womens attitudes to crossdressing

[calikid]

hi everyone,

i write this as a response to the numerous comments on a variety of posts regarding reaction to any stories where crossdressing is a subject. Firstly i'd like to make it clear that i am male and as such appreciate i may be laying myself bare to the onslaught of comment that is likely to come my way. although male i love to wear "womens clothes". What I would like to know is simply why shouldn't I. can anyone give me one valid reason why I shouldn't? because I have never been able to think of one.
I am happily married with two dds and a beautiful wife , all of whom i love very much. My wife knows all about my dressing and has been with me to a couple of tv gatherings. i told her not long after we got together and she was totally fine with it, we have been married now for 8 yrs. we do not let the children know as they are still quite young.
In all other respects I am very much one of the lads......I like football and beer (but then so do many women!), i work in construction, I teach martial arts, I help with housework , I don't mind ironing(coz i can do it while watching tv!)
I take a size 10 and look pretty good in a skirt and heels, but then so does my wife, its just she can do it whenever she pleases and good for her. its just the injustice and ignorance of society that infuriates me.
I'm curious to know how the rest of women feel about the issue

I think the reason I wouldn't want my partner to be a CD is down to my own view of actual clothes and fashion. I've always found clothes shopping a chore, and the whole stress around what to wear for what occasion has gotten me down more than once. From that perspective, I quite simply could not relate to, and wouldn't really have any understanding of a man who could even be arsed dressing in heels, fishnets, little skirts, cardis etc - I don't dress like that myself EVER and no good friend of mine does either. I would consider it hobby-wise, to be a waste of space. As for going shopping together, christ, it's hard enough doing it for myself! I see that as an incompatibility issue though, not anything else.

Objectively, from a society point of view, I couldn't care less and if I saw a man walking down the street dressed as above, it wouldn't bother me at all, beyond wondering why he'd be arsed when, lets face it, dressing in black trews and a shirt with no make-up imperative is so godam easy, who'd willingly take another, more hassle option when he didn't need to?!

People have made very valid and interesting points on this thread though.

Hiding I fully relate to you--it was inexcusable for your dh to hide that from you.

Ilovedaintynuts .. just for the record I DONT feel humiliated and certainly dont feel I am being emotionally abused far from it and I am speaking for someone you lived in a emotionally abused marriage I am more happy now then I have ever been I feel supported and feel loved oh and before you flame me by thinking that I must be some poor little women that would be happy to be with anyone I was single for 6 years after my marriage as i didnt want a tosser again my dp is a loving man who likes to dress in women clothes. There is no sexual issue I have known my parnter for many years as friends through a of place of work that we both worked in. however it wasnt untill some years later that we clicked and began dating I am not a sad women who was desparte for love and took the first person who showed any intrest in me far from it like you said its YOUR view and this is MINE

I'd like to make it clear that i am not seeking any form of validation as offred puts it as i have all the validation i need from my wife already, and franky, that is why i told her just after getting together as I had a fair idea what her reaction would be and it gave her the chance to make her own mind up. In any case if she'd reacted differently we wouldn't now be married. but offred i like your following comment in response to hellymellys nonense. she says that i wouldn't look "gorgeous", well i never claim to look gorgeous, but i do look good. There are countless women who try to dress up and get it completely wrong, just wander down any high street on a saturday night and they are there in their droves!

Its gone 10pm now and the OP isn't back? Still working on his extension (pun intended)? I was going to say oo sounds like a great idea - thinking David Bowie/Eddie Izzard and the ultimate (well for me anyway) - Tim Curry in Rocky Horror Show. But I don't think that's what the OP is getting at. If a male partner wanted to do that and it wasn't a sexual thing, then I don't know how I'd cope. I'd probably be very superficial and say it would only be ok if they looked good dressed. Not sure how helpful that is, probably says more about me than any cross dressing man!

Oh sorry - whilst I was typing the OP came back

calikid, your bitchy little aside about women on the high street has damaged your credibility somewhat.

Met a lot of TS and TG on the scene and I have to say that not all parody women, many of them get unbelievably upset about not being feminine in places, and can overcompensate in others to try and move the focus, lots of them wear regular women's clothes and pants, and yes lots of them dress up to the max when out in a club, but then I guess lots of women do too on a night out. I always enjoyed getting prettied up, the way heels made me walk (when I could walk in them), and how I felt when I was wearing nice clothes.

I am of the opinion that if it doesn't hurt anyone, why does it matter so much? I get in a long term relationship that a sudden coming out can be devastating to deal with, and yeah can see why there is a negative response there as it's a very big change for most. Much in the way that if I was married for ten or fifteen years and came out with a fetish that took over my sex life that the other partner didn't enjoy at all, I would expect there might be some change in our dynamic, to the point of the relationship breaking down.

But I don't see why cross dressers of any sort should get a hard time simply for what they wear/look like.

I enjoy lots of stuff most people wouldn't consider as the norm - men in drag, or latex, or leather, even in cling film and custard if that's what pleases them, I love the vivacity and difference, and the freedom to express who they are and what makes them feel happy. Cos-play, furries, goths, lolitas, doms in leather pants and a waistcoat with their "utility belt", even dollies, whatever... I've met lots of interesting people with alternative outlooks on life, and I don't think it should be condemned simply because it is not the norm in society. Norms change anyway, as I recall women have changed the "norm" vastly in the past couple of hundred years, so have homosexual people more recently, perhaps cross dressing and kink will be next.

one of the sentiments appears to be the deception involved. whilst not all of us deceive and are totally open with our partners it is understandable why many would be when alot of the comments say, i'm ok with crossdressing as long as its not in my back yard! the gamble of losing everything is too much and leads to the very deception that then becomes the issue.

well calikid i agree with you there are alot of cds that look stunning (my dp has legs to die for you) and gets lots of nice comments from girls when we go out if you want to pm me thats fine myself and dp have been following this tread with intrest :) hugs to you Calikid and your GG x

it wasn't meant to be bitchy just a comparative that not all men look ridiculous in skirts and not all women look good in them, no offence intended

I dont think 'not in my backyard' is an appropriate phrase to use.
That implies some sort of hypocrisy.

