Feels like I'm having an affair :-(

[Gotitwrong]

Hi..........MN was so helpful to me over last couple of years during my split and divorce that I thought I would see what words of wisdom come up this time!!
I have fallen head over heals in love :-)
Known him for 10 years - he left his wife 6 months before we got together (I wasn't involved in the breakup)
He had been vey unhappily married for many years but like a lot of us stayed for his children who he loves so much and is an amazing dad.
Our relationship went from 0 to 100 miles an hour very very quickly on account of our history and we are very much in love and he truly is my best friend and soulmate. My kids love him and are very happy that he is part of our lives. He has shown us all what love is and how to give and show love :-)
The problem that I have is that he has yet to tell his estranged wife and children about us. It's causing me pain and guilt because it makes me feel like we are having an affair if that makes sense???
I know her, I know his children and it is a very tricky situation. It feels like we are being devious. Our friends and family know all about us but not them.
He did try telling her about me a few months after we got together but she went mental telling him that if he did not stop seeing me then he would never see his kids. She said that she would take them abroad where her parents live - anything to make sure that I was never part of their life's. He got scared, so scared, panicked and told her that he wasn't seeing me anymore.
That was 6 months ago and since then she has calmed down and is letting him see the kids. But I am struggling with this situation. I feel like we are living a lie. I want to be a part of his kids life's too. When he is with them then we can't talk or text and in the school holidays we can't see each other or communicate for fear of being caught. My kids keep asking to see his kids and its becoming so difficult.
He keeps telling me that he will talk again with her and I trust him 100% that he will. I know her and know what she is like so feel his fear.
Should I just let my feelings drop and just continue to sit back and wait for him to choose when the time is right??
Or should I take time out from the relationship until such time that he has done what he needs to do for us to be fully out in the open???

take time out. He is not ready to be with you yet.

Ideally take time out. Sometimes these full on relationships are so full on that it is hard to keep momentum & they burn out. Perhaps he is your transitional man to show you that men can be great but he can't commit yet so give him space.
Though to be fair,I am not that wise where men are concerned so listen to more rational people who will come on with great advice.

Thank you for your replies. I keep thinking time out but then I'm worried that he will see that as me giving him an ultimatum :-(
Luckily unlike my previous relationship I can actually talk to him and have told him how I feel and he completely understands. I'm just scared that if I tell him that we need time out while he sorts this out that he will just rush in and do it straight away for fear of losing me (he won't lose me I've reassured him of that)
I've suggested time out to give him the space and distance from me that he may need but our bond and best friend, soulmate status means that we find it so hard to not be in contact on a day to day basis.
Going cold turkey worries me that he will just jump in feet first and muck everything up with his ex and she will just flee and take kids abroad :-(
Then it would all be my fault for causing the volcano!!!

Take time out from the relationship. He has a lot on his plate finishing the relationship with his DW & securing access to his DCs, and that has to be put to bed before he can start committing himself to someone new. I'm always rather concerned about allegedly nice men who rush 0 to 100mph into new relationships on the one hand and have 'mental' exes on the other. I'm extremely concerned about men that go incommunicado when they are with their former families. If something feels wrong, it usually is wrong.

Tell him to sort out his life first, get the divorce and get the access organised and to come find you when things are more stable. No more secrecy and lies. This is not how soulmates treat each other.

"I'm just scared that if I tell him that we need time out while he sorts this out that he will just rush in and do it straight away for fear of losing me (he won't lose me I've reassured him of that)"

He's already rushing. Beware of men who rush in declearing undying love, even if you have already known them 10 years. He was on his own for only six months.... that's no time at all to be making serious decisions. You've swallowed all the usual lines about his estranged wife being 'mental', it was an unhappy marriage and they only stayed together for the kids. You totally believe the stuff about her threatening to take the kids abroad. You accept the drop in contact during the school holidays... what, not even a text? Not an e-mail? Nothing?

If you take the word 'estranged' out what you've got is a version of 'my wife doesn't understand me'... a line familiar to every OW down the ages. If he respected you he'd slow down & clean up the mess first.

