DH's financial control is becoming unbearable.

[Voidka]

DH and I had a massive row last night and I dont know how much more I can take.

Firstly both DH and I have separate bank and savings accounts and a joint credit card where all of our expenditure goes, and a joint DD account. We both have mortgages (mine is on our rental property, DH's is our home). DH wants to be mortgage free within the next 5 years but he is becoming fanatical about it to the point of suffocation.

Last night DH confronts me. He has highlighted loads of different things I have spent on the CC. This all kicked off because a book arrived for DS1 yesterday (which he is about to study at school and wanted to read first, and cost me a penny on amazon + delivery). My other crimes included £4 in Matalan buying wellies for DD and £2 in Wilkinson on a new mixing bowl.

I cant go on like this. We have three children that need things. I am not an extravagant person by any means. It causes so much friction in the house. We are not in any debt.

He has ruined days by being a miser. For example we went to the seaside over easter and DD wanted a ride on a donkey. I said that was okay and he went off in a massive huff and we lost him for 30 minutes because he didnt come back. He went mental when I let the boys have a pounds worth of 2p's to go on the penny arcade.

We have our family holiday coming up in 4 weeks and I am dreading how he will be. I honestly dont think I can go on.

It ended last night with me trying to explain that as a family we have to have some expenditure and him getting in such a huff about my so called 'living the high life' that he slept in the spare room.

One thing I have learnt recently from CAB is that there is no such thing as a "joint credit card". It is basically either yours or his, and the other has a card to it. So any debt racked up is 100% the credit holders. So if it is yours, I personally wouldn't want all the family's spending going on it. If it is his, well, I am with him on this.

That aside. The two of you have a lot of work to do on this. Maybe with a counsellor or something? He is not behaving reasonably. He is being a man-child in his reactions. But, sounds stressed financially. You need a family agreed budget and to stick to it. Or separate money and accounts out completely.

I think I am finding it hard to understand quite your position, but my XH was the opposite - spend spend spend (mostly on himself) and I left the marriage with zilch. (Luckily no debt, as it was all in his name thank the lord - again all the money (credit) was spent selfishly on himself which is why I can be callous about that). So could only dream of a partner that was financially sensible. There you go.

God. I have been here, kind of. It is horrible and can totally empathise.

Ask him if he also wants to be wife and DC-free in the next 5 years. I'm not being flippant, I know what it feels like to have to justify every penny you spend and it is no way to live.

I have dealt with it by a) going mental at HIM and b) drawing up a monthly budget and including a heading "Fun stuff". Ask him how much he thinks should be under that heading and when he says 50p or something ridiculous maybe it will dawn on him what a miserable ))(&%$£* he's being.

Don't give in. When he does eventually pay the mortgage off he will then start on something else.

I also think your husband is being mean. The amounts you are talking about don't seem big to me, plus your story about he huffed off over a donkey ride for his child. That's straight up mean!

BUT are you doing this every day? If not, and you are not going over budget in any way, I think he is wrong.

Also, ask him this - when you are mortgage free in 5 years (which I admit is a nice thing to be, or would be, fat chance for me haha!) - how will he feel when he looks back and thinks that he missed his children's early years by denying them small treats?

I think you should cool down for a while, and let him know this (I don't want to talk to you now and yes its OK if you sleep in the spare room...) - let there be a breach - and then explain to him simply that it needs to change and that you are his trusted and loving wife and he needs to listen to you on this point, for he is being weird.

I liked the idea of the column on the budget for fun stuff, and also maybe buffer stuff - the new thing that you need that's a fiver for example. The random day trip out when you spend a tenner on ice creams.

I wonder why he is being like this? Was he poor when he was young?

I'm well-known for being careful sensible with the cash but if there's one thing I can't stand it's penny-pinching and crying poverty for the sake of it. This obsession with paying off the mortgage... Is he frightened of poverty? Does he come from a poor background? Or is it just an idea that's got out of hand?

Either way, the bad-tempered sulking and worse is a huge concern. Losing it over the price of a donkey ride or a pair of wellies is a sign of real emotional instability and I'd class it as abusive. I'm so pleased you've got your own bank accounts. How would he react if you threatened to move out?

I don't think I would be able to live with that level of nitpicking. I'm pretty uptight about money, and I could easily be like your DH but I realise it's my problem and so I whinge to my DH (who is very sensible with money, just not as tight as me) every now and again but I don't confront him about what he spends. Would there be any point in sitting down and explaining how you feel? Or perhaps setting up a budget as lemming suggests? Or do you think it's a personality trait (as it is with me) rather than a genuine response to stress?

You say it is unbearable to you. Good: you've identified the limit of what you will accept. The follow-up question you now need to ask yourself is: what are you going to do about it, assuming no change from his side?

The total I spent on this CC statement was £83.79 - that includes DD's gym class (£3.50 a week) and swimming lessons for DS2 (£15) so I dont think I am being excessive. The CC is mine - he is the second account holder.

I do think its an idea that has just got out of hand. We dont have a massive mortgage on the house and mine is very small now because I have had it 10 years and we have been overpaying for 7.

I am sensible with money and I dont like spending either, but with 5 people in a family there is bound to be some expenditure.

I said to DH last night that I couldnt bear it any more and he is ruining our lives. For example DS came home from Scouts on Thursday with a letter which DH asked to see. DS got all upset about showing it to him because it was a letter about the next camp which costs £20.

