DH's use of porn

[wisteriashoe]

Regular but NC for obvious reasons.

I have been married for 5 years. 2 preschool children.

I have to say I'd been OK with very vanilla porn and had even watched it with him. Sex life was normal - no terrible shocks in store, until I discovered websites he'd been looking at when I was pregnant with out first child.

Then last year he said he was 'addicted' and maybe should get help. I was just really angry as I felt he'd just dragged me into this sordid world. I took no part in it. We couldn't afford counselling or anything, and we just limped on. Now our sex life is pretty much dead.

I know he's still visiting these websites. I had a look yesterday whilst he was out. He does delete most of his browsing history. It's fucking disgusting. Look away if you're sensitive. It's 'anal fisting' Nothing like this has even been a suggestion he wants to do to me. That is the length and depth of the 'thing' that he's in to.

Anyway, thanks for reading.

I just don't know what to do. I can't really 'tell' him to stop - he has his own laptop/phone. Any strategies/suggestions most welcome. Thanks.

We had some counselling a while ago. I don't know whether I can go in with the right attitude again, although ending a marriage with 2 small children shouldn't be done lightly.

What was the counselling for?

Yes it's hard work, but if you think you have the slightest chance of forgiving him and moving on it can work. It does take time and commitment. I took it as a handshake agreement with my DP, either he did it, or he was out, there were no grey areas. I learned a lot about him and his insecurities, albeit a different reason to yours, and had a lot of realisations as did he.

What has come through in this thread very clearly is that you seem like a rational and level headed person.

But why would you be going for counselling with him?

From the sounds of things, the problems in your relationship are a direct consequence of his porn addiction. Isn't it more appropriate that he gets specialist counselling for this addiction and you perhaps get separate therapy for living with an addict and recognising the choices you are making?

I fear that if you go to couples counselling, you'll get some drippy counsellor suggesting that porn isn't a massive problem, that you should consider watching it together, or suggesting that if you went to bed at the same time and resurrected your sex life, everything in the garden would be rosy. All these things have (shamingly) been uttered by Relate counsellors who haven't got the first clue about porn addiction.

Not my counsellor Charbon she was pretty tough on my DH.

When trying to conceive DC2 he suddenly became a bit impotent. I got pregnant very quickly despite this. I then seemed to have antenatal depression... He had some psycho sexual sessions on his own (Just a couple). I think we had one or 2 together.

I then had some sessions at work alone.

I think I can forgive the porn thing. It's a bit of a catalyst for other issues though. The other stuff gets me down. This isn't the first time we've had problems, and I can't help wondering whether this marriage has just run its course.

HI Wisteria, that documentary is quite shocking because it shows how a very ordinary women was exploited, raped and abused. I hope your DH watches it, maybe it will help a bit.

You seem so calm, I would be hopping mad and mad some more. Well done you for keeping such a cool head.

I know others are saying counselling, I think it can work for some people, I trained in something called motivational interviewing years ago which is a form of talking therapy for addicts. At the time the service was totally free! I will have a think and see if I can find the details because it wasn't just for drug addicts but I don't know whether porn would be specialist outside of other addiction. For what it's worth, it's easier to call it addiction but maybe it's more likely compulsion which is why he doesn't have withdrawal symptoms, can manage a holiday and a day at work without using it. He needs to get to a point where he isn't ambivalent, so rather than him saying I don't want to do it because it upsets XYZ but... but.... but I still like it, he needs to have more reasons to stop, the more reasons he is given and can start to assimilate into his thinking, the easier it will be to stop and stay stopped.

I doubt he has "learned" his lesson in one night of hardship! not that you need to keep punishing him but you need to stay resolute so that he doesn't think all is forgiven and therefore forgotten.

Did you present with the same problem then Goddess?

Sex addiction therapy is a very specialised area of work that's normally beyond the scope of Relate or the average couples counsellor. Joint counselling works best for problems that are relatively commonplace e.g communication difficulties, re-enacting the same argument over and over again; in other words problems where both parties share the responsibility. It's not so effective when the problems in the relationship can be directly traced to one person's behaviour (like an addiction) and the relationship has been run into the ground because of it.

Thanks Mini - interesting post. I am really calm, but I am a pretty rational person. I'm deliberately staying sober at the moment so I can try and think clearly. I am angry, but on the other hand I'm sort of experiencing some sense of relief at taking control. I agree about 1 night (well this will be the second) of hardship!

I think compulsion is actually a much better description of what is going on here.

This isn't the first time this has come up, and I'm just a bit tired of this shit.

I actually think I deserve a bit better than this. I'm also pretty capable. I owned my own house prior to meeting him. I can manage again.

I'm going to go up to bed in a minute, but am really appreciating the support here

I can't really go into the detail here Charbon, but a similar topic, and a similar level of compulsion. The counselling we had together made DH really understand how much his actions were affecting and hurting me, and why I had lost all respect and trust for him at the time.

If he had separate counselling this would not have been the wake up call that it was. Sitting down and talking through it alone wasn't the same. The counsellor ensured that he understood all of my feelings.

Plus neither of us could talk over or interrupt the other. When you are forced to listen in that way it does put a different perspective on things.

I would never have recognised the cause and effect that eventually came out. I turned from absolutely hating my husband in that period, to realising his insecurities and empowering him to change the behaviour that came from this.

She was one hell of a counsellor.

Charbon - the psycho sexual counsellor was definitely a specialist in her field (as it were).

Interesting about when it's better to go together and when to go alone.

wisteria I wish you goodnight. Hope you get some peace and rest, and are able to clearly decide what it is you want. Sounds like there are more issues now that you have some breathing space.

