DH is in a mess....this is long!

[overandunder]

DH hit me with a bombshell recently - he loves me, but basically isn't in love with me - or something along those lines.

Now, a bit of background info....

We recently had DD2 (6 months ago) - she was the baby we thought we'd never have, after a series of mc's. We had to get treatment for this, and we are so lucky to have her.

DH has a job that involves working away - it as been particularly stressful for the past year, and he has also had hideous dental problems, a bout of shingles 3 weeks after DD was born and his dad has recently been ill.

We have been married for coming up to 11 years, and been together for 14. We celebrated our 10th anniversary whilst I was heavily pregnant last year with a lovely break at a beautiful hotel, and he bought me a gorgeous bracelet too.

I turned 40 in Jan, and he surprised me with a trip to NYC - he did this fantastic treasure hunt around the house, and I cried when I discovered the gift at the end - I just didn't expect it.

We have had our ups and downs like any long relationship, but we've always been good at communicating, and worked through them. I have had problem with depression - due to mc's and other difficult things - and he's supported me throughout.

I think that I've had my head down and just been focusing on getting through the newborn phase, and maybe I haven't been supporting him enough. I can be snappy at times, but I am in no way a complete cow.

He is up for going to Relate and we start seeing someone in a week. He says that he's lost respect for me, and I can see that all he's doing is looking at the bad stuff. I know from my MH issues that this is what you do when you are struggling and stressed.

I gently suggested that he needs to take time off work on the phone last night - he didn't really acknowledge this, and I know that we need to sit down and discuss it. The problem is that he is self-employed and the main breadwinner, and probably sees this as not possible. I have found myself looking at jobs this morning to see if I can get a job - it's a bit tricky as I used to be an FE lecturer in Textiles and the jobs are hard to come by. Also, they don't pay anywhere near as much as DH's salary.

I suspect that someone will come on here and start blathering about him having an affair as there's always one on most relationship threads that I've read! He unequivocally is NOT, so please don't come on and suggest this. There is absolutely nothing in his behaviour that has me worried about this (although I have thought about it, as I think it is only natural to go down that thought pattern).

My DH has always been an incredibly loyal, kind and considerate man and I love him with all my heart. The stress of this has had me taking painkillers to get through it - not ideal, but a short term fix for those really bad days. I am prepared to fight for my marriage and he does want to work on it too, but it hurts me so much to know that he feels like this about me.

His mum came over last night as I was upset, and she thinks that he is in a mess. She is planning to phone him tonight, and she's very gentle and will hopefully get him to admit that he needs time off from work.

I bought him a spa day for his bday recently as I know he's been stressed - I also have been doing more around the house to try to take the pressure off him. I sent him back to work with a survival pack before this happened too, so he knew that we were thinking about him - he was touched, and appreciated this.

I phoned him a couple of weeks ago on his way home from work in a mess - I'd hit the vodka, and was suffering with raging PMT, and just ranted down the phone at him. He called back straight away and told me he'd had an epiphany at work that day when he told someone to Fuck off - he realised that the job is fucking him up. I think he's dismissing that this week, as he's having a bad week and being all pessimistic again.

Sorry this is a long post - I was hoping for some constructive advice, or maybe something from someone who has been through a similar thing. I feel like I am going slowly mad and my whole world has been turned upside down. I also feel like maybe I have been really inconsiderate and not been looking out for him - but the last 18 months have been all about the pregnancy and the baby - I've just had my head down.

Most men do seem to operate from a script

I disagree.

2nd babies affect a relationship more than is often anticipated. My DH and I had a terrible time after we had DD2....it's only looking back now that I see it. When you have one, you think "God this is hard" and then number 2 comes along and it's all even harder!

Op.

It sounds like everything coming together, job stress, new baby, being inevitably pushed aside.

If he were able to spend some time at home just cuddling new babe, you might find that his adoration factor is so triggered that every thing else pales into insignificance. And it could give you some time off too.

I also think that there is a lot of unrealistic expectation about how long romantic love lasts. It usually doesn't last for ever, but is replaced, so the books say, by deep companionship. Were all told to try to get it back but even if we do it isn't that fine first careless rapture.
Perhaps your oh, who sounds like a good person, hasn't realised that or is missing that initial excitement?

I know that alot of men are arses and do cheat on their women - I have been there myself. The reason I got together with him, is because he isn't like alot of other men - he's always had strong views about affairs.

