a while to put my finger on exactly what I find unsettling about it. I guess it's that I feel unheard and undermined, and my parents have so little else in their lives that they are overly emotionally invested in MY kids. My parents are very wealthy, and some years ago they gave us some money to pay off the mortgage. They did he same for my sister (single with no DC). A year or two later we decided to move house to an old large building that needed a LOT of work. Apparently this was not approved of, they were not happy for us one little bit. They have struggled and failed to keep their mouths shut about the decisions we make about our lives. I'm not really sure what I've supposedly done wrong, did they expect me to give up work and be a SAHM? To move closer to them? To stay mortgage free in London forever despite our old house being too small for 2DC?

Anyway, we had a lovely Christmas Day with DHs lot who are very low pressure, welcoming and normal. Then we went over to my parents. It was OK to begin with, the usual constant snide remarks which we are supposed to ignore (compliment fishing, saying we are free to get our own lunch then asking why we didn't eat the X instead if Y and pointed comments about oh I thought you would do Z etc etc). and the usual overwhelming attention on my DC (panic if they leave the room without an adult, panic about what the eat, panic about whose presents they will open next, not allowing them to just play with things).

DH was working up into a fury but holding it together by taking lots of time out. Having been brought up in the land if Not Talking About It I was making the best and sweeping it all under the carpet. Then came the big family party.

Too much alcohol consumed, and stupid stupid DH starts talking politics at (not with) my 87 yr old grandmother. He was rude and would not shut up. It was alcohol fueled and came out of the resentment of the past few days, but completely inappropriate and misdirected and he was a total arse. Eventually he wandered off for a topup, at which point my dad went ballistic at me. The whole "won't be treated like that in my house" stuff, which would have been reasonable if directed at DH but was not when directed at me. Apparently DH will not ever get another penny from him (we didn't expect any!) and he wants his money back (hmm, ok but it was done through a trust fund and would have to be returned to the fund not to my dad, meaning it would be an entirely spiteful gesture rather than my dad getting any money back at all. plus it would mean us selling the house, making his GC homeless). My DF also said DH is not longer welcome in his home and he would throw him out immediately if it was not for the fact I had too much to drink to be ok to drive. No mention of the fact it would also mean getting both DCs out of bed in the middle of their night.

At that point I finally rose to him (had been not engaging and staring into the corner until that point). I asked him whether the grandchildren were also no longer welcome in the house? That shut him up but he was obviously still livid.

So all the time my DF is apoplectic, my Dsis and DM try to diffuse it a bit, my DM and DF and DSis all go to bed leaving my GM and me waiting for DH to reappear. We watched TV awkwardly for 10 mins then went to bed.

I don't know who I am most annoyed with, my DH for being a wanker and for giving them a reason to blame us, or my DF for his stupidly disproportionate response. I was so upset. To top it all off, DS2 woke up just as I was going to bed and I spent most of the night giving him calpol and rocking him back to sleep every 2 hours.

In the morning DF was being unusually nice to us. DM was teary and angry. We were due to head home anyway so I just packed up the car and we left late morning.

Before we left I decided I needed to be an adult and asked DM if they were serious about having the money returned, as I would need to remortgage if they were. DM wells up, says it was a gift and no they don't want it back and because it's a gift they can't control how we use it (pointed look) and makes out its a ridiculous thing for me to suggest. And anyway DH has completely ruined Christmas, and weren't we having a nice time up until then? Well weren't we? (Compliment fishing again).

First thing in the morning DH apologised to my gran, who was actually fine about the whole thing, but somehow DM took most offence.

Last of all, apparently in the night DM fell when getting out of bed, slipping on a book left on my DS1s mattress (he sleeps on a mattress next to their bed). Hint that it's all our fault for leaving a book there. She fell onto her face and cut her lip. It was only on the drive home I wondered if this is actually true or if my DF hit her in a drunken row, in front of my DS. I would not put it past him, he has form for violent threatening behaviour when very upset. DM is a trustee of the trust fund and I can imagine an argument where he wanted the money returned to the fund, and she said no because she fears they wouldn't see the GC again, then he sees red and hits her. He HATES anyone standing up to him, and only rarely does anyone actually do it.

So now I don't know what to do. I want a bit of space from them. I don't want to stop them seeing the kids, but I don't want them undermining my parenting and manipulating me into visits and time together where we go out of our way to please them so often. And what if there was DV, I don't want DC exposed to that, but I don't expect I will ever know the truth. DS was gently questioned and doesnt seem to have seen anything. Maybe she did really fall. Or maybe not.

I would never have accepted their money if i thought it came with so many strings attached, we did not need it but were very happy to be offered it and it helped a lot. Now I would like to return it just to make a point that I will not be bullied, but sadly it would mean selling our house and I'm not sure what the right thing to do is since DM said so emphatically it was a gift not to be returned. And although DH is repentant and has apologised, I'm still disappointed in him and sad he has acted so badly. Mostly I'm annoyed he has given them ammunition to fuel their ideas that he isn't up to scratch, that I married beneath myself, that he isn't "like us" and that it will all end badly. (All of which implied, never spoken outright). It will always be referred to in every argument with my parents until the end of time, I just know it.

