My mother hates my husband (long)

[badtoworse]

I don't live in the UK. DH is from the country we live in. Mum came to live here (divorced and then later my father died) some years ago in a house a short drive away. Soon decided it was a big mistake and that she hated it, then to complicate matters then injured her back and became really unable to manage living alone. We sold my house and we moved in with her. All coinciding with me starting a new business venture and DH becoing unemployed. DH has bascially been unemployed (except for a couple of short contracts) since then. When we all moved in together DS was 20 months (now 4.5) and we've since had another child who's 1.5.

Before we all moved in together I was about to go back after mat leave and all set up (at her suggestion) for mum to have DS while I worked and DH at work. DH lost his job three days before I went back but mum said she still wanted to come up in the afternoons cos she wanted to see DS. She (much later) claimed DH had sat on the coputer and let her do it all. He said (we had a big row about it then) he only sat on the computer while DS napped.

My business has been slowly dying a death so I'm going to be WOH from Monday (previously ran busness from home). Yesterday I had meetings all day. DH supposed to be looking after DCs for the afternoon while I'm out.
I told him not to let my mum do too much, to imagine she was not there as it's too much for her. When I came home I asked mum (who I saw first on coming in) how things had been and she pulled a face and said tell you later.
Asked DH if he'd let DS just spend the whole afternoon with my mum and he said, only a bit while DD asleep..she slept for almost 2 hours. Then I ask mum and she says that he'd sat on the laptop and told DS he couldn't play as he'd wake the baby up and she'd felt bad so spent 2 hrs entertaining DS while DH sat on laptop.

I was really pissed off as I'd asked him specifically not to do this and we had a row.

He says she's exaggerating and that he can't believe I'm questioning his parenting abilities/calling him a neglectful parent and talking about him behind his back. He says DS wasn't with her the entire time, he was in and out and he didn't tell him he couldn't play, just that he had to be quiet as the baby was asleep.

She says he's a lazy git and it's the same old shit as all those years ago, she's had enough and would go back to the UK if she had the money. They've been avoiding each other all day and I feel totally caught in the middle.

I'm so angry that he did exactly what I asked him not to but I can't stand this atmosphere, it's like I'm being asked to choose, my husband or my mother.

badtoworse, I just read all of this, and I think you are doing great. My mother is similar to yours, and reading all of the advise and links people have posted to you have helped me out too.

Anyways, I want to reassure you about your mother living alone with her disability. I have a lot of friends with disabilities much worse than your mum, who live on their own, quite happily too I might add. Most of them do have someone come in and do housekeeping, but they all prepare their own meals. Even if it is a frozen store dinner zapped in the microwave on the bad days.

And she is able to afford help should she need it, so she will have to decide what she wants more.

Good luck with your move.

I'm glad it's helping Endorphins. This thread has been my lifeline. I always knew my mum was "difficult" and that we had a bit of a weird "too close" relationship and that she depended on me too much, but it wasn't until these last 2 arguments and this thread and then reading all about narcissists that I really understood a lot of what had been going on for so many years. She has a lot of narcisstic personality traits.
Today has been reasonably quiet. She was using that smelly polish for cleaning silver earlier and then gave me her little silver baby bracelet and mine (not sure why she had it) all tearful...I could give it to DD when she was older. I thanked her and ignored. I'm doing a sort of rerun of xmas dinner today with a ready prepped meat thingy ad then hopefully we'll go out for a bit later. DS still being a bugger except for her or when we're out.
Was looking at online shopping last night with the big hypermarket 20 ins drive away and it's amazing, you can even order homewares and all sorts. They have an "international section" which I've seen in store, but they seem to have even more products online...they even have paxo stuffing! It's really easy to use as well and there's a photo of every item and they deliver to this address for 6 euros. So, really NO excuse.
There's more to tell you, but need to get on with dinner..will try to get back on later.
Thak you all ladies for all your help...you're wonderful...xxx

Exactly right response to the bracelet, badtoworse. Polite but without opening the conversation up to any 'of course I won't ever SEEEEE YOUUUUUUU AGAIIINNNNN' stuff.

Sounds like the hypermarket's website should be fine for her to use - if you have Google Translate installed it will even have a go at converting the site into English.