Thanks I get what you are saying Cogito!!!
It is so hard to "mentally" separate from certain ex''s though!!
I find it hard to see the day that I will ever completely be free of the "mental" side of my previous marriage - so much went on leading up to my divorce and over so many years that I doubt the scar will ever heal!!
As I've said I've known him for many years and I absolutely know the reason why he is finding it so hard to talk to her!! His relationship with her (remember I know her) was similar to mine with my ex in that you just CAN'T TALK with them :-(
They do not allow you to. They do not listen or hear what you are saying-they just shout over you!!
So it's not that he is lying to me as I am fully aware of the situation - it's just I suppose when and how should he/us move this situation forward?????
Trust me there is nothing sinister in his actions/motives - I can spot a manipulator a mile off - I am a Lundy advocate :-)

There may be nothing sinister in his actions or motives but that's not the same thing as being honest. He should have the courage to be straight with everyone in the story rather than constantly take the path of least resistance.... and I include you in that.

You may have read the Lundy book but you still seem to feel obliged to keep quiet and tolerate the fall-out of his marital difficulties, making very big allowances for understandable reasons based on the similarities you see with your own previous relationship. This is a new relationship and it should be better than this. You are entitled to a happy, relaxed and exclusive experience with someone whose full attention is on you.... not him trying to keep a foot in two camps and failing ... not you settling for some half-way house either.

I agree with Cogito and would also say that you might know her but you don't know 'them' as a couple or former couple and you're not privy to the conversations.

Six months is awfully quick to get together so intensely, particularly as there are children involved on both sides. When I read your post my heart sank for you a little as it seems like you are busily 'paving the way' to make it all ok when really, it's not for you to do - it's for him to do - and he's doing it very badly. The way you've written about him is really quite excusing.

Agree that 'time out' would probably be the right thing to do for the sake of your future relationship, although it won't be easy for you. Sympathies..

Yes I know deep down you are right !!!
It's just that I know her as I worked with her for a number of years!!!
She was made from the same mould my ex-husband was and that is why I understand his dilemma :-(
She is wrong to use their children as a weapon but she is.
Even if we take time out whilst he sorts his divorce and custody agreed then the minute she knows that we are together I just know she will flee and take the children with her :-(
She is a very tough cookie and to be honest she has told him that she doesn't love him - she has a new partner and she has told him that she doesn't care who he is with as long as its not me!!!
Can you see the problem??
She is the one saying its me or his kids that he has to choose ........

"She is the one saying its me or his kids that he has to choose ........ "

And it's not your choice to make, not your dilemma to resolve, not your threat to take into consideration. This is entirely for him, his wife, their mediators, lawyers or whomever to fix between them. You are an independent, single woman with a family of your own and problems of your own. Don't be suckered into his drama just because he says 'I love you'. I realise this sounds very selfish and heartless but you really do have to look after #1 ... he certainly is.

You say you know his ex wife and by implication, can verify all he is telling you about her apparent unreasonableness but the truth is no-one on the outside can truly know what has gone on in a marriage and therefore why there is so much apparent anger and bitterness. Even if taken on face value though, most people don't behave like this without very good reason and if you know her it follows that she knows you and dislikes you and your potential influence in the children's lives. Plus she is angry and bitter towards him, presumably because of his behaviour.

All of these threats about the children are straw men in any case. The law exists to enforce children's rights to see a parent and so he should sort out a residency agreement as soon as possible. Why he hasn't done that in all this time is anyone's guess but if you seriously think that a mere ultimatum from you would propel him to jeopardise his children's rights to see him then he is certainly not a good father.

That's if any of what he's saying is true of course. If it is true it doesn't paint him in a good light at all and if it's not true then he's manipulating and lying.

Neither is a good outcome for you personally so I'd step back and also take a realism pill about 'soulmates'. He's just a bloke you happen to know.

Just seen you latest post. You haven't talked to her about this at all yourself have you?

You're just getting all this from him.

He doesn't have to choose. Those are HIS children too and he can take necessary legal steps to safeguard his access to them - and more importantly - theirs to him - as a parent.

He needs to do that. He sounds like a good dad but he can't keep doing this as it's going to result in his worst fears, sooner or later. He needs to head that off at the pass, get some proper legal advice and take it from there.

I know exactly how you feel, Gotitwrong but please don't make the easily made mistake of trying to 'problem solve' and 'paper over tiny cracks' because that just leads to a distortion of what the true picture is. I know how hard this must be for you to hear but, think of it this way - if your relationship is meant to be, imagine how much easier it will be when there are no obstacles in your path, that you can both move forward without fear of living, which you have every right to do.

What I'm saying is that some time removed from 'this' at the moment would be a positive thing. He can fully concentrate on what he needs to do to secure access to his children and then fully commit to you. It would be awful if your relationship unneccesarily fell 'between two stools' because he wasn't able to sort out his arrangements first.