I would not be attracted to my OH in women's clothing. I do not find it appealing.
I do not (as already mentioned) like the way some CD dress in a 'idealised' male version of femininity.

Apart from that - I dont find CD disgusting, perverted or wrong in anyway. I dont think less of anyone who does it.

It is hardly shocking to someone who grew up in the 80s around Soho.

OP, do you do anything with your hair? i find skirts/sarongs look best on men with longer hair/ponytails, but very jarring with a trad cut.

I don't get why you are posting or why you have written all the stuff about being "a normal bloke" though if that isn't why?

I think "not in my backyard" is the perfect description and it is rich to attack him about the comment he made which was only a counter argument to the numerous points people have made about finding the look of cd men [insert numerous negative comments here] and tbh I think it is fair enough.

I dont agree about the NIMBY comment.
I think its hostile to people who are not being hostile about CD.
Surely not being attracted to CD is no more a choice than being attracted to CD?

Doesnt mean you are against it. Not wanting your OH to do it is not quite the same thing as NIMBY. If any of my DSs did it my only worry would be for their safety. I wouldnt kick them out or disown them.

you're right MrsDeVere, it does imply hyprocrisy and I retract that term of phrase, I guess its just that alot of the sentiment i believe comes from the fact that alot of women picture what their partners would look like dressed and made up as women and don't like the image. I understand that and in truth be told I would think alot of my mates might look equally odd dressed. However, the reason many cds attempt to appear as much like women as possible is so they can attempt to "pass" in order to blend in so as not to solicit ridicule and or physical abuse which unfortunately is an ever present danger when out in public. also they are less recognisable when made up and thus less likely to be outed to a wider public. I would prefer to be able to dress without the additional need to add wig, make up etc and have done so in the past in public. I have even been to my local council office in a skirt when i lived in london many moons ago, however now that i am settled in rural community with kids that is no longer an option as i wouldn't want to jeorpardise my familys lifestyle

I think it is a shame (in the real sense of the word) that you cannot just dress the way you want to without fear of danger.

Why the hell shouldnt you wear a skirt?

There is an older man who lives near me who dresses like an older woman. We are in London but not in the most sophisticated of areas so that must take some nerve. I hope he doesnt get too much hassle.

I feel that the hysteria around CD is mixed up with homophobia.
Its all a bit crap really.

to be fair DeVere, although i have received some verbal abuse, usually from a bunch of young lads, I have never been threatened, but if you do search on google its very clear that violence against cd s is a real danger and should be considered when deciding where and where to go

I know of a couple of people who CD who have been assaulted. One was mugged quite violently, so it does exist, which is really quite saddening.

you make a good point about the confusion between gay and cd, i guess its easy for the uninformed to make assumption when in fact there are no more gays who are cd s than there are gay in society as a whole. Again it may be as a result of cds feeling the need to fully present as women in oredr to blend in whereas if skirts where more accepted for men then would not be the case.

I guess we still have alot of work to do and perhaps our grandsons will reap the benefits some hot summers day in and cool and flowy skirt!

well said Calikid :)

likeatonofbricks, i have very short hair, no.1 or less, but in my opinion that doesn't make a blind bit of difference. There are plenty of women with really short hair and they can look fabulous. But of course they are allowed to wear what they want and don't have to manufacture some false image in order to attempt to conceal their real identity for fear of recrimmination. previously i would have gone out as is but in my situation now that would be inappropriate, so if i go to a meeting It is in wig and full make up. Most cds also adopt a femme name but to be fair I couldn't be bothered as I am who I am and I don't want to change that

There's an interesting difference between "skirts for men" and "cross-dressing". There are folks out there who are men who like wearing non-trouser garments, and women who find such outfits attractive. They mostly gravitate towards the kilt, the sarong, or goth/alternative styles involving versions of them, sometimes explicitly marketed as alternative menswear. Some of these people would be incensed to be described as transvestites, although it is something they do encounter.

Likewise, there are men who enjoy wearing more "sensuous" fabrics, without the desire to wear dresses or skirts. My own DH is happy with trousers, but he does like to wear silk and velvet occasionally, because of the way it feels and looks. It's not because it's feminine.

I've always understood the point of cross-dressing to be wearing garments explicitly intended for the opposite of one's own biological or everyday gender. Also, within that category, there are men who enjoy occasional dressing up, either as part of sex, or just as something to do, and at the other end, there are those who dress full-time. (Correct me if I'm wrong).

The issues will be different depending on the situation, I suppose. Each of these "categories" will have their own problems, or not.

I was thinking from pure;ly visual point of view that longer hair or ponytail goes better with long skirts, on women or men, just for balance of the look (not to appear very bottom heavy), but if you aer very good looking and have beautiful bone structure, then yes it can still look good.

oh, and it depends how muscular you are on top half - if you are, then long skirt would definitely look better with a ponytail (no makeup). Ponytails are not artificial or effeminate on a man as the hair is coarse, they suit a lot of men generally. I think very short hair goes much better with straight knee length skirt on a cd-ing man (if he is slim, good legs).