Clashing with Dad over DS - A bit long.

[LittleBugsMum]

DS1 had colic until about 4 months and at the time it really did seem like he was constantly crying to other people but he was in pain. And it wasn't all the time, just when it started, it went on and on and on... I did get upset & stressed sometimes but all was ok.

I think from then my DF has had a problem with him. He's very nearly 3 now & he is a little bit naughty, mostly antagonistic towards DS2 (18 mths) and he can get a bit over excited, loud & boisterous. I can deal with it. He's a very imaginative, funny, interesting and wonderful little boy most of the time.

I feel like he only sees the bad in him, he's called him a 'psycho' and a 'devious bastard' (not in front of him) and often says he laughs at sadistic things. Because DF says it with a smile, it's like he's joking but he's not. It's all untrue and it not only upsets me but makes me really really angry with my DF.

It's got bad recently because after an incident at playgroup my DF thinks I should smack DS to teach him that if he hits, he gets hit back. I disagree with this completely & think it's hypocritical to teach that violence is wrong then hit him!

Once, DS threw a ball at DF and it hit him (not hard) and DF threw it back at him, hard, it hit him and made him cry. Another time, DS was playing with a net and said 'I'm going to get you with it' to DS2 and was waving it about and it caught DF slightly so he took from of him & swung it at him (lightly) hitting him in the chest. He wasn't hurt & he didn't cry but I can't stop thinking about it & it makes me furious. There have been other little incidents to a point where I will NEVER ask DF to look after DS1, not even while I'm upstairs.

I can't tell DH because he'll get horrible about it & I can say things about my father but I hate it when he does.

I don't know what to do or say now, I just feel like avoiding him but he calls at my house most days so it will be weird.

Incidentally, he adores his other grandchildren...

I think I would keep both children well away from him.

Maybe your child does have behavioural problems if he adores his other grandchildren. He shouldn't really be saying the things he does but if I was in your position I'd be more concerned about the child's behaviour than what he's saying.

I would speak to him. Make it abundantly clear how you feel, calmly.

Then he either shapes up or ships out.

If you address it now you may salvage a relationship for your DS. If you don't then your DS might get hurt.

Oh no, AThingInYourLife reading it back, it looks terrible! Talk about only focusing on the bad! He is nice to him some of the time & brings him little gifts from the charity shops etc.

I think he thinks I'm soft because I'd rather talk to him about bad behaviour or take away treats or use the naughty step. I'm not 'harsh' which DF thinks he needs. He thinks he's a problem child. I don't. And neither does anyone else.

lisaro I'm not ignoring DS's behaviour, I am dealing with it but I don't think it's nearly as bad as DF thinks it is. He isn't a bad child. At all.

"I just feel like avoiding him but he calls at my house most days so it will be weird."

I would put some distance between you anyway while you think things through. He sounds like he has a grudge and that's quite frankly weird. I think you need to have a long chat with your DH about it and pool your opinions and memories about what is going on, and what you both want to do about it. It can be reassuring to have someone else's perspective and you sound a bit unsure about just what is going on. Maybe you need to hear it from someone else to properly confirm it.

I feel sorry for your son because it won't be nice growing up having his cousins and siblings being the adored grandchildren while he gets labelled the problem child from birth.

Ok OP. you have explained a bit more in your second post.

LittleBugsMum,

Do not be available to your Dad.

Re your comment:-
"I can't tell DH because he'll get horrible about it & I can say things about my father but I hate it when he does".
Talk to your DH; do not keep such from him. Abuse thrives on secrecy. Re that second part of your comment,, why is that?. A misplaced sense of fear, shame and or embarrassment that your Dad could behave in such a way towards your child?.

I'd be keeping your children completely away from your Dad. He has no automatic right as a grandparent to see them anyway. Your son is likely to be very scared of his own grandad.

You would not tolerate this abusive behaviour from a friend, let alone your own Dad.

You do not mention your Mum in all this; is she still around?.

What was this man he like towards you when you were a child btw?.

Your children ultimately come first and you need to protect them from abusive family members; your Dad is really of only secondary concern here.

totally disagree with lisaro am a bit at your comment - this is a small child we're talking about and his behaviour doesn't sound unusual!

OP you need to talk to your dad and explain how you feel and set some ground rules on what discipline you find acceptable.

Yes it is weird. And unfair.

"I feel sorry for your son because it won't be nice growing up having his cousins and siblings being the adored grandchildren while he gets labelled the problem child from birth"

Me too. He tells my brother about it & he thinks it's funny. He likes him & thinks naughty little boys are funny because he was one but that must mean they discuss him.. it gets on my nerves.

I will avoid him for a while I think.

I'd go further and have no contact with your Dad whatsoever.

Your Dad sounds like a self entitled bully.

out of interest how was you dad with you and your brother when you were growing up?