I really do feel for you but please be definite about this because he seems 'dithery' for want of a better word and what he's doing is deceitful, albeit understandable. It's not good for either of your family's children.

With a shared custody agreement in place, it would be considered kidnapping for her to remove the children from this country without his agreement. Even without a custody agreement, removing them from where they are domiciled without both parents agreement, is very dodgy ground legally.
At the end of the day, that is his problem, not yours.

I cross-posted with everybody... agree with everything that they've said.

A little distance would be a very good thing right now, YOUR children are your concern, his are his.

I can see the dilemma. For now, I would just keep doing what you are doing. Hopefully after time the dust will settle a bit. I think if you were to give him time out - the poor guy would be getting it from both sides!! Personally, I would be more worried if he didn't care about his children so much.

I can't help noticing from a few recent threads that there are some very gullible women out there when it comes to family law, who believe a load of hogwash from the men in their lives about why they haven't sorted out residency for their children. Why women in this position don't do a bit of research themselves about the facts is a mystery but I should think a bubble of romantic denial and jealousy towards ex wives must be partly responsible.

Oh gosh I'm quite shocked at last posts :-(
I know it's difficult as you don't know him but I do!!
He is an amazing dad and his three boys love him to pieces.
I used to see them socially as a family - all of them together and the love between him and his boys was so obvious to see.
Their split was not because of his behaviour in any shape or form.
Yes he was the one who after many years of soul searching did the leaving but not because he was having an affair or because "his wife didn't understand him".
He left for the same reason that many of us women MN's do because he tried and failed to make the marriage work.
Neither of them were happy and she moved on very quickly to a new relationship.
Yes I know that no-one knows what goes on behind closed doors but I am also aware that sometimes a marriage fails without the need of either being "the bad person"!!!
She is not "bad" just very strong willed, a cold person with no real love in her. Please remember that I do know her. I do know him and have known both for a long time. They were just not suited.
He is going through collaborate divorce - she won't do mediation!
He is prepared to give up everything financially to make sure his boys stay in their home. He pays her far more money than he has to to make sure they carry on living as they used to. She does not work any longer yet still uses kids as a weapon even though she has moved on and is happy she will not let him move on!!!

If there's 'no real love in her' how come he married her and had 3 kids with her.

Come on now, you're being thick.

Personally, I think you need to tell him to go away, sort out his divorce and then start again.

None of that is an excuse for not sorting out a residency agreement by now.

He isn't a slave to what his wife demands and when there are (idle) threats being made, collaborative divorce is patently unsuitable and not in the best interests of the children.

Do you understand that this is about children's rights to see both parents and not his rights to see his children? It's a fundamental point.

Gotitwrong... I realise that the posts have shocked you, you were expecting support. You're getting it, if you did but know, even though it might not feel like it.

Can you take what you've written in your posts and mark clearly which statements you know for FACT and which statements you've been told/have assimilated from your partner. Nobody is telling you what to do, there's nothing that YOU need to do at all, but it's a very bad thing to be so besotted by somebody that you're blinded to the reality.

Your partner might well be all the things that you've said - and more. But he needs to sort this out, not you. I can see that some of the things said here have hit you like a 'sucker punch', but really, how could they? If you knew these comments do not have even the slightest basis of possibility, you wouldn't have a single niggly feeling, would you?

Be very aware of what you KNOW and what you're TOLD - and don't confuse the two. People distort for all sorts of reasons, not all of them necessarily 'red flags', but distortions all the same.

" she will not let him move on!!! "

Won't let him? I'm currently in an argument with my DM about my uncle who has neglected to stay in contact with his children for decades because his new wife 'won't let him'. To me that's a really poor excuse for not doing the right thing.

He's not doing the right thing by you and he's lying to his ex. Whatever his motivation for doing so, that is not the action of a man of integrity.

I'm wondering whether some of this is that the kids would find it uncomfortable to hear that the woman they saw as a 'family friend' but who detests their mother, is now seeing their dad. As she allegedly dislikes you just as intensely, it's not a recipe for stepfamily heaven is it? If he were posting on here, I'd be advising him to ditch the soulmate nonsense and wait a while before meeting a woman without any history and baggage connected to the family.

Did she ask him to leave? Is he still waiting in the wings in case her new relationship fails?

The thing is his children have a right to see him and he can have that recognised legally. She can't just move away and so her threat is empty. That being the case why is he still saying he can't tell her on account of his access being compromised?

Why does she dislike you? Are you actually sure she does or is this something he has told you.

If he is capable of lying to her then he is capable of lying to you.

My instinct? You are his back-up plan.