You might find this interesting Wisteria.

Personally, I would ignore the fact that he spends his time glued to a laptop wanking off over anal fisting, and concentrate on the fact that he is a shit lover and partner and you deserve better.

I would guess your anger at tthe suggestion of time and money spent on 'counselling' etc. stems from this. It's all about him, isn't it? (Poor little thing) The fact that you have lost all respect for him, that he wasn't there for you whilst you were pregnant with HIS children (too busy looking at Czech/Thai girls with somebody's fist up their arse) is not something he's too worried about.

I am sorry, but your choices are to accept a man-child who lives his life watching cyber women get fisted and live a celibate life (unless you can take a lover who actually enjoys a real woman's body), or to leave and cut your losses.

There is a chance that if you actually leave it will bring him to his senses, but it is a slim chance. Maybe there is someone who has done that who can offer more advice?

Good luck.

Night Wisteria, if you get time, do a search for ADDACTION they specialise in addiction mainly drugs/alcohol and it used to be free. They might either be able to point you towards other help or they might have one of their trained counsellors willing to work with him. I only did it as a volunteer and it was years ago. Psycho-sexual counselling is specialist but your DH is likely to share much in common with other forms of addiction and compulsion incl depression, anxiety, erratic sleep pattern, guilt, shame and feel he has to lie, is living a double life, lack of motivation, lack of interest in other areas of life which is why he is lazy and not helping you with the house and kids etc.....

You say "I don't initiate anything". Perhaps you should?

Why the fuck would you judge what turns another person on? I doubt you'd like that done to you.

What the hell Kallisti?

This about a selfish man with a porn compulsion, not the friggin porn itself.

It seems that Kallisti is a man on a mission has had a few too many tonight, Lurking.

Thought the same thing Izzy

Yes well while OP is seriously considering ending her marriage and is hurt and disgusted at the multiple betrayals, she should be playing sexy and initiating sex she doesn't want?

OP, I agree with the poster who said you're angry about spending money on counselling because it's all about him. My jaw dropped when he sent you a text announcing he'd 'learned his lesson' and was ready to come home! That's just...Wow. Does he think you're at his beck and call? It seems like he isn't regarding your feelings at all, if he is truly acknowledging an addiction surely one of the first things is making amends, not having nasty little tantrums because you're not dropping everything to support him and feel sorry for him? An addict knows they're hurting loved ones, they just can't stop. The guilt you feel when you admit you have a problem is all consuming. It's the part when you're most likely to fall off the wagon, to ease the guilt. (No idea how it works with a porn addiction, but all addictions are essentially the same in theory I'd assume)

I say this as a recovering addict. I say recovering because the temptation will always be there. TBH he doesn't sound like an addict at all to me. Compulsive, obsessive at 'best' and just wanting to put a label on something he knows wounds you at 'worst.'

If you are prepared to get past the porn thing, the entitlement thing is an even bigger issue IMO because that's usually rooted in someone's psyche.

You need to tell him how much this hurts you and if he is happy to hurt you then he has no respect for you.
Counselling can be obtained free on the nhs, you can usually self refer.
You can put a block on his computer that stops any adult material, you have to put in a password to access it. Set it up and don't tell him the password.

I'm interested that many forms of unsuitable behaviour are now "addictions"

Can't stop sleeping with prostitutes addiction
Can't stop having affairs addiction
Can't stop watching porn addiction

This addiction label allows people to suggest that they are powerless against their "vice" and elevates something, which is often grubby, to the status of illness
Who doesn't have sympathy for an addict?

I have no idea what my partners watch or have watched. I don't want to know as I think it's deeply personal and often bares no parallel to reality. To an extent some people's sexuality, including my own, wouldn't like to see the light of day for even basic examination.
To that end many people keep the darker side to their sexuality from their partners and it doesn't effect or impinge on their actual relationship.

Could it be...that your H always watched fairly hardcore porn but that you were unaware? He showed you the acceptable face of vanilla porn but not what he sometimes uses?
Now that there is a bit of a sexual breakdown in the marriage ( new baby, shift work) you've snooped around and found the porn.
He is appalled you've seen it and judged him and called stop by claiming to be an "addict"

Maybe he is. However maybe all you both need to do is talk about your relationship. I think you need to talk about the change in your life and the change in your sex life. Small kids are the death knell for many relationships. I think if you can both get all your ducks in a row his "addiction" might disappear. ( he will probably continue to explore his private sexual flights of fancy though)

I am not an apologist for the porn industry btw

In here and reading. Thankyou. Busy morning and day ahead. Nothing to report ATM but appreciating people's posts.

You've said a few things on here that I think he might need reminding about - that before you met him you were independent and had your own house. That you can be that women again.
That you're so used to caring for the dc on your own that it won't make much difference if he's there or not.
That you're pretty disgusted that he hasn't considered the real-life stuff behind what these women are being subjected too and it seems he can't be arsed about your feelings either.

That you're sick of this shit and that you deserve better...

Perry's made a valid point.

'Addictions' can be lifestyle choices.

Do you think he may be dabbling in those online camera rooms I believe that's the technical term where they watch the women touch themselves/have sex? Because as a recovering addict I stated he doesn't come across to me that way, I'm wondering if when he was supposed to be mowing the lawn he was having an emotional affair of sorts and being a 'porn addict' is the better option?

My other thought is like a previous poster said, perhaps he's always watched this filth, is actually just a lazy man-child and now wants a victim label?

Just thinking aloud, I hope today is a good day for you OP!