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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

ex SIL preventing nieces from attending special family events

96 replies

OneArmedBandit · 16/07/2012 12:52

my sil and i were close for years.

she and db are going through a messy divorce.

she is refusing to allow their 3 children to attend family gatherings that don't fall on his 'access' days (every other weekend). this access has been dictated by her alone. he used to have them weds nights too but she suddenly decided he wasnt allowed to have them midweek any more.

our other brother is marrying in august and they are bridesmaids.... it got to the point of having to threaten legal action before she allowed them to attend.

now their only surviving grandfather is visiting form overseas at 2 days' notice as a surprise for my 40th (am annoyed with my dad for not giving us notice but he didnt think through the consequences for my db). she has refused to let them see him as she says they have plans, and it not dbs' 'weekend'. you might say fair enough, but how sad that sil sees no value in altering plans to accommodate a rare overseas relative.

she also will allow him to have them only for 10 days over the summer, split into 2x 5 days so he cant do a proper holiday with them.

i dont understand why she hates us all so much. we used to regularly go on holidays etc together and i've really tried to be impartial. why cant she see that keeping the dc away from our side of the family out of spite, is not in the dc's interest. she admitted in a recent email to Db that money was his 'power base' but the dc our her 'power base'. i just want to weep its so awful and hurtful.

when he sees them only 2 days out of 14 it makes it impossible to get to see our side of the family. they have a gran and a great gran who see them about 1% of the time that her own family get to see them. not to metion my poor db who misses them like mad.

i really know the dc and db are the main issue but the extended family get hurt too and i needed to vent . any advice?

OP posts:

DontmindifIdo · 17/07/2012 21:44

OP - have you tried my suggestion of extending the GF's trip to cover the weekend before/after that is your DB's time?

The wedding isn't on, but I thought your DB had that agreed in the end? She will get what's fair financially, and the DCs are getting to an age when they will decide how much contact they have. We can't judge if £5k is a lot or not depending on what your DB earns and what sort of lifestyle they had, for example if that has to cover school fees there's no way she could afford to go on holiday. If there is a large mortgage eating into that then there might not be much left over at the end of it. If there's car loans and other debts to be served in that £5k then it wouldn't go that far - you can't say "I could live off £5k a month" without taking any notice of what financial commitments come out of it - or what that would leave him with (if £7k a month leaves him with £1k a month to live off, not really fair, if it leaves him with £3k a month to live off, he could cope with that until the DCs leave home)

She will be angry from the divorce, it does take time for some people to stop being angry.

DontmindifIdo · 17/07/2012 21:46

she probably wants to shut you all out because she's hurting and you are reminders of that hurt. You are reminders of that previous life she had. even if the divorce was 'mutual' it doesn't mean she's not hurting and doesn't mean that this 'pain' stage will last forever. Make sure you don't say anything that will stop you being able to fix things when she does finally calm down and everything is settled.

DontmindifIdo · 17/07/2012 21:47

(I know woman getting a lot more than £7k a month in maintenance, but they are divorced from very rich men and normally it does include school fees)

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 21:47

and actually i have experienced the change in her behaviour first hand so its not simply a question of my db making it up. for example i send birthday cards and gifts to to the children at her house not my db's house as a sign that i want to keep the family connection with her going. yet she has recently stopped sending cards to my dc who asked yesterday on her bday 'is M still my auntie?'

OP posts:

MrsCampbellBlack · 17/07/2012 21:49

OK the money is a red herring because if she is used to a certain lifestyle then £5k may not cover holidays. I know some people won't believe this but if there are school fees etc to be taken into account for 3 children - well I can see this being an issue.

But I still think some mediation is necessary - they really don't want to be warring parents.

MrsCampbellBlack · 17/07/2012 21:50

Onearmed - look you are naturally going to side with your brother as you have done and as most of us do really. She'll be aware of this. And perhaps she assumed your brother would do the presents to your children.

DontmindifIdo · 17/07/2012 21:51

the cheap prep round here is £1.5k a month - are the DCs in private school? (I know there are sibling discounts, but really, that's not a lot left to live off if she's got to cover that)

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 21:51

the wedding was agreed only when solicitors were involved!

OP posts:

akaemmafrost · 17/07/2012 21:56

Have you explicitly told her you wish to continue a relationship with her.

I am still friendly with all of my SIL, I love them. However when I first split from their DB I was very cagey, bloods thicker than water and all that, but they made it quite clear that our friendships were separate. When one of them introduced me to her friend she said "this is my SIL, well she's not with DB anymore but she will always be my SIL", which really touched me. I must say as well that my relationships with them has made me want to work very hard at keeping up flexible contact. Now there may be an element of "keeping me sweet" don't think so though.

