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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

"But We Took You To Stately Homes!" - Survivors of Dysfunctional Families

999 replies

DontstepontheMomeRaths · 04/01/2013 14:12

Thread opener here: webaunty.co.uk/mumsnet/ Smile
You may need to right-click and 'unblock' it after downloading it.

It's January 2013, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012

Please check later posts in this thread for links & quotes. The main thing is: "they did do it to you" - and you can recover.


Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see <a class="break-all" href="http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/440839-but-we-took-you-to-stately-homes-a-thread-for" target="_blank">original thread here</a> (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/angry/hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/lifetime experiences of being hurt/angry etc by our parents? behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's. 

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn?t have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/or current parental contact has left you feeling damaged falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth. 

You might also find the following links and information useful if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0553814826/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0553814826&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.</a>

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect you feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defenses that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety will undoubtedly us it during confrontation to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behavior. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offenses against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behavior. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get," or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ....

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realize that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.alice-miller.com/index_en.php" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Alice Miller</a>

<a class="break-all" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personality_disorder" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Personality Disorders definition</a>

Follow up to pages first thread:

I?m sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don?t claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support.

Happy Posting (smithfield posting as therealsmithfield)

I have cut and pasted this because I think it is fab. Just in case anyone misses the link.

More helpful links:

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.daughtersofnarcissisticmothers.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Daughters of narcissistic mothers</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://outofthefog.net/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Out of the FOG</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.vachss.com/av_dispatches/disp_9408_a.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">You carry the cure in your own heart</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.havoca.org/HAVOCA_home.htm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Help for adult children of child abuse</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.pete-walker.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Pete Walker</a>

Some books:

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0749910542/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0749910542&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Homecoming</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/1439129436/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=1439129436&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Will I ever be good enough?</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0060929324/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0060929324&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">If you had controlling parents</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0385304234/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0385304234&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">When you and your mother can't be friends</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/1572245611/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=1572245611&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Children of the self-absorbed</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0671701355/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0671701355&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1650915-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Recovery of your inner child</a>
OP posts:
CreepyLittleBat · 29/01/2013 17:17

I'm glad she didn't split you up permanently! That would be awful - my parents hate my dh too - probably 'cos he is the same age as my vile brother, but a decent human being. And of course our dear parents always love us more when we're down, don't they? Angry
Are you actually going on this holiday? It doesn't sound like it will be a holiday for you if you have to deal with this horrible behaviour going on.

CreepyLittleBat · 29/01/2013 20:59

I whisked the dc to a cafe straight after school - a very rare treat, they loved it. Came home to find 324234 bags of Xmas presents on the doorstep from my parents. (Who were witholding them until we danced to their tune and visited/let them visit - seems they gave up on that) So now I feel like the bad guy. And had to sit there smiling while they unwrapped piles of nice stuff. Thinking you could have been there to see them open it if I could trust you not to make a scene in my house and mess with my toddler's neural pathways. Sad

chocoholic89 · 29/01/2013 21:05

Not your fault so don't feel bad.

FairyFi · 29/01/2013 22:05

please don't feel bad creepy you had a great time avoiding them! nice one! and the kids came home to piles of xmas presents as an post xmas bonus! (if they weren't such idiots twisted twats they'd have let them have their presents at xmas like everyone else's kids!). No blame on you, think you managed that superbly... congratulate self, definitely!

Hope you are feeling a bit better today Choc? continued good wishes for feeling better and stronger in the face of your Narcs who want your money

FairyFi · 29/01/2013 22:08

strength and good wishes to all suffering the atrocities of their biological creators, who, laughingly, refer to themselves as parents

Tiggy114 · 30/01/2013 20:30

Can i join? This group has been recommended to me tonight as i was asking on here about my very disfunctional relationship with my parents, and in particular my father. I am rying to work through my issues and go on with my life.

CreepyLittleBat · 30/01/2013 20:37

Thanks Fi, nicely put!