Thanks tribpot things quiet this afternoon. Over lunch the topic of stuffing came up (the stuffing I used was a packet DB posted) I mentioned you could get it online from the hypermarket even though I've never seen it in store. She asked if I'd show her the online shopping sometime and I said it was v easy and had loads on the site. Said she'd be more interested in using the hypermarket than the other online chain as it has a better range of products. All v civilised and polite....so who knows, we might yet come out of things ok.

That bracelet thing is contrived.

The nicey nicey online shop thing too.

Be ready. It will come.

As soon as she realises you ARE really moving out most likely. Stay cool, calm and focussed.

Feliz Ano Nuevo para todos! .... Ooh and Feliz Natal for the 6th isn't it?

Aye Hiss I'm sure you're right that shit will hit the fan once I say we're actually moving on such and such a date. I see what you mean about things being contrived. I do think she feels miserable and melodramatic and bad about what's happened and what's to come. But it doesn't even matter really because the end result is the same....it's still all about her and what I am supposedly doing to her. It's still all this melodrana and crying and wringing of hands but no apology. If she'd calm down a bit she'd probably quite like the online shopping...she loves using amazon and likes shopping in general.
I was thinking how she obviously doesn't think DB and I have much contact....has no idea I got in touch with him right at the start and am in daily contact....is that not weird?
Feliz año nuevo and feliz reyes a todos ....DS will be getting loads of presents from dh's family the three kings on the 6th.

Bad to worse, this thread has been eye opening, I'm shocked and delighted for you, and can see how far you have come.

I always see these long threads on MN getting longer and think, I won't open that one, I haven't been in since the beginning. I wont have anything to add, i wont be up to date in the thread....

I've been in bed ill so opened yours.

I'm really glad I did. I had no idea about narcissistic people although I see the word used here sometimes. My grandmother was like your mother, my father has some traits and my sister is ..... Well I'm going to read up more about narcism before I label her.

I shall perhaps plough through the stately home thread, never realised what it was about and always thought it was some MN joke thread.

Your little family sounds lovely, and your DH and you now have some time to grow. One step one day at a time. You juggled so much on your plate already, you're nearly there.

Well done you.

Yes, it never ceases to surprise them that siblings actually talk about things.

I heard that all toddlers are Narcissistic in a way as their entire life is all about them (through youth and perception naturally) they throw tantrums to get their own way, they cry, they beg, implore.

Someone once stated that Narcissists are toddlers that never grew up. they STILL think the world is all about them and they will throw their toys out of the pram the very minute it isn't. Like children, Narcs think that the moment you are out of their sight, everything stops, and they believe they are in control of everything. When it crosses their mind that you have had other ideas, it sends them into panic.

With children you have to be focussed, calm, fair and firm. Losing it in front of them is counter productive.

Narcs are no different except in one respect. You don't HAVE to be in their company, you owe them nothing. Toddlers eventually grow out of it, Narcs just get better at it. Ultimately Narcs need to be left well alone, there is no hope for them, as they won't ever see anyone elses point of view. They lack emotional intelligence, and they lack empathy. Unless it suits them to have it to score points for a later date.

Just my musings mostly, no scientific basis....

It might not be scientific Hissy but it's spot on about the childish thing. DB said when he phoned her and she ranted at him about me it was "childish and petty" and I've found it has helped me enormously to see it all as a tantrum. The last big row we had in September, she seemed to think I wouldn't/was unreasonable to talk to DH about what was her, basically slagging him off. DH kept saying to me "does she think we don't talk, or what?" I find that aspect bizarre.
Going to drop some more documents over to the estate agent tmrw and see if I can find out any more info about dates for signing a lease. Also going to see a lovely friend who knows my mum a bit and who I've spoken to before about struggling with living with mum and her bouts of misery. DS will be with me so will have to speak in code a bit, but will be nice to see her.
There are so many things I have been avoiding doing since we moved in here. I've had hardly anyone to the house cos I find it awkward. She always comes and says hello and then starts chatting and ends up going on and on and I find it embarrassing so stopped inviting anyone. Will be nice to be able to offer to have DS' friend over to play. Just realised that as well, she dominates conversations and has these anecdotes she tells over and over again, drives DB in particular mad.
It's so mind blowing how many people have posted on this thread to say her behaviour's not normal or justified too...helps me keep things in perspective and the guilt at bay.

Sorry to hear you have some of the same shit going on in your family, Shattered. It's all a bit mind-blowing when you see it for what it is.