I had a feeling I'd end up defending my Dad. The second line of my comment Attlia is because he's my dad & I love him. I also am not happy with his behaviour and his attitude towards DS which is why I posted.

Cutting him out of my life is not an option. We need this resolved.

My Mum & Dad aren't together. He was a wonderful father to us when we were growing up, didn't even smack us (as far as I remember but he says he did once).

Forget for a moment that this is your Dad that is being discussed here. If someone else told you this re their father, what would your own advice be?.

Any child, now adult, would love a parent no matter how crap or abusive they actually turn out to be.

Have you talked to your mum at all re the behaviour of her ex husband towards who is after all also her grandchild?.

You need to protect your son from your Dad because your Dad is intimidating and frightening him and on more than one occasion to boot. Enoguh is enough; he cannot be trusted and no trust = no relationship. You are no longer willing even to let your DF look after your son even if you are upstairs.

This is not a resolvable situation to my mind because your Dad has not apologised to anyone and is not taking any real responsibility for his actions, nor does he want to. He does not think he is doing anything wrong. This is really about power and control at its heart.

Make yourself far less available to your Dad and as for any boundaries you currently have re this person, raise them a hell of a lot bloody higher.

I think you're overreacting. Your Dad is saying that your 3yo needs a reality check when he gets over-excited and aggressive. Showing him why throwing things at people or swinging nets about, rather than explaining it is a good way to get things across to a small child. You had a great childhood. Your Dad will have used the same methodology on you and you turned out OK

" Showing him why throwing things at people or swinging nets about, rather than explaining it is a good way to get things across to a small child."

No it isn't, it's appalling.

You don't use your adult strength against a 3 year old to "teach them a lesson" unless you are an abusive bully.

You also don't label a small child as being evil/psychopathic.

It is very, very bad for your son to be around someone with such a negative and domineering attitude towards him.

Her child, her rules when all is said and done. Her father also has no right at all to say that his daughter i.e the OP should smack her DS to teach him that if he hits, he gets hit back. This is 2012, not the dark ages.

I think OP is afraid of her Dad and his reaction to being challenged.

Apart from anything else, why did your Dad see it somehow fit to call your son a psycho?. I would think also he does not call his other grandchildren anything like or buy them things from the charity shop; they receive new items.

"You don't use your adult strength against a 3 year old to "teach them a lesson" unless you are an abusive bully."

I agree and of course the OP won't be smacking her child just because Dad thinks that's right. But throwing a ball back or pretending to hit a kid with a net doesn't make anyone an abusive bully. All those adjectives that the OP uses like 'naughty, atagonistic, boisterous, excited and loud'.... and especially that the kid deliberately goes after his baby brother to hit him with a net.... are signs of a child that isn't responding to quiet chats.

The Dad has a point

Regardless of our views on this, the dad does NOT have a valid point. The point of this thread is not 'is my DS a little sod who needs chastisement' but 'my dad is deliberately undermining the choices I am making as a parent' which is totally different.

Did your son deliberately throw the ball to hit/hurt?

He should have been told no if he did, but that´s all?

Does he laugh at sadistic things?

Your father sounds like a bully-so if your eldest is like that to his brother-perhaps that´s where it comes from.

Trying to get the better of children-utterly reprehensible imo.

Of course you love your father-but enough to let him treat your son badly?

How can he undermine her choices when the OP has clearly never set out what those choices are?

If I were you OP I would tell my DP in no uncertain terms that how dare he treat his grandchild like that and if you ever ever witness such again that he'd be banned from your house.

The mans behaviour is bloody disgraceful, he's being a total and utter bully to the child.

Sorry OP that was meant to read DF!!

OP: What do you mean when you say your DH "will get horrible about it"?

"How can he undermine her choices when the OP has clearly never set out what those choices are"

Not all my parenting choices are 'clearly set out' - are anyone's? I am open to advice and will try different techniques but I won't hit him (or throw things a him!!?) it makes no sense to protect my baby from harm then hurt him myself. I actually don't think I'm soft either.

DS is a bit challenging but there is a fine line between 'rough play' and actual violence or bullying so I don't jump on him for everything because they might just be wrestling or pretending to be lions or whatever...DF sees this & DS1 gets in trouble/the blame straight away.

The net thing is from Cat in the Hat, he was going to 'catch' DS2 because I call them Thing1 & 2. Yes, he probably threw the ball on purpose, we had a throwing issue but it's got a lot better.

No one gets new items Atila we all get charity shop. And I am a bit wary of confronting him in a real way in case we fall out & I don't want that. Yes, that's unreasonable of him but he can unreasonable.

DH isn't always very nice about my family, they're very different from his (area, class, money, everything) and he will be angry but he's not confrontational so it won't help to discuss it with him.

My Mum has her own theories about my Dad's motives...

Thanks mushroomsoup - exactly!