How often do you row?

[CupOfBrownJoy]

I've been with DP 10 months and we're getting married in July. In my mind there is no question that the speed with which it has all happened has put me under a little bit of stress.

DP is generally very easy going, although saying that if something really gets to him he can sulk for ages. I'm the opposite, I'm quick to lose my rag but always very quick to get over it, and I will apologise if I feel I was unfair or overstepped the mark.

My ex and I never had an argument, until he turned round after 4 years and said he wanted us to split up. A total shock.

So, I kind of made a decision when I met DP that he was going to have me warts-and-all. By that I mean no pussyfooting around if he was pissing me off (which I did with my ex). However recently, and I'm sure because I'm feeling a bit stressed about life at the moment (wedding, we're ttc and I'm also moving jobs to be closer to him AND moving into his very small flat over his business, in which he works 18 hour days) I have turned into a raging, hormonal nightmare.

We're rowing a fair bit - nothing I would call serious, but its been most days this week and has ranged from his (incessant) smoking, him walking off from me mid sentence in the supermarket (I cried at that ), his untidyness, his insistence that I instruct a different tax advisor.... you name it, we seem to have fallen out about it.

What I want to ask is, is this normal? Is it ok to be rowing about this sort of stuff because we're "getting it into the open", or am I being the world's worst nag? Or is he a pain in the ass to live with (as I sometimes think)?

My parents row ALL the time and have been together 40 years, so maybe some couples just operate like this? At times though I think I'm turning into my DM though and that is obviously Not Good

So, how often do you row? Who causes the rows (mostly)? And what do you row about?

Thanks

I hope you have savings squirrelled away somewhere.

I do. The business is doing ok. We would have managed, but it wouldn't have been easy.

DP is a total optimist/dreamer. Its all "baby I love you we'll work something out". Bless him. I'm going to have to be the practical one...

I?m with mumblechum on the order of things. Live together for a few months before even considering marriage, and don?t even consider children until you?ve been married a while (it can sometimes change the dynamics of a relationship). Why the rush? Sloooow down. At 10 months you?re still getting to know each other. In 10 months with my DP we?ve only had one argument which only lasted a few minutes until we agreed to disagree and had a hug. I?d consider regular arguments/rows to mean we were crap at communicating, but I realise some people are ?happy? with that way of dealing with things.

I'm going to slow things down, definitely.

Tbh even just thinking about stopping ttc is a bit of a relief.

I'll speak to DP soon as, and see what he says... He's still working at the moment

Are you in the same room and he's texted you?

Cup, listen to Izzy, she knows what she's talking about and can express it so much better than me.

(pssst... flattery will get you everywhere, jif )

Dreamers can be wonderful companions but there are times when a gal needs a guy to get his head out of the clouds and get down to shouldering some of the rl chores/decisions/hassles that can so easily become an onerous burden if she has to be the 'practical one' in the relationship all of the time.

You've got more than enough to be going on with without the added stress of ttc - and, ironically, that particular added stress may be hindering your chances of success.

It's amazing how fast a tiny newborn grows and equally amazing how much space all of their necessary accountrements take up - and lack of physical space has put a gi-normous spanner in the works for many an otherwise happy couple.

Get yourself established in your new life and don't ttc again until you can see your way clear to being able to move to a larger flat/house either before or within a year of a pfb's arrival.

Seriously, your clock's got years to go before the final countdown and it's not at all uncommon for Western women to produce perfectly healthy pfbs after the age of 40.

If you give it at least a year and make sure he's stopped smoking and you've had a couple of months of daily B group vitamins and folic acid before you go for it, I suspect Santa will be dropping an extra present down your chimney come Christmas 2013...

,

a pfb's accoutrements take up space in a home - their accountrements create space in a wallet that is more commonly accustomed to being filled to overflowing...

You're only 34! Sorry, that's the first thing that comes to mind. The idea that if you stop TTC you're on the road to IVF, why do you think this?

It's important because so much of what you write seems based on avoiding worst case scenarios, but I don't think you're seeing these scenarios clearly.

I think it's perfectly possible to be getting married after 10 months. It seems less possible if at 10 months you are fighting all the time.

My DH and I went from first date to marriage within 15 months, and then a baby a year later. So I'm not necessarily opposed to rushing!

But there are soooo many red flags in what you write. I just don't see why you are rushing.

I also think you need to lay to rest the trauma of your last relationship. You seem to be saying: I tried to do everything right in my last relationship, but he still dumped me, so now I'm just going to do whatever I feel like.

I think my DH does love me 'warts and all' but that doesn't mean I don't modify my behaviour at all. Relationships are compromise, I bite my tongue when he leaves crumbs everywhere, he puts up with my cranky mornings.

You want to be loved 'warts and all' but that's not reciprocal is it? You hate his smoking, his long days, his tiny flat.

I'm not saying break up with him but for god's sake postpone the wedding and the TTC until you have a bit more serenity going on.

Thanks for all the advice. We had a big chat last night and we're going to stop ttc until maybe Christmas, or whenever we both feel ready.

dreamingbohemian your post really resonated. I can see that I'm the one who causes the rows - almost trying to control every little thing to somehow guard against it all "going wrong". But in doing that I'm absolute hell to live with. I feel almost like an abuser - I rant and rave and then I'm in floods of tears afterwards full of remorse. It must be exhausting for DP.

CuriousMama he was working/with customers. I tend to just sit on the laptop drinking tea if he's busy, so yes, he texted me as he was with the customers and couldn't really come over to chat.

I'm trying to get my head sorted. I need DP's help to do it though - lots of reassurance and a couple of compromises from him over clutter etc would help a lot.