I'm angry because of the assumption that it is always an affair - and because it doesn't help. I'm not in denial either before someone suggests that. I just know him and the way he works, and out of the both of us, I'd probably be the one that's more likely to stray - and I never have, despite issues we may have had or situations where I've found someone attractive and it's been reciprocated.

The comment about not respecting you also jarred with me. If he wants to go to Relate with you - and therefore presumably make things work out - then why would he say this? What did you actually mean when you wrote that?

If it is of any comfort, friends of mine went through something very similar, also around the time of having babies (although I don't think they had anything like as stressful time of it as it sounds like you're having). The trigger for going to Relate was when the husband found himself 'flirting with intent' with someone at the office. He didn't have an affair, but it made him realise that something needed to be done, and that his marriage was in trouble if he didn't.

Fast forward, and they have now been very happily married for over 25 years!

But - and it's a big but - there was never any lack of respect. Indeed, it was because of the respect he had for his wife (and his marriage) that he told her about it and they went to Relate.

Mirai makes a good point about the drinking OP. Is it a problem for you?

I also raised my eyebrows at the not respecting you comment. That's really hurtful. It made me wonder why you feel the need to be so over protective of him when he's actually not been very nice to you at all in all this.

Not respecting someone is a horrible thing to say - you can fall out of love with someone but still have respect for them, especially as you have a child together.

I do think the reality of life with a small child can be like a bomb going off in a relationship. It changes everything. Maybe he's just not coping as well as he thought he would?

So have you been on the trip to NYC and if so, was that before or after this bombshell?

It sounds to me like he's suffering from depression. When my husband particularly low with it he looks for things to blame it on, our relationship, his job etc. Does that sound familiar?

The respect thing is strange. Did he give a reason for that?

Do you often drink too much? Is that a regular problem?

I thought I recognised this story and I see that I commented on your similar thread a few weeks ago.

On which you said that you were due to go to NYC at the end of April and that your husband had got close to female colleague, was helping her to look for a flat, was working with her closely on a project and went out with her on his birthday, while working away from home.

If you've ruled out an affair (and I sincerely hope that's not just based on a belief that 'he's not the type' because there's no such thing) how does he explain having enough love for you in January to spring such a romantic birthday surprise and yet by April, he thought he wasn't in love with you?

What happened on the trip to NYC that you've just been on?

The respect thing is something that I understand - he's feeling overwhelmed and whilst he respects my ability as a mother, he maybe hasn't felt as supported as he needs. We haven't had a chance yet to discuss the respect thing, and he said it when he'd had a particularly shite day at work, where he wasn't being respected there. Also, maybe I haven't been as respectful as I could have been about his issues, so I can see where that was coming from. Yes, it hurts, but I don't want to demonise him for feeling that way. He's been my rock before when I've been struggling and perhaps he doesn't respect my ability to be there for him. I don't consider the respect comment to be the nail in the coffin of our relationship - he wouldn't be wanting to go to Relate and also be worried about me if there wasn't some vestige of respect left, I think.

As for the vodka - the kids were in bed, and I have family very close if the kids needed anyone. It was a one off, and I generally don't drink. I was having a bad day, and I do suffer terribly with PMT which can make me go a bit off the rails. Sometimes we all do things that on reflection aren't sensible, but I don't intend to make a habit of these crutches that I have used on occasion.

Maybe I do need to go to the docs and get something prescribed to help me through this. I have access to a separate counsellor than the Relate sessions, and she has given me some tools to help me cope.

Here - the kind of work he does is regional, and where we are, there aren't those kind of jobs - I wish that there were, but there aren't.

NYC came after the bombshell - it was generally a lovely time,although I did have a wobble on the one day, and he found that tough. We cuddled and talked at the end of it, but I guess it just adds to his feelings of being overwhelmed at times.

He is being honest with me, and he feels bad about that, as he knows how much it hurts me. But, we have to be honest to get through this, and to understand what has created this trouble.

The thing is that many people who have affairs are not the type and some have even spouted strong views about infidelity.

Also I have never ever seen a case on MN where the partner has said he/she has fallen out of love and yet has not met someone else

I really do hope its not the case here.

You do need to rule it out as until you can do this, dealing with the issues you have told us about will be very tough.

People have affairs because they have issues - stress, depression, work problems and so on.