Welcome Tiggy, sounds like you've come to the right place. Smile

Tiggy114 · 30/01/2013 21:49

I have cime to the conclusion today that my father is an emotional abuser and that i have this sureal need to make him happy at the expense of my own families happines. This is a revelation. My father is constantly telling me he's dissapointed in me. He's never said he's proud. He tells other family members i'm lazy and no good. I then start believing this of myself. His behaviour, i now think, has lead me to a relationship with an out and out emotional abuser, but thats a whole other story. The thing that gets me is that i will go to extraordinary lengths to try to make him happy. I even persuaded my new boyf to buy a house nearer to him to try make him happy! My mum is also a difficult person. She has lied and done some terrible things like paying someone to split me and an ex up! My father has now written me out of his will as well. I'm hoping to join here, read some of your stories and hopefully work through my own thoughts if thats ok. This is all new to me as it never occured before today that many of my problems can be attributed to my fathers behaviour.

chocoholic89 · 30/01/2013 22:49

T welcome! I'm sorry to hear about your parents. U will get as much support as u need on here it does help coming letting off some steam when u are feelings low/angry/stresses ect...iv recently decided to have No contact with my parents because I'm hurt so much by them that's where I came across mn and found it very appealing..Keep posting u will feel stronger eachday.

Tiggy114 · 31/01/2013 10:38

Arghhhh. My car broke down the other day so my dad brought the neighbour (a mechanic and family friend) up this morning to take a quick look. I'd been out to clean the rubbish out this morning and left the keys out on the table outside. My dad turns up and shouts at me in front of the neighbour like i'm 5. Something along the lines of: " wheres your keys? You can't find em can you. No. Because you left them outside on the table (in a very sarcastic tone). I hate this. He makes me look stupid and thick. I have taken the step of booking a GP appointment and i'm going to ask to be refered to a councillor to sort myself and my feelings out. This cannot continue. I'm 33 ffs!

HotDAMNlifeisgood · 31/01/2013 11:23

Your father undermines you openly in order to feel superior, and better about himself.

Your mother paid someone to split you and a partner up? Shock

Your father has written you out of his will.

Can you articulate why you are still in touch with people who treat you so very badly? You don't deserve such treatment, Tiggy. No-one does.

Tiggy114 · 31/01/2013 12:22

It's because of the kids. My kids adore them and they babysit for free. My dad has left all his money in his will to my kids, cutting me and my brother (and his kids) out of the will. My son has special needs and would be distraught if he didn't see them as he's very attached to them. So i can't just cut ties. I need to rise above it instead and not let it bother me anymore.

Tiggy114 · 31/01/2013 12:26

Oh and the paying thing. I still don't know to this day what happened really. My ex had a twin who would go outside and smoke with my ma. So they kinda got on at some level. Behind her back he would have a bit of banter saying he fancied her. Which we all laughed off. He came over one night and showed us a cheque for £100 she'd been to his house and something had gone on, resulting in her giving him a cheque and paying him to help split me and ex paetner up. I still don't know what happened that night and my mum won't talk about it but it goes to show how warped her thinking is. Who would do that?

AttilaTheMeerkat · 31/01/2013 13:15

Tiggy

I found this recently written article about toxic parents who become grandparents. It may be of some use to you.

Personally I would not go anywhere within a million miles of either your toxic father or mother; they are both awful to be around. Why subject your children to them at all?. They cannot and will not treat you as their mother at all decently; they all too clearly see how you as their mum are treated by them. Children adore grandparents no matter how crap and toxic they are; they need positive role models, not this toxic twosome. I would seriously now consider protecting your children from them as much as possible, they are too young to realise how manipulative they are.

"Should you tell your children about your toxic parents, their toxic grandparents? What should you tell them and how?

Imagine that your parents no longer abuse you physically or sexually, but they still demean you, scapegoat you, ignore or scorn you, make nasty, hostile, sarcastic remarks and put-downs, and let you know that you?re not good enough. No matter what you do or don?t do, you?re wrong. They take charge of your life when you see them and break appointments whenever they feel like it. Their wants and feelings are the center of the world and you don?t count.

Imagine also that you used to think that if you told them, in just the right way and at the right time, how hurtful their treatment was and is, they?d stop. Or that you used to think your job was to rise above that treatment because they?re your parents, they?re getting old, they?re suffering, they deserve a little peace and happiness, and you owe them.

When can you stop trying to build bridges? When can you cut off communication? When can you tell your children why?

