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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

Is this sexual assault?

58 replies

ramadsho · 21/08/2012 07:40

upset so please bear with me. Fast asleep when I woke to find my dh rubbing my bottom area between my buttocks. This has upset me in the cold light of day, but at the time I just moved away and he stopped. I told him and he became angry when I told him that it had upset me in the cold light of day. please help.

OP posts:

AGilchrist · 21/08/2012 07:45

Tbh I don't know. Dh rubs my behind all the time. I like to be woken up for sex as does he. I often wake him up with a bj for example.
But dh knows I like it.
is something he has done before and you have responded? Or is it something he knows you would never ever want?

BigusBumus · 21/08/2012 07:48

I'm not sure why you are upset that your husband touched you like that? Perhaps he was up for a bit of love-making? Do you have a good sex life? Can you try and explain a bit more why you were upset?

Original poster

ramadsho · 21/08/2012 07:50

Well it is because it was between my buttocks rather than just my bottom

OP posts:

AGilchrist · 21/08/2012 07:55

do you think he was trying to instigate anal?
Is that something he knows you would not do?

This is where is difficult. For me it would not be assault. Dh and I engage in anal.
But because it isn't assault for me doesn't mean its not.
Why do you feel it could be? Can you verbalise it?

Original poster

ramadsho · 21/08/2012 07:57

No I don't think he was trying to instigate anal. He knows I would not do it.

OP posts:

squeakytoy · 21/08/2012 08:04

was he trying to gently wake you up for sex? was he asleep himself?

I think describing it as assault when it is the person you share a bed with every night and have a sexual relationship with is OTT.

If he had refused to stop, or been penetrating you while you slept, that would be different.

Rubysmommy · 21/08/2012 08:05

I would suggest that it isn't an assault. If he had carried on after you'd pulled away, it could have been. In a relationship, both parties instigate sexual activity - on this occasion it sounds like he'd tried, you displayed that you didn't want to, so he stopped.
Are you upset because he did it while you were asleep or because of where he touched you? Either way, I'd suggest you have a talk to discuss what you both like sex wise.

TheDoctrineOfEnnis · 21/08/2012 08:11

Ramadsho excuse me if this question upsets you further but are you thinking about what might have happened If you hadn't woken up when you did.

Someone touching you sexually without reasonable belief that you have consented is sexual assault. It isn't possible to consent when you are asleep. This does fit the legal definition. How do you feel about it? Do you feel it was a genuine mistake by your DH or do you feel scared?

AGilchrist · 21/08/2012 08:12

with what you have said I think I agree with rubys and others.
You share a bed and I presume touch eachother, you made it clear you didn't want to proceed and he stopped.
I think you should sit down and and talk about what sexual expectations and boundaries.
Did you use the word assault to him? How have you left it with him.

Losingitall · 21/08/2012 08:15

This confuses me. I fully accept that making someone do something sexually that they don't want to do is assault.

But

In a healthy sexual relationship being woken by sexual touching seems pretty normal to me.

PooPooOnMars · 21/08/2012 08:17

I wouldn't consider that assault if it were me. Me and my dh often approach each other for sex in this way and often when one is asleep. If they pulled away like you did or didn't wake up the other would stop. I personally wouldn't see it as a big deal.

Unless the issue is where he touched you rather then the fact that he touched you. If you don't normally allow him to touch you there then that's different.

AGilchrist · 21/08/2012 08:19

Losing I think that's where I am. A bit confused.
I think there may be more to this that the OP doesn't want to share. Either a previous incident with dh or in a previous relationship.
I just can't imagine dh waking me when rubbing my bum, me making clear I am not interested him stopping and me thinking that is was assault.

ErikNorseman · 21/08/2012 08:21

It wouldn't be assault for many people, but it may have been for you. Objectively it is, but that's according to a very strict legal definition.
I suppose you need to tell DH that it is not acceptable, it is unwanted sexual contact and never to do it again. His behaviour after you do this will give a clue as to his motivation.

Naysa · 21/08/2012 08:22

I wouldn't be too bothered. My OH does this while he's asleep. He also rolls over, spoons me and grabs a handfull of boob too! I know he would never do anything that I wouldn't be happy with. He also knows that I'll play with his things to wake him up and he likes it.

Naysa · 21/08/2012 08:22

WaitingForMe · 21/08/2012 08:33

Does this relate to Julian Assange? (Story: had consensual sex with woman then later had unprotected sex with her while she was asleep. Galloway has come out and said that it isn't rape, just bad manners )

If the story is true then IMO Assange raped the woman. In a one night stand situation I woke up when the bloke stroked my leg but before he went any further he checked I was awake and happy to proceed. That is what you do early on and one night stand guy understood that to not get consent despite all the things we'd done just a few hours ago would be assault.

DH obviously doesn't seek consent in such an explicit way. Mainly because we've talked about it and he knows waking me up with a sexual touch (that sounds really wanky but I can't think how better to phrase it) is fine. I think the change comes when you discuss boundaries. If you haven't yet then now is the time. If you have then you need to say you aren't happy with what happened. But because he stopped I don't think it's assault.

TheDoctrineOfEnnis · 21/08/2012 09:05

Speaking personally, the OP's description of where he touched her made it seem very sexual for a "gentle awakening" touch. If DH touched me there out of the blue when I was awake and lying down, I'd feel pretty "pounced on" and would mOve away.

OP's DH did this at a time when she wasn't awake to move away so that makes me more uneasy then if he'd stroked her back, say, then whispered are you awake?

What isn't good also is that OP's DH became angry with her when she said it had upset her. OP, what did he say when he was angry?

tzella · 21/08/2012 09:07

I think it's more about the OP's H getting angry about it...

Did he say why he was angry? Embarrassed? Guilty? Annoyed at being busted doing it and irritated with the OP?

Original poster

ramadsho · 21/08/2012 09:38

He thinks I am overreacting. He'll also grab my hand to touch his genitals. He thinks that it is not a grab, just guiding. I have told him over and over not to do this.

OP posts:

Naysa · 21/08/2012 09:54

That's a bit different. A lot of people's partners have grabbed their hand and put it on their genitals, but if you've said that you don't like it and he still does it then he is not being respectful of your boundaries.

Naysa · 21/08/2012 09:54

MissFaversam · 21/08/2012 09:54

Well I was a bit confused here OP but it now seems that he does things that you object to again once you've stated you don't like them.

TheDoctrineOfEnnis · 21/08/2012 09:58

OP, he isn't respecting your right to your own boundaries. That is serious.
Do you feel this is true in any other ways as well,

Original poster

ramadsho · 21/08/2012 10:04

I went to bed last night about 10pm (am currently waiting to start a new job), he had gone out and not come in until 11pm. I was asleep. Apparently, as I am currently not working, I should not have been asleep at this time.
I can't take anymore. I know that people may very well be right that what he did in itself may not be that big a deal, but it's on top of other things as well.

OP posts:

Original poster

ramadsho · 21/08/2012 10:05

Sorry, the emphasis should be on the word itself only and not the word may.

OP posts:

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