Funny, I never felt "desperate for a baby" at all, but I think subconsciously part of me IS trying to play catch up to my friends/relations who are all just about married and having babies now. Silly as I know my relationship has its own plan, or agenda (that's not a very good way of putting it, sorry) and trying to fit it into someone else's template is bound to go wrong.

Thanks again everyone.

I'm glad you have some insight, my ex was a dreamer, lovely guy but when dc's came along it wasn't fun. Children are expensive and take up space and time and having someone who can provide for you & the baby is important as being a new mum can make you feel vulnerable (even if previously you had been a strong and capable woman).

Glad to hear you had a talk. Are you feeling better? I think for what it's worth you definitely have made the right decision to stop ttc for a while. I think you need to just have a chance to breathe and be if that makes sense. Nothing wrong with being a dreamer my dp is so long as he comes back to earth every now and then as a compromise and you make a leap of faith once in a while. I hope everything works out for you.

seems a lot of rowing and a lot of nagging each other.

Are you sure you want this relationship forever???

Thanks. I'm feeling a lot better. I said to DP that we just need to keep communicating.

We've been out for breakfast this morning and had another long chat - I feel like he's being understanding and supportive and I'm trying to keep my head baggage free!

Great news I'm glad you re feeling so much better and that he is being supportive. If you can just keep talking you should be fine

I broadly agree with Mumblechum, but I think the conversation about marriage and children should come before moving in together. If you're not looking for the same things from life, it's better to know before your lives are too entwined, so that you can decide if there's a compromise without having to deal with the total pain in the arse, practically and emotionally, that is splitting up when cohabiting.

It sounds like you're getting back on track now. Stopping ttc until things have calmed down seems very sensible. Weddings are stressful enough.

Hope you can keep communicating. Do keep in mind what's important to you, though - if his smoking and untidyiness will do your head in for as long as you're together, what seem like minor irritations could end up being the dealbreakers further down the line.

And "breathe" OP.

You're just trying to do too much at once aren't you. No wonder it's rather nightmare-ish.

No-one knows if a relationship will work or not, nothing in life comes with guarantees.

I've been with my DP for a few years now (not thinking of marrying until our kids are off our hands). We do have rows and the frequency depends on stresses that are around etc. at the time and learning to compromise/tweek things. But I can honestly say that I love him more all the time. For us things get sorted little by little and rowing seems to be our way of clearing the air in order to take stock and either make changes or adapt. I'm going through the menopause rather volatile and emotional and DP is a blokey/bloke but I know in my heart we'll be together for ever.

CupofBrownJoy

About the clothes pile....

For the first two years I nagged, for the next 5 years I stuck to pointed looks, for the last 12 it usually doesn't bother me anymore except for PMT related mandatory argument time....

Glad to hear this.

As part of my non-nagging rehab I've finally cleaned DP's flat and been to ikea to get a few "girly" bits to make the place look more cosy - ie so I'm more looking forward to living here too.

It now smells of pine instead of boy and (like some kind of cleaning maniac) I have got rid of some of my frustration and a calm has descended.

Bedroom and bathroom will be done tomorrow.

Cleaning-as-therapy seems to work. I can hire myself out by the hour if anyone wants?

and Katie that gives me hope, thanks

Dh and I have been married 23 years.Both of us had lots of rows in previous marriages-me because dh was very ill and got increasingly frustrated [MS] and I wasnt always as tolerant as I should have been and dh because his ex was very volatile,dissatisfied and having an affair.
Since we married we have had no major rows and maybe 3 or 4 [no more] minor ones.We always remember how destructive rows can be and each tries to step back and see the other's pov.It works for us.

Glad you had a good talk!

I really sympathise -- it's so easy to slip into bad habits just because you're subconsciously trying to protect yourself, or to avoid repeating past traumas.

It sounds like you are trying to make your DP and your life fit into an ideal that you have the clean flat, the non-smoking DP, marriage and baby and it's actually causing you a lot of anxiety and stress when reality doesn't match up to that ideal.

I really think slowing down a bit will help. You don't have to give up the ideal, just be a bit more patient! You still have time to ttc. Other things that you disagree on will probably fade as you spend more time together (DH and I used to bicker about cleaning when we first moved in together, now there's no issue at all.)

And just try to let go of your fears. Personally, I think you are rushing things a bit, but if you are really certain you want to go forward, then try to approach this relationship on its own terms, not in reaction to anything that's happened to you in the past.

Just a quick update, I don't know if anyone will read but...

nothing has changed since our talk. He has managed to make the bed once, this morning, because I told him that if he couldn't be arsed to make more effort around the house directly after I had basically threatened to call the whole thing off, then when WAS he going to start? He then made the bed while I was out.

Apart from that he hasn't lifted a finger, and he hasn't really been able to tell me anything that he IS prepared to do to help me feel more comfortable with the idea of marriage and moving in together this summer.

Added to that I have had a very illuminating chat with a friend of his, who has told me that DP was totally anti marriage and kids for the last 20 years. When I asked him what had changed with me, the friend admitted he thought it might be some kind of mid life crisis. He also backed up what I was finding about DP never being able to admit he's wrong, and being inflexible and unwilling to compromise. He said DP has a history of legging it away from difficult situations that he doesn't want to deal with. He is also concerned about DP's business (DP never lets on to me exactly what is going on money-wise, just says its all fine) and apparently important bills are going unpaid, and DP won't address this.

All in all, I'm seriously considering talking to him again tonight about postponing the wedding. I'm not sure how well I know him any more. I'm going home for a few days on Tuesday so it would be an ideal moment to speak to my parents about putting everything on hold.

Shit