Harassment, bullying and verbal, physical and sexual abuse is usually multi-generational. Families help perpetuate the abusive behavior by keeping secrets and telling lies. If you give them a chance, your parents will likely do to your children what they did to you. The old wounds still throb even if your parents are nice sometimes. They still bleed when your parents repeat the same old treatment even now.

When you grow up, you may vow to break the cycle and treat your children better, but how can you protect them from the example they see of their grandparents still bullying you or them now? And how can you stop obsessing on your childhood trauma or yesterday?s verbal battering?

Once you?ve tried everything you can think of, every approach, every sweet way of suggesting or speaking truthfully (say, a thousand times) and your parents (or step-parents) still protect each other, perpetuate the lies and tell you that you?re nasty and crazy, I think that?s enough.

Protect yourself and your children, turn your back to them, and create a safe and wonderful island of life for your family. That means that your parents don?t get on it.

Some suggestions:
?Always remember the effects on your life and how they tried to crush your spirit. Don?t let a running, internal debate about them suck all your energy down a black hole. Stop negative self-talk; it?ll only discourage and depress you, increase self-doubt, destroy self-confidence and self-esteem, keep you fixated and stuck, and take your eyes off the great future you want for yourself and your family.
?You don?t need more understanding of them. You don?t need to save them from themselves or each other. Don?t be their therapist. Let them fix themselves on their own time and their own bodies; not yours.
?Spirit counts more than biology. Start calling them by their first names. Don?t give them titles they don?t deserve, like ?Grandma? or ?Grandpa.?
?Don?t argue or debate with your parents. You?ll never convince them that you?re doing the right thing. Bullies always want what they want ? to feast on your feelings and flesh. Simply tell them that they?re off your island. Take steps to cut off communication. Change your phone numbers and e-mails. Move if you have to.
?Tell your children what?s age appropriate. They don?t need the gory details when they?re six, but they do when they?re sixteen. Gather them together and make it a serious occasion. The framework is that they need to know how to protect themselves and to set standards for their own behavior. Don?t go into psychoanalytical reasons why your parents did it or why they, and maybe the rest of the family, collude to protect them. That?s obvious. You?ll probably have to re-visit the conversation.
?Be invulnerable. That?s the term coined by Victor and Mildred Goertzel in their study of the lives of more than 300 famous 20th-century men and women. Instead of finding that these highly successful people had wonderful parents, they found that many had agonizing childhoods spent in bleak, troubled homes, including domineering, alcoholic, rage-aholic or neglectful parents. They described the children who succeeded, despite a psychologically damaging childhood, as resilient or invulnerable.
?Be a model for your children. Show them that abusive behavior drives people away. Show them how to stand up to abuse, which sometimes means creating distance instead of being sucked into a battle that ties up your life.
?Create a new family including new elders; a family of your heart and spirit. Have so much fun, bring so much joy that there?s not a hole anymore that would be filled with thoughts of biological grandparents".

AttilaTheMeerkat · 31/01/2013 13:18

A percentage of the general population is dysfunctional and/or abusive. That percentage, like everyone else, has children. Then those children grow and have children of their own. The not-so-loving grandparents expect to have a relationship with their grandchildren. The only problem is, they?re not good grandparents.

Many adult children of toxic parents feel torn between their parents? (and society?s) expectation that grandparents will have access to their grandkids, and their own unfortunate firsthand knowledge that their parents are emotionally/physically/sexually abusive, or just plain too difficult to have any kind of healthy relationship with.

The children?s parents may allow the grandparents to begin a relationship with their children, hoping that things will be different this time, that their parents have really changed, and that their children will be emotionally and physically safer than they themselves were.

Unfortunately, this is rarely the case, because most abusive people have mental disorders of one kind or another, and many of these disorders are lifelong and not highly treatable. (Others are lifelong and treatable; however, many people never seek the necessary help.)

The well-intentioned parent ends up feeling mortified for having done more harm than good by hoping things would somehow be different ? instead of having a child who simply never knew their grandparents and who was never mistreated, they have an abused child who is now also being torn apart by the grief involved in having to sever a lifelong relationship with the unhealthy people they are very attached to.
.