Do you worry that would be disloyal to your DB though?

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 21:56

mrsC she has send gifts for 14 months since the split. but suddenly stopped. i think you are missing the point . this about her me demonstrating her desire to shut us out.

i have spent hours on the phone talking to her and i know i have been a great support to her over the years as she has told me so... and have remained impartial as best i could. it just got to the point that i couldnt listen to her slag him off anymore and made one defensive comment a few months back. i then got an acerbic email to which i responded very calmly but we havent spoken since

OP posts:

akaemmafrost · 17/07/2012 21:58

Well I can see why you wouldn't want to hear your DB be slagged off endlessly. I try very hard not to do that with SIL, don't always manage it though.

MrsCampbellBlack · 17/07/2012 21:59

Umm I don't think I'm missing the point actually.

But you have clearly sided with your brother - its totally evident in your posts and I'm sure in your position I would too. But she's going to be aware of that isn't she and possibly not want to continue a relationship with you personally.

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 22:00

i send affectionately worded texts. i send gifts and cards. surely this is enough indication of the wish to be friends. at best i get a curt text response in very business like language. i havent phoned as i dont believe she has calmed down since her email to me.

OP posts:

Houseofplain · 17/07/2012 22:01

So there was an incident that kicked it all off with you and her? I think you sound too involved and tbh too bolshy. If you stress at her like you are at posters on here....no wonder she stays well away.

She maybe a nasty piece of work. Who knows, not you. As equally your db, could well be using money as a threat against her, he could be threatening her with all sorts. Who knows. You don't know what goes on behind closed doors. Obviously as your db, you will be biased. Best to stay well out of it and let them sort it themselves. As family members sticking their two penneth in, will never help.

MrsCampbellBlack · 17/07/2012 22:01

And if she has any idea that you know so much about their divorce including how much money she'll get - well in her position I think I'd be distancing myself from you too.

Its very hard to maintain relationships with ex's of your siblings especially in a bitter divorce.

So if I were you I'd just concentrate on supporting your brother and encourage him to seek legal advice on the access stuff.

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 22:02

mrs c i only sided with my brother since she started blocking access. they had mediation, agreed a midweek overnight then she stopped it out of the blue and reduced the length of the weekends.

OP posts:

longjane · 17/07/2012 22:02

well OP if you want your daughter to still have auntie m
you have play nice with her . if you cant then no your daughter wont have a auntie m anymore.
that is life

she does not have to auntie m anymore but if you still want her to be then you have work at it.

MrsCampbellBlack · 17/07/2012 22:05

Well your brother needs to speak to his solicitor about that.

And I think you actually need to conduct your relationship with her without mentioning your brother if you think its worth it. Not sure I would but then I'm fiercely defensive of my sibling.

I just think its perhaps unreasonable to expect the relationship to remain the same at the moment. Perhaps when the divorce is through and money and access are sorted you can re-build a relationship with her.

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 22:07

i would like to say that i feel i have been dragged into their divorce by BOTH of them as they were both constantly ringing me up in the early stages and trying to use me as some sort of unofficial mediator. its been a a complete nightmare tbh.

i really dont want to be involved to this degree but when someone rings you up in a state and you are the one they think will help 'get through' to the other party it is very tricky. i have been sucked into it by sil just as much as db.

i have told db not to email me . its all very well saying i shouldnt be told stuff but everyone needs at least one confidante.

OP posts:

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 22:10

long jane did you read my post from 22.00? is that not playing nice?

OP posts:

exoticfruits · 17/07/2012 22:12

I think that your brother needs to get a fair settlement through the court.
In the meantime play her at her own game, don't tell her your plans and fit them in around the access she does allow.

Houseofplain · 17/07/2012 22:12

Currently however, you are only getting one side of the story, which although maybe true. It then again may not be.

You don't know what he's said to her about money or you and the family, you just don't know. So take a step back until it's all sorted. That's what I think other people were saying earlier.

MrsCampbellBlack · 17/07/2012 22:12

I think you're in an impossible position but ultimately your loyalty is with your brother.

Give it time with your sil.

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 22:14

i have been getting BOTH sides of the story for YEARS actually.

OP posts:

Original poster

OneArmedBandit · 17/07/2012 22:17

mrsc, i am giving it time and despite being told i am bolshy etc on this thread!

some poeple cant tell the difference between bolshiness and frustration...
i am prepared to make amends and be patient with my relationship with her. my db doesnt have the luxury of having time to lose, though

OP posts:

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