If DS has picked up on DH's attitude then it has gone too far imo.

Plus I dont like being spoken to like a child, like I cant make a decision for myself. We are not rolling in money but we are doing okay because we have no debt except the mortgages.

Is there anything that has made him like this like family background or redundancy?

His dad was exactly the same, but then DH moans about how tight his Dad was. I dont think he realises he is becoming the same way. When I say that he is he tells me I am being ridiculous.

HE IS INSANE

You find his behaviour unacceptable. He ridicules your view.

Again: what are you going to do about it? He's not about to change his ways.

is he on the money saving expert forum by any chance? there's a whole board over there dedicated to mortgage free wannabes who get a bit obsessive....

from what you've said your spending is not unreasonable. Does your DH accept that a certain amount of expenditure is inevitable? would he agree a budget for household and kids stuff and then you can take that amount into an account for you to spend so he doesn't get to obsess over ever penny

Is there also problems with his mother? That she needs to control when you are in waiting for her? I seem to remember that thread (could be wrong, often am).

Why did he get cross about wellies? Can he justify that? or a mixing bowl? It isn't normal stuff to get stressed about.

It's not normal for a kid to be scared to show a parent a demand for money from a club or school - they are always asking! That shows it has gone a bit weird.

Don't know the answer to this, but there seems to be lots of issues around control around your relationship.

I really do feel for you. It must be absolutely stifling. The fear of a situation developing like this is what makes me cling on to my economic independence - DP and I both work full time, I have my own accounts and he doesn't see what I spend. I think we both like it like that.

this situation can't continue. If things are as you say then this really is his problem - I can tell from what you've written that you are not an extravagant person. I also agree with HotDAMN - he isn't going to change. So how are you going to respond? What are your choices?

Yes you are right Lisa - she is a control freak and I think he has the same behaviour but channelled in a different way. He is an MSE member.

I dont know what to do. Our marriage is shite (not just because of this) but I dont know if I have the strength to cope with the children on my own at the moment. DS1 has AS and is challenging, and DS2 has ASD.

I know our marriage will end, its just a case of when :(

Voidka - isn't it a question of whether you have the strength to cope within this marriage? I think you'd do better on your own!

Has he worked out how much extra it will cost him in child support and separate housing if he carries on?

I post on MSE now and then, and I don't begrudge my h the cost of a mixing bowl. Perhaps you could post on there lol and ask for suggestions about how to deal with financial control.

Shot in dark - could you go to Relate on your own to work out what exactly you would need to be able to cope without him? Then let him know - this is how it is, change or go?

Wish you luck, you sound lovely and you deserve better.

Do you HAVE a budget, that you both agree on?
Maybe you should sit down, and discuss what he thinks is an acceptable amount for spending (prob about 20p) and what you think and meet in the middle.
Maybe he hasn't got a clue how many expenses there are for a family of 5?
I know if you asked my DH what our day to day expenses are he wouldn't have a clue, as I buy all the stuff like wellies, school trips etc. he could just be clueless how many things are needed IYSWIM

Also, for fun days out we have a tin that can't be opened unless you take a tin opener to it, every time you have a £1 or £2 pound coin we put it in, and open it at the end of the month, and have a family treat. We usually have £100-£200 in there.
If you do that, and make it clear it's "treat money" he can't complain can he?

Sorry op I've just read the part about him being a control freak and how unhappy you are in general so disregard my previous post :(

Relate sounds a good idea if you want to stay together.

OP this sounds horrendous. Can you possibly work so you have your own income? Perhaps he feels pressured being the only one bringing money in. In the current economic climate that is a worry.

I certainly wouldn't bother going on holiday with your DH. You will not enjoy it. Send him off with the children and let him get on with it.

You would probably be less stressed living by yourself as you wouldn't be worried about his reaction to every little thing. You could spend what you wanted.

I feel sorry for DS worrying about his father's reaction to a £20 trip. It makes me feel very sad for him.

Your DH will be mortgage free but will have alienated the rest of you with his uncaring and thoughtless behaviour. He sounds like he has a very low EQ- has he always been like this?

Not quite sure what to type really. Firstly I am careful about spending too but the whole point of that is to afford the kind of little treats like donkey rides that you describe. Making life miserable for years in order to pay off the mortgage at speed seems absurd

I am single these past 2 odd years and love being able to make my own financial decisions . I would put your foot down and tell him you will be spending XY and Z and he can like it or lump it

What does he have to say about your DS and the cub letter ?

When the whole mortgage thing started we agreed £100 a month spend money each, which I was totally happy with. I am not a big spender anyway. My main expenditure are the childrens different clubs (scouts for DS1, trampolining and swimming for DS2 and gym and swimming for DD) and I go swimming once a week. One of the other costs this month was theatre tickets for me and DD £8 each so when you add up what I have spent there isnt that much I has spent on myself, I am not frittering it away. I have tried to explain that while we are focused on paying off our mortgages I still want the children to be able to enjoy themselves - not in a crazy way but just have some fun, like a holiday once a year and the activities they enjoy.

I told DS I would pay for the Scout trip - he does get overly anxious of peoples reactions but DH does nothing to try and make him feel more secure.

I think the problem is that DH sees the Mortgage thing as a competition, even between him and myself, but it isnt one he is ever going to win so he has turned sour.

I dont know what I am going to do. The boys need stability but they also need less hassle than this and so do I.