If your parents were not good parents and you are considering whether or not to allow a relationship with your children, consider the following factors, as well as others, before deciding:
?Have they fully addressed their issues in SKILLED long-term therapy? (A few weeks or months is nowhere near adequate if your parents regularly mistreated you).
.
?Have they been treated for all the root causes of their dysfunction or abuse?
.
?Have they sincerely apologized and made amends for the hurtful things they did? Not just said, ?I?m sorry?, but really talked it all through with you over many hours? time?
.
?Are they very different people to you from the ones you remember?
.
?Do you currently have a healthy, functional and stable relationship with them?
.
?Do they respect your choices and boundaries as a parent? Do they follow your requests about how you want your children to be treated and to behave?
.
?Would you recommend your parents to your best friend as babysitters without any hesitation or worry, and feel comfortable giving your word that they?d never harm your friend?s child, without any doubt?
.
?Have you worked through all of your feelings about the mistreatment you experienced through your parents?

.
These are just a few of the important questions to answer. The best plan is to work through the matter with a therapist of your own, who has no bias toward trying to ?keep families together? despite the presence of mistreatment.
.

More Here: lightshouse.org/lights-blog/toxic-bad-abusive-grandparents#ixzz2JYhyClvi

Badvoc · 31/01/2013 13:29

Hello all.
Well, am back in touch with my parents, it very much in my terms. Which is odd, but nice.
Went to see them a couple of weeks ago.
Told them how upset and hurt I was over Xmas day and - frankly - my entire childhood! And as expected they denied treating me and my siblings differently.
Sigh.
So.
Mum is waiting for her op. it's a major one.
The kids go and see them.
I took mum to the docs on Monday - don't know why my sister couldn't but there you go.
Still not speaking to my sister. No great loss.
She will talk to me again when she wants something, no doubt.
All in all, I feel ok ATM. I am back in touch, but but very much on my terms and they know that.
It won't ever be how I want it to be, but that's ok.
I will make sure I never put myself in that position ever again. If I expect nothing they can't ever disappointment, can they?

FairyFi · 31/01/2013 13:48

and I think that 'core truth lie ' that is instilled that you will be responsibe for their NB, or suicide, etc. if you go NC or resist, or tell others of any misdemeanors.

BiddyPop · 31/01/2013 14:34

I had to ring my mum last night (as MIL was on phone and we needed input of a grandparent for homework). She immediately asked if I was feeling "better" after last Sunday, trying to make out it was a big screaming match and I was unreasonable (there were no raised voices I just wouldn't let her interrupt me, for a change).

I didn't get into it, but she still managed to leave me feeling down after it (I had to go back on once DD was finished to do the goodbye, but she wanted to chat and I couldn't just hang up for another few mins) and the delay also meant DD started to get giddy when we needed to get to bed. So I ended up shouting at her (just one yell of her name when she hadn't listened to me telling her to go up and bringing her with me) which I hate. And once I got HER to bed, I just didn't feel like eating so went to bed myself (we have swimming after school etc on Wed so it's always manic and I aim to feed her first and I eat once she's in bed to try and stave off meltdowns anyway).

I will do better, but I need rest this weekend once DH is home. And not ring her until middle of next week.

snoopdogg · 01/02/2013 10:08

Help. I know this a run of the mill issue for us lot but need a strategy.

My mother is toxic. My older sister has formally severed all ties leaving me and little sis to deal with her - I think we're both jealous of big sis getting in there first and now feel it would be betraying each other if one of us pulled out, if you see what I mean.

Anyhow, in November my mother had one of her regular meltdowns at me over some perceived wrong I had committed, lots of shouting, criticism, character assassination etc. I stood up for myself, told her she was wrong, that the issue had nothing to do with her and politely ended the conversation. Cue frost, breaking off comms (yeah!) refusal to engage. Did not see each other over Christmas, no cards or presents for the kids.

Now she phones up all chatty, wants to visit, wants to stay for a week!!!!! I was so wrong footed I sort of fell into agreeing then it snowed and I was reprieved - she lives quite a long way away.

She's started calling to re-org and like the great big grown up I am I'm avoiding her call.

I don't particularly want her to come, she'll be the usual pita, she'll bring her horrid dog who sleeps on her bed and shits everywhere, she'll spend all day watching tv, eating sweets and complaining that it's too cold. I could go on.

Tell me what to do, I'm being so fucking passive I'm pissing myself off. I know it's learnt behaviour but I'm struggling.