I'm in a strange limbo at mo. I'm nowhere near as raw as you, I think I have mainly dealt with my emotions. But there have been bits in this thread that left me slack jawed in a realisation.

So it's kinda opened a new can for me. See you in stately perhaps???

Off to see a friend later and will pop by the agency first and see if I can find anything out.

Keeping fingers crossed there's news from the agency. Remember what you posted up thread- anyone who you've mentioned this to in RL is horrified by how she's been getting between you and DH. Stay strong.

So, more nonsense today. Avoided her all morning by going to see a friend on the other side of the city. Come home at lunchtime and there's post for her, which she pointedly tells me was a xmas card from my cousin and her new cahoot card. Not sure what that's about, but there's always a subtext.
Then over lunch she says she's been on hypermarket online and prefers it to the other online shop as hypermarket lets you on without registering. What difference it makes I don't know..if she's going to use it she'll register anyway, no?
But she can't find greek yoghurt, she's been into alimentacion nd then into lacteos and then yogures (like this is all such a hassle) but there aren't greek yogs anywhere. This wound me up because it's more guilt tripping bollocks...I'm so pathetic I can't find the greek yoghurts on the website. it feels so petty to even write it. I said, yes they're there...she carried on and I said "they're there because I've seen them". She went all injured and offended "I was only chatting" No you weren't, you were doing the pathetic woe is me guilt trip bollocks again (I didn't say that). So i said, I'm sorry if I was sharp. She said "Don't worry Bad I'm more than used to it" and did the silent weeping thing.
Three weeks tomorrow this has been going on. I'm back at work on Tuesday. Sometimes I really really verge on wanting to never see her again as long as I live.
Still waiting for confirmation on the rental. Went up today but the agent I've been dealing with is away til next Tues. The girl said she'd ring him and see if we couldn't at least sign the lease this week and then do utilities next week.

She's back on rightmove again. Upping the ante because I won't react.

Guilt guilt guilt. Just ignore. And do not apologise, that will always give her an opening.

With the greek yog I would have said "I will have a look later and email you a link" - end of.

Is the cousin the one you mustn't tell you are moving out?

And what matter if she goes on Rightmove? If she chooses to move home that's no bad thing for either of you, I suspect. If she's on Rightmove looking at places near your brother, though, he should seriously begin to worry.

Hang in there ... only a short while longer.

I think with the Greek Yoghurt, I might not have even said that but just gone with a non committal "Isn't there? That's a shame"

You're doing so well, I really am in awe of how much you're standing up for yourself!

i know, I shouldn't rise to it. She says she's going, that she's looked into international removals because she can't tolerate "my treatment of her". She won't though. I wish she would, it'd be better for everyone, she'd be back in the UK, which is what she's been saying she wants for years. I'd be able to keep her at arm's length. But she won't go, at least ot yet because she'll have nobody there and she's hoping I'll back down and go back to running round after her.
My friend today said she thought she was mentally ill.

You're doing very well not to rise to it - and she's clearly increasing the provocation in response. I feel she's struggling to know how to up the ante effectively after the whole 'stomp off to the flat' thing backfired.

Well exactly, she totally shot herself in the foot there because it was her big card and I didn't back down (in fact it made me realise once and for all something had to change, it was just so....MAD) and it showed that she was actually capable of looking after herself when she choose to.
But it's meant she's struggling with what else to throw at me, pathetic hasn't worked, she doesn't really have the guts to storm off to the UK really. At least i don't think so....

I agree with being non-committal. If she can't find Greek yoghurt then she eats something else. When she returns to the UK she can just get a taxi or drive to the shops anyway. She really is making mountains out of molehills.

I think that she is throwing these comments/actions around because you have come back to doing what she wanted before when she acted out. She just doesn't understand that you have changed.

She will realized only what she has done when she is sitting in her one bed flat back in the UK while you and your DC are living your life as you should. And your brother is busy with his life/work to bother with her.

Agree, you are getting better at not rising to it. "Oh dear" and "well that's your choice." are your stock phrases.

She probably won't move. and if she does, that's not a bad thing for you.

Try

'Oh well. I'm sure you will work it out'. ( then get up and make a cuppa) (or do something that is in another room.

Might be an idea to take these answers and memories them and Bring them out when necessary.

Can I be mean and say its a bit like puppy training.

They say as soon as the dog starts playing rough you get up and leave.

As soon as she starts you say something non committal, then either leave or change the subject.