If only my DSis met someone and had some DCs the constant focus would be diluted at least. She will take their side, I have always been the outsider in the family. Why am I living my adult life still so ruled by my parents? Is my DHs behaviour a red flag? How do we cancel the holiday booked for the summer for everyone? Or do we go along and pretend it never happened, then minimise contact? Grrrr, so upset and annoyed.

Happy Bloody Christmas.

HissymasJumper · 30/12/2013 16:37

Bloody he'll Micheala that sounds horrific! How are you all feeling now?

I think the best thing is to sit tight and not panic. See what happens and deal with it as if occurs.

MichaelaS · 30/12/2013 18:15

Thanks Hissy. I'm still reeling TBH. I think my mother will just call one day and pretend nothing happened. Then blame me for wanting to keep things cool for a while.

I think DH and DF have fallen out for good though.

We have 3 lots of babysitting planned with them too. We could have asked others but they want to do it so we usually ask them first. All these little things keep coming to mind, like when we asked if they could have the boys one Friday night and they said yes but we are only allowed them back on Sunday. I've been laughing a lot of this off and ignoring it. And my mother constantly trying to potty train DS1 despite me telling her we are not focussing onit at the moment (he has SN).

Any time I challenge I get gaslighted or pooh poohed and ignored. History is rewritten to suit the current argument.

I'm just shocked at it all and trying to take it all in. I a struggling to see what's normal, but meeting DH and getting to know hs family has made me realise that other people don't operate like this.

Meerka · 30/12/2013 18:35

I think you are very much lost in some very peculiar family dynamics. You seem to be being guilt tripped and gaslighted.

Do take a look at this book Toxic Parents. It's very good. It will also begin to let you see why your adult life is so dominated. another good one is "In Sheeps Clothing" by Something Simon

Secondly, keep the money. You offered, you were told firmly to keep it.

Thirdly, do what YOU want to do, you and your husband. It sounds like you get manipulated into doing quite a few things you don't want to.

tbh I am not surprised your husband blew and acted badly. I imagine he really didnt want to be there in the first place and he had THREE days of this. Maybe it's time to start listening a bit more to what he wants and if he doesn't want to go back, then to choose him over your family. Even when you're heavily lost in the tangle of dark cloud that is an unhealthy family - and yours in unhealthy- the point comes where you have to choose husband over family. It sounds like that point has come.

I would cancel your part in the summer holiday. It sounds like it'll be Hell. Do you and your DH really want to go? (remember that doing what YOU want, as long as it's reasonable, is ok!)

Most of all, even if you can't fully disentangle now, start stepping back. And talk more with your DH about the situation and what both of you want.

One last note: if your father is really so domineering, it'll have a lot to do with why they still have so much influence over you when you are an adult woman with two children. People who can't accept that other people have just as much right to their own views as they do, are people to generally avoid.

GoodtoBetter · 30/12/2013 19:10

Your parents sound very controlling and manipulative. Also, if your GM wasn't offended I'm not sure what the big problem was, are you sure DH was being awful, or was your DF just looking for any excuse and you are so in the FOG and controlled by them you start to wonder if they're right and maybe you have married an arse.
My mother was very like this with my DH, undermining, bullying, sniping and trying to get me to side with her against him; he was "lazy", "stupid", "moneygrabbing" "a useless oik". But it was really that she couldn't control him the way she could control me.
I think if I hadn't started to draw back and have less contact we'd have been divorced eventually. I had a long thread on here and your post echoes a lot of it.
I would absolutely under no circumstances go on summer holiday with them. Take some time away for now to breathe and see things more clearly.Give DH a break from them. And don't give the money back. It was a gift, you are entitled to use it how you see fit. I think it was given as a method of control however and your DF is pissed off you haven't used it as HE sees fit.
My mother does this, offers stuff then tries to use it as leverage. Offers money/inheritace and the tries to use to blackmail/guilt trip. It's all about contol. My mother also did the obsessive thing with the children (only DS tho...not fussed about DD Hmm) and interfered in all aspects of my parenting and undermined me and DH on that too.

MichaelaS · 30/12/2013 19:58

Thanks Meerka you are spot on. I will have a read of a book or two on the topic. My DF is completely domineering yes, and my DM does anything for a quiet life. She only stands up to him she it's very serious, perhaps once every 5 years. He is very senior at work and well used to getting his own way in all things.

Goodtobetter thanks for your advice too. Yes I think the money was a bout gaining control. I've never been as willing to bend to them as DSis though, and so am thought of as difficult, rude and weird.

DH is wonderful 99% of the time, but occasionally drinks himself into arsey behaviour maybe once a year. I think he has some issues there but he is working on them and prepared to discuss the situation which is so unlike what I'm used to. Maybe it's time for a drink free, parent free couple of months.

DH definitely does not want to go on the holiday, and I think I agree with him. I definitely choose m over DPs, just wish it wasn't that stark. DSis will cause a lot of noise over the whole thing too.

So much to think about, it's making my head spin. Your replies really help me clear my head, thanks.

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