Script please, please (whiny and needy).

FairyFi · 01/02/2013 10:20

hello snooop

Does sound to me like you are all trying to travel in the right direction! - away from her. Just keep going. I think ignoring the call is the best way and the grown up thing to do when she won't accept or hear your words anyway. You clearly don't want her or her shitting bedsleeping dog there, so stick at it.

Your Dsis will have to pull herself out. I know that seems selfish, but if really is up to her to get out and save herself - every girl for herself in this situation. and good on your older DSis for jumping ship already!

Are you feeling more back on script? keep strong and good luck staving off persistent ignoring narcM and shitty dog Wink

FairyFi · 01/02/2013 10:55

Hello to everyone else.. .havn't had time to keep up with latest posts as ibit ground down with own stuff and feeling overwhelmed at the mo (going to some classes that are quite difficult, bringing past pains) Sad and very tired from very emotional day yesterday.

Thinking of you all and keep strong xx

Midwife99 · 01/02/2013 12:04

Yes me too - stuff going on withDS2 which takes my focus well away from parents. But my mother left a voicemail today telling me they're leaving a bday present for DD outside my front door at some point. Haven't asked how DS aged 19 is though (he severed tendons, arteries & nerves in his arm 4 weeks ago & had 9 hours of surgery & in hospital for 2 weeks. They know about this but it doesn't suit them to mention it because they can't use it as a way to turn up uninvited because he doesn't live at home! Selfish buggers!

FairyFi · 01/02/2013 13:57

sorry to hear midwife Your poor DS2 Sad I really hope he gets on ok recovering with all that! (and the ladlefuls of shock too I imagine?) and you supporting through it all... They are soooo selfish.

I just came back, because I have been using todays recovery day [for me] to indulge in the tonic of laughter to help me let go of yesterday's difficulties, plus I have managed to master the skill of the MN hyperlink! - alright, I know, its not so hard.

So, here goes for any in need of a cheer up, or a lift today:

photographerlady · 01/02/2013 14:27

Hello there, I have been reading and lurking here and wanted to know if it be okay to ask for some advice on a starting point on how to limit communication gracefully with my mother.

I am 16 weeks pregnant and for the last 12 weeks since telling my mother she rings and texts me about 10-15 times a day. She is still insisting to come over this summer when I'm expecting my first child.

Prior to this, like the majority of the last 12 years I have visited about once every 2 years and calling mainly at holidays. My mother and I do not get along and the last few years she is pushing and pushing to "be close". I grew up in a violent and scary household. My mother would change mood at the drop of a hat. She would grab for plates and knives, bust windows and scream at the police. Child services seemed to not of existed 30 years ago, my brother and I would cry as my mom would go from telling the police to arrest my father then driving drunk with us in the car to find him. Sometimes leave me in the house for days on own at eight cause she left with my brother and my dad had no idea I was there (police said for him to stay away from the house). In honesty my father and her were just as bad as each other but he always directed his arguing and upset at her and their relationship. She always drug us in the middle of it, she would have us meet men she was seeing behind his back and enjoy us telling her friends that "daddy is a deadbeat". My parents have never separated aside from the odd weeks she go to her parents with my brother after a fight.

As an adult I am struggling to have a relationship with her. They live in another country but we make it about three days til she turns on a dime screaming at me telling me she hopes I live with regret that we aren't close. Couple of months ago my mother called the entire family she overdosed on pills and they rushed her to the hospital, thankfully she was lying but did take quite a few Ativan (spelling) a medication she has been abusing for over ten years and does not go a day without taking a few. My dad is such a buffer in all this.

She told me she's coming a month before the baby arrives and coming alone. I have tried talking to her that I be more comfortable that she come with my father. I am trying to suggest that things will be hard with a newborn, post hospital and breast feeding but she continues to tell me she's coming. I have tired to politely tell her "no you are not coming alone", I have asked them to come later in August or September together but as the weeks go on and the constant messages and ups and downs she is having (if I try to say I like her to not come in June she flies off the handle).

I feel like my strength in this is weening now more than ever, I ignore the messages on my phone when it gets to much but then she messages my DH and he tries to make the best of the situation.

Midwife99 · 01/02/2013 14:36

Fairy - I can't do MN hyperlink so you must just be v clever!! Grin