The respect thing is another red flag

At relate will you be bringing up this friendship he has with this female colleague? Be aware that often men suggest counselling in order to look like the good guy who is trying hard - relate will not work if your H is not honest about what is really going on with him.

Sorry but all this feels horribly familiar

Ooh sorry Charbon but your last post made me uncomfortable - which read as if you wanted to 'fill the rest of us in' on the bits the OP hadn't talked about today, for whatever reason (which we don't know).

I don't like the thought of MNers looking up past posts to bring up in other ones, it doesn't seem very supportive or helpful.

charbon - the thought I was having about him helping someone out at work were unfounded. The whole project team went out for his birthday. He wasn't particularly close to her, it was just that he had mentioned a female name, and I'd latched onto that.That had happened way before Xmas, and it wasn't just him helping her out to view flats. I know that will be fuel to the fire to people who think he's straying, but it's just the kind of person he is - he felt for her, being in a foreign country, and she's gone back home now, as her contract as finished. Yes, I do believe him - I honestly don't think an affair is the issue here. There are no secretive behaviours that concern me, and I don't want to get sidetracked with something that really is not an issue. Yes, there always is the possibility that someone could be lying to you, but he's a crap liar - always has been! I think it was my past dealings with a complete arsehole that made me think the worst.

I do think depression could be a factor here - he just can't see the good in anything - apart from the kids - at the moment. He stresses about his family, my family and simple things that he could handle before are tougher on him.

He has been saying for a long time that he needs to see someone about his anger - he isn't violent or aggressive, he just gets irritable and blows up at work alot.

We have had to deal with alot of stuff in the past year - he's overloaded, and cannot see the good in anything.

I had to log onto a computer just to name change to reply to this ...
Op I could be your DH - well other than I'm a woman and not married to you - I'm stressed up to my eyeballs, I love but am not in love with my DH (the only think I'm in love with is half an hour peace to have a G&T and read my book - I would kill for that anything else is low down on my list), there is no way I'd have an affair (when on earth would I find the time or inclination). I am hoping beyond anything that once this period of stress passes then my family is still intact and back on track - my DH and I talk all the time about this but who knows

You know your DH, you've considered all options and you're now going to Relate. God there will be some home truths that come out - -this being a big one - and I suspect its a rocky road ahead but you are at least trying to work it out.

You both need to work on your own issues - including any drinking or AD even if just as a rare evening- as well as working together as a couple. And if part of that is ranting on here - then bloody well do it. Babies, jobs (esp self employed) and separation due to travel are all huge stress factors and sometimes you have to put a timeline on when these things can change - its rarely overnight. Keep the discussions pragmatic as well as emotional. Babies aren't babies for ever, what can he do to reduce travel or delegate to others in his company - all of these will help as well as obviously the big emotive discussions you need to have

I wish you luck

I think Charbon's last post is very relevant.

I suspect the reason why OP did not bring up the female colleague today is because she is trying to deny that this is an issue. The fact that she is angry with those who are suggesting an affair is revealing.

I didn't want to get distracted by my previous post - because I knew that it would be the assumption that he was having an affair.

I have been depressed/stressed and questioned my love for him in the past, yet it hasn't resulted in an affair. I have also had inappropriate feelings for someone in the course of our marriage, and didn't have an affair. Marital discourd, and questioning why you are with someone does not automatically lead to affairs.

OK, I wish you both luck in getting to the bottom of this.

Oh, here we go - just because I get angry about it, he must be having an affair!

The previous post was me spouting off - and at the start of this whole episode.

One of the reasons I married my husband was because he wasn't one of "those" men. He hated infidelity, he was loyal and trustworthy. I would sooner have bet my life savings than say he would cheat. 12 years later...

People jump to cheating conclusions on this board because every single time, without fail, that an OP comes on and says that their DH "loves them but isn't in love with them any more" , there is an OW. Some take longer to come out than others, but still...

I just wanted to add my support. I can't really advice but hope you get through this. Just a thought, could DH have PND?

ofcourseitsafuckingnamechange - thank-you!

You have summed up perfectly where my DH is at, and why he wouldn't dream of having an affair either.

Sorry that you are having a crap time too - but it's good to see that you value your marriage and see that these things happen and that sometimes things are shit, but trying to work them out is what a marriage/longterm partnership is all about.

I know that this is probably the biggest crisis we've ever had, but the fact that he's willing to try, and feels terrible about how he's made me feel, does give me the incentive to do my best.

At the end of the